Curse

Moloch Vein · Dec 06, 2008, 02:45 PM // 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

Yeah, it says that Luxons need to bring enchant removal. One copy of rend would have been enough to open a window to kill any npc you've protted up; two would have completely nullified you.

This is half-true (no, one Rend won't leave a window to kill an NPC. Two might. Pain of Disenchantment + Rend would.) However, more than that it isn't exactly a fair counterargument. The teams are what they are. If you say that "Luxons need to bring enchantment removal" I might just as easily say "Well, Kurzicks need to bring more monks."

The point I was making was that the format is horrible for the Luxons. As a monk, with a joke of a skill bar and around 400 hit points, I virtually couldn't be killed for ten straight games. I singlehandedly held off half a team. The points include:

* A healer on the Kurzick side can heal an NPC, without which the Luxons can not get into the fort, with zero risk for himself (if he knows how to do it.)

* A ranger can cap the amber shrines without even leaving the fort.

* If you die while defending Gunther, you resurrect with full HP and full energy and you will be back to defense (including running to Gunther) within ten seconds.

Arenanet needs to start implementing death penalty in FA, and the entire gate system needs to be reworked.

StormX · Dec 06, 2008, 07:16 PM // 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Servant of Kali

Reason why Luxons lose, is not #1 map imbalance, but for some reason a huge number of noobs, idiots, and scum.

It's true.

Now this:

is why the luxons always lose. The leeching and botting is going through the roof.

Daesu · Dec 06, 2008, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Yes, I know the luxons generally have half a team of leechers on a weekday night, but there is nothing we can do about it. The reporting system is very forgiving to leechers and punishes you if you report leechers too often, instead. I have since stop reporting leechers because the system punishes me and stop me from enjoying my own game even though I tried to do the right thing. Therefore, I decided to just exploit it to earn kurz factions instead since that is the most profitable step for me to take under the current game design.

If you report a leecher and you dont have 1/3 of your team to report the same leecher (since about half of your team are leechers anyway), then you get the SAME dishonor point as the person you reported. Even if the leecher bot gained enough dishonor points to be banned from the next game, all it needs is to wait 10 mins and it will be able to leech again. As a human player, 10mins of ban would probably discourage you from coming back to play that day.

The only way I can see for lux to win is a stroke of bad luck for the kurz. For example, if the kurz team doesn't have any monks and the lux happens to be good then sure, lux can win.

Nightow · Dec 06, 2008, 08:59 PM // 20:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by StormX

It's true.

Now this:

*snip*
is why the luxons always lose. The leeching and botting is going through the roof.

Doesn't help that morale is at an all time low for the Luxon side.

Daesu · Dec 06, 2008, 09:13 PM // 21:13

And all kurzicks need to do is to STALL FOR TIME! My Ranger was stopped from killing a siege turtle by a luxon monk but I cant kill both the monk and the siege turtle. So this went back and forth for about 5 mins, then I won.

Kurzicks dont even need to make a single kill to win while luxons need to. I like to run around Guntha when I notice a stupid luxon wammo decides that killing me is more important. Obviously kurz won that match too.

Phineas · Dec 07, 2008, 11:12 AM // 11:12

Went in a couple of times on the Kurz side today and had a player on our own side putting up Edge of Extinction outside the green gate...

Luxon saboteurs, me thinks.

House Silvermoon · Dec 07, 2008, 12:02 PM // 12:02

the luxons have a good advantage at aspenwood. the reason luxons lose is because their player base is crap not that the map is favoring kurzicks. if anything the map favors the luxons a bit more then the kurzicks.

Traveller · Dec 07, 2008, 12:13 PM // 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by House Silvermoon

the luxons have a good advantage at aspenwood. the reason luxons lose is because their player base is crap not that the map is favoring kurzicks. if anything the map favors the luxons a bit more then the kurzicks.

wat

Believe me, if the map objectives were the other way around, it would be this same discussion but only the sides reversed.

Servant of Kali · Dec 07, 2008, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Thing is, good players go to the side that is stronger. Why? Because they know which side is stronger and the take the advantage. From winner point of view, why not. Luxons have a lot of players who play Luxon side no matter what.. because their guild is Luxon perhaps. This means that quality on Luxon side can be lower.
Also, some players can go on luxon side for faction, and since they know how slim chances are of winning they just leech and not bother, or do C+space.

Occasionally, good players jump Luxon side for the fun of it, for challenge etc. Only then I believe, the Luxons can win. The average team of luxons cannot beat average team of Kurzicks, I highly doubt it.

But as I said, it's OK if map is slightly imbalanced, since Luxons can win in 5 min, so if it's somewhat imbalanced in Kurzick favor, it's still fair faction-wise, or reward-wise. But because of leechers and quitters it's totally imbalanced atm.

As I said in previous post - give me 8 active players on luxon side and I can do wonders. Well guess what, I went on luxon side again and told my team i will leech until they report me. So, 4 of them did report me (which is a lot for FA), and once I saw my team is good and active, I quickly joined em. We plowed through Kurzicks in 5 minutes. Literary, plowed. But by the amount of people who reported me I could easily see that my team consists of great players who do care about win, and who do want to win. And they really were great players.

Traveller · Dec 07, 2008, 05:05 PM // 17:05

I have NEVER EVER seen the turtle AI THIS retarded. I played a few matches and Aspenwood was simply terrible. Every match had at least 2 leechers - usually more - , bots, majority of healers and rangers on Kurzick side and even worse player behaviour than in the past.

Dear ANet. Can you please revert Aspenwood update, so that I could enjoy playing again?

Crom The Pale · Dec 07, 2008, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Defense has alway been easier than offence. The problem before was it took so long for the kurzick weapon to finish building up that eventually the Luxons just grinded away and won, mabye 70% of the time.

Now things have changed, its easy to stall for 5 min. Heck two monks can sit behind the green gate and keep it up for 5min without much of any difficulty.

Sure as a Luxon you can still make good faction even with a loss, but to increase your faction cap you must WIN here. I have tried several times of the last few days with 0 luck on every attempt. Some times we had leechers and a few times just crap players. However even with good players the Kurzicks always had 2 good monks at least one mesmer that knew exactly what he/she was doing and some smart rangers.

The best I managed in all of those attempts was to get 6 people past the green gate and drop Gunthar's HP to about 60% but the clock ran out so it was yet another loss.

ManaCraft · Dec 07, 2008, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Servant of Kali

But as I said, it's OK if map is slightly imbalanced, since Luxons can win in 5 min, so if it's somewhat imbalanced in Kurzick favor, it's still fair faction-wise, or reward-wise. But because of leechers and quitters it's totally imbalanced atm.

Pretty much my impression as well. Luxons mainly lose because of inactive players (ie leechers, bots, etc) and the unorganized nature of the map. A good luxon team can wipe the kurzicks in five minutes or less, and may pull off a win even with equally good opposition. But the odds of getting a good team when the draw is random are very slim indeed, especially with multiple components required.

The luxon side also seems to have a staggering amount of leechers and bots and less active players.

- Mana

upier · Dec 07, 2008, 10:52 PM // 22:52

1. Keep in mind that as a Luxon you are MUCH more dependent on your team then as a Kurzick. You load up a monk as a Kurzick and you're halfway to victory. As a Luxon - you're halfway to victory once the 8 random players on your team are actually good.
2. GW is designed for 2 to 3 monks to be able to keep a party of 8 alive. Aspy keeps the GW's REAL damage dealers behind closed doors AND with it's concept of killing NPCs you know exactly what target the enemy will go after.
Basically what this does is it pushes support characters into the damage role (which means that the party that should be bringing the best offense can not use that option!) and it brings the concept of aggro into PvP (just have the monk make a few steps back and he's safe while still being able to reach the target that EVERYONE is trying to kill).

I haven't been in Aspy in days and I used to consider it to be one of the best GW moments. It just doesn't work anymore.
It's a good thing I can now grind vanquishes - because that's more fun that Aspy.
Well ... in theory.
In reality - I don't do either. Both options are shit - vanquishing just stinks a bit less.

TheGuildWarsPenguin · Dec 08, 2008, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Traveller, your textmod makes it looks like one of the siege turtles and both commanders rage-quit. I wonder why...

Jaran Cell · Dec 08, 2008, 05:44 AM // 05:44

make the gate break if 50%< of the npc:s defending it is killed, makes bonding a single npc useless and forces the kurzick team to actually fight its opponents

AKB48 · Dec 08, 2008, 06:46 AM // 06:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luminarus

Anyone else think that Fort Aspenwood from the Luxon side is impossible? I have played like 10 rounds, and its simply impossible to break through to the inner sanctum and kill them in the time it now takes. (Maybe not impossible, but near enough). I know they buffed the rewards, but simply not being able to win is not balanced, in the slightest.

Are you kidding me? I lose plenty of times on the Kurz side to know that the Lux side CAN win and does win alot.

Just a note from the past**The Kurz side used to lose roughly 80% of the time and not a soul complaint now, when its somehow easier to win on the Kurz side ppl started to complain loud and clear.

upier · Dec 08, 2008, 07:49 AM // 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by AKB48

Are you kidding me? I lose plenty of times on the Kurz side to know that the Lux side CAN win and does win alot.

Just a note from the past**The Kurz side used to lose roughly 80% of the time and not a soul complaint now, when its somehow easier to win on the Kurz side ppl started to complain loud and clear.

Because back in the days people played it for fun.
Now they play it to win.

Still, what we have seen in the past was a sign that the map was always imbalanced. That should have been fixed and gotten rid of rather then replacing it with a new imbalance.

Traveller · Dec 08, 2008, 01:25 PM // 13:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGuildWarsPenguin

Traveller, your textmod makes it looks like one of the siege turtles and both commanders rage-quit. I wonder why...

"Greetings, brave Luxons, on this glorious day! Today we shall bring down the heinous weapon of Master Architecht Gunther - although it strangely seems to me that we've all been here before lots of times, call it deja vu or whatnot...

But to arms! Talk to me, Orange Commander, so I can send out the mighty turtle and warrior team to battle ... erm, Omg Pwn U, please refrain from drawing genitalia to the minimap, for it's meant for tactical purposes only ... yes, I believe you will pwn Kurdicks, as you so cleverly said, that's what we're all here for...

as I was saying, please talk to me... um.. why are you all running towards the fort? Only by talking to me can you send out the turtle ...

XX Naruto XX, is that Meteor Shower you are using? Surely it would be more feasible in the skill selection of a primary Elementalist... I don't mean to criticize, after all, I only have 5 skills of my own... "

Aurora Swiftarrow: OMG UR ALL NOOBS
*Aurora Swiftarrow has left the game*

"Erm, I agree that our current situation leaves something to be desired for, but if we just pull together... oh, speaking of that, Sirs Laff de Gumlane and Might Dwiller, I see you haven't moved an inch all through the battle, but I'm sure you'll join us any moment now..."

"No one still hasn't talked to me about the turtle team.. well, at least the purple side is engaging in battle ... but it seems they have met their match - a single ranger is keeping the whole team at bay between the inner and outer gates. I wish the warriors could do something else than just stand there, but alas, that's how we have always done it... um, Me Crush U, is that Mending you're using?

Okay, that's it! Günther, you can keep your GO RED ENGINE battle! I'm off to Jade Quarry!"

the_jos · Dec 08, 2008, 05:03 PM // 17:03

I've played a fair number of games on Luxon side there about 2 weeks ago and had about 50/50 success rate. Perhaps slightly less.
But when I look at how people play there on Luxon side I'm not surprised that they fail a lot. It's not like you can load any build and expect to win in Aspenwood. The area requires some tactics and because of the layout you might not be able to use your favorite build. If you play a couple of times you know the main problem areas. Counter them, it's not impossible. And as allways in random groups, you need some luck with the rest of the team.

T. Drake · Dec 08, 2008, 05:58 PM // 17:58

For some time now, I wonder why I must kill 3 NPC to make a gate fall.
Are they leaning against it, so it doesn't fall to pieces?

Why not make the gates attackable? They gain more health and armor, but are obviously not healable, etc. The only way the repair them is by running amber.

Since the decrease of the round time I feel that Kurzicks just ignore running amber completely (but attack the Luxon commanders more frequently, I rarely saw that before).

Further consideration:

Should a gate be repairable once it is destroyed?
This would come with a massive amount of health of course, so it doesn't get crushed by a simple Flare

p.s. Yes I play on both sides. This is not a lame excuse for loosing as a Luxon. My personal expierence is, that the win/loss ratio is balanced.