Curse

slowerpoke · Apr 09, 2009, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Skill balance should be done by committee, with both community appointed players and devs together. should be an open process and be free from conflict of interests. but all thats a different topic.

dts720666 · Apr 09, 2009, 02:56 PM // 14:56

I guess I'll go against the negative feedback flow here, and say that I am thrilled about this update, and I am even more thrilled about no skill update. Thank you ANet! I have too many character slots taken up by mules. Maybe I'm just a packrat, but I need a storage update. So I, for one, am happy and pleased at the current direction and balance of the game.

I do hope the HoM update will still be included...

Sweet Mystery · Apr 09, 2009, 02:58 PM // 14:58

Simple idea.... lets just stop demanding Anet do this and that and let them decide what to do? PvPers cry our for PvE nerfs... PVEers scream at PvPers for getting things nerfed nowt to do with them.

Hell we're lucky Anet even change a thing in the game... they don't have to..... they have the money and that is all they need.

I await GW2 but I don't care Joe Bloggs can do UWSC with CoP or anything... why do others? Because they want things done for their own benefit.

Can any person honestly say that they care about a skill balance in a skill they don't use/abuse ? I doubt it. As soon as they want a skill changed for their benefit they cry out all over and even more when one is balanced they can't abuse no more...

I'd say abandon all skill updates from now on... learn to live I say.

dts720666 · Apr 09, 2009, 02:59 PM // 14:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morgan Crowe

I'd pay a monthly fee for getting balanceupdates every week, tournies like the celestial tournament and stuff...

I wouldn't. I guess that most people who play GW play because there is no monthly fee.

upier · Apr 09, 2009, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regina Buenaobra

We want the update to be a high quality experience you can fully enjoy, so we are dedicating a lot of time to testing it. With a game as complex as Guild Wars and an update as significant as this one, very thorough testing is required.

Wow, that's new!
It's nice to hear you guys learned from mistakes made in the past!
*thumbs up*

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Mystery

Hell we're lucky Anet even change a thing in the game... they don't have to..... they have the money and that is all they need.

Personally, I view the changes as A.Net being unhappy with a sucky product.
Once they stop changing things - they either achieved perfection or they are happy with having a sucky product.
Perfect, the game at this point in time, it is not.

fb2000 · Apr 09, 2009, 03:23 PM // 15:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by dts720666

I wouldn't. I guess that most people who play GW play because there is no monthly fee.

Not really, if I didnt want to pay a monthly fee I might as well not play any MMORPG right?

Tullzinski · Apr 09, 2009, 03:25 PM // 15:25

I am sick and tired of ANET informing us about anything, making any kind of updates or skill changes, providing new content, addressing our concerns and problems and giving us more stuff for free. Quit it ANET right now!!! I have had it and just to spite you I am going to play your game!!! HAHAHA! that will teach you!

daraaksii · Apr 09, 2009, 03:26 PM // 15:26

GW is one of the CORPGs that serves the PvE players more then the PvPers.

I see.

Coverticus · Apr 09, 2009, 03:35 PM // 15:35

The whining going on in this thread is nuts - oh no skill update for a month....

Just stop and think for a second - this major update has been promised for months. Any idea what it is like to develop these changes, test them and make the update scripts (and test these) ready for a deadline? It can be a nightmare.

Anything database and server/client related HAS to be thoroughly tested, especially of the likes we are going to get today. People think "oh its only a couple of changes". While it may seem like that, the actual changes can have knock on effects to a variety of other areas. So, when releasing a major update to a game, system or the likes, you don't want to be adding further complications into the mix. Like a skill update.

In all honesty, I was expecting either skills or the actual update being postponed - we were never realistically going to get both together. I'm glad they are releasing the major update, this is something that has been needed for a long time in the game. And hats off to Regina and Anet Devs for coming clean early and stating what is happening.

Being a developer can be a very tough job indeed, especially when you have a minimal team because of company restrictions and newer projects (i.e. GW2). So please, give them a break. They are trying their best.

jazilla · Apr 09, 2009, 03:50 PM // 15:50

Since the Update to The Hall of Monuments was announced back in June of '08(I would give a link Regina, but you work at Anet so you know this is true) I am expecting something grandiose with this build. I am expecting game shattering here. It's been almost 10 months since that announcement. Throw us something to tide us over til that build comes out please. While you are at it, can you fix the Tyrian drops? I am sick of getting golds that look like this example: Req. 10 Fire, 19% HCT Divine Favor 20% HSR of Earth magic, +1(20%) Curses. Make farming in Tyria and Cantha fun again by making all of the weapon skins Inscribable.

Alleji · Apr 09, 2009, 03:54 PM // 15:54

They probably wouldn't fix LC and PnH anyway, so meh. Looking forward to see if any of the PvE goodness in the "big update" applies to me.

Killed u man · Apr 09, 2009, 03:58 PM // 15:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regina Buenaobra

We just want to give you a quick heads-up.

We know that you are expecting some skill balance updates for the past 6 months.

We are unaware that some of you will not be happy to hear this, as then we would actually not spend 25 days bathing in the sun, and then the last 4 days, actually throw together a skill update

As you are aware, we are still holding op the excuse that we are working very hard. And of course, big updates need a lot of testing and resources. (This is the one that that reall is straight to the point)

We want the update to be a high quality experience you can fully enjoy, so we are dedicating a lot of time to testing it.Every addition or change has the potential to affect other areas of the game, sometimes in unexpected ways.
But that has NEVER stopped you from releasing updates before? If you care as much as you do about your community, than why havn't some REAL ISSUES been adressed yet, such as the way-below-average quality of the /report function, or the RA-bots, or the increasing problems in PvP that keep piling up? GvG-Ladder abuse for champ farming being one of them, Heroes Ascent being another one, one that has been dragging on for about... 2 years now...

Skill changes also need to be fully tested, so we were running into a situation where we risked releasing either the skill balance or the April update itself without the level of polish, consideration, and testing that it should have. I can hardly the believe with the small amount of content you guys release (No offence, I'm happy with ANY form of content, after all GW is still Free2Play) there will need for much testing. As you said yourself, skill balance is the biggest time-consumer, yet wasn't the intire PvE/PvP split the point to avoid these issues? Even so, is there ANY staff member that even plays GW? I can name you 10 people, off the bat, of which if you name them a proposed skill-change, they can IMMEDIATLY say in which PvP-Format/PvE-Area it will get abused, and in what context (build), me being one of them.

We apologize, yet again, for the inconvenience, and we hope that you understand the reasoning behind this decision. We did the first 15 times you post-poned a skill update, but now it's just getting to inconvient. There is only so many bullets you can shoot through our knees...

I know it's just your job, and I'm not bitching at you or anything, but I took the liberty to take out the bullshit, and shorten it up a bit.

I've also added some comments on the side, criticising on the yet again, same old lame excuses...

Small note on the skill balance testing:

As I said, I find it hard to believe that much testing needs to go into the skill updates. Face it, they suck anyways (Sorry for the hard use of words, but it's the truth), so you might aswell give us quantity instead of quality, as the latter has not been seen more then 3-4 times in GW-Skill-Update history.

And again, is there ANYONE in the staff that has extensive PvE-PvP experience? Because the more excuses I read (I know, it's simply your job to take over the message, but I'm directing this towards the skill balance team), the more I get the feeling these skill balancers have NO clue what GvG, OR HA even is. I'm pretty sure they are still under the illusion people form Cry-Way teams in Heroes Ascent.

The problem here is simple:

The skill update is below amount of quantity asked by the community, it's FAR BELOW the standard of quality and it simply takes WAY TO LONG to react to PvP-problems. PvE is "dead", it doesn't matter as much if overpowered stuff gets abused (SF, RoJ, Cry, ursan, etc), but PvP is the "alive" part of GW. If the balance is bad, the game isn't fun for 1 side of the match (The one not abusing gimmick/borderline exploit trash builds), and people will quit. People have quit to proove this.

The solution is simple, yet Anet refuses to react in a proper way:

Player made/voted skill updates. Aside from the usual, sometimes amusing, dartbord buffs/nerfs, allow the community to update/balance skills aswel.
Either have an in-game feature, such as Xunlai Tournament House, or use the official Guild-Wiki with promotion in game to allow players to propose skill updates.

Heck, for all I care, "hire" costless "player"-skill balancers, people who know the game, or the format they play like the back of their thumb. Restrictions will have to be made (Such as they can't join mATs), and there will be small amounts of abuse, (People "paying" to suggest skill updates to these player skill updaters) but it's not like that already isn't the case: [ dR], [rawr], ... have more than once abused Izzy's personal skill-balance forums for personal guild-benefits. Most known being the famous skill update a week before the mAT, in which [ dR] finally got their gold-cape.

Orange Milk · Apr 09, 2009, 04:03 PM // 16:03

I'm sure the delay is because they are still coding the 4th year BDay Mini Pets.

Because as we all know, Mini Pets are the "Be all/End All" of this game.

Pardon me but I really do not understand the need for this announcement Regina. NO where anywhere has it ever been stated that the "SUPER LEET APRIL BUILD" will be on april 9th. Sure the typicall Skill balance is done at the begining of the month but it has also never been said that a skill balance WILL happen EVERY month.

I think if you had not made this announcement at all everyone would continue to assume that the will be 1 big update later this month.

Though I guess when you do come back and say "no skill update at all in April" you kind of rake yourself over the coals.

IMO RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO the 4th yr minis, ALL mini's are a WASTE of dev time and server storage space. Balance the skills, fix the HA maps so anhilation is not the object of the first 3 maps. Also make TA viable.

Sadly none of those suggestions seem to of any relavance to ANet.

Great Defiance · Apr 09, 2009, 04:05 PM // 16:05

hi, I am not very active person on this thread however I have been playing guild wars for 3 years now and I have an idea for an update I know that me and many other people would love to see. In my time of playing guild wars I have made some terrible looking characters, and have even gone through the trouble of starting over because of it, perhaps you could make some sort of NPC that allows you to change the appearance and even the sex of your character? However dont make it free, have it similar to the Guild Emblemer but instead you change your characters visual appearance for a price. I personally would pay up to 50k just to change some of my characters, and it would save starting over on a character just because it is ugly. Another request which Im sure applies to many other people as well is having the ability to change your characters name. I started playing guild wars when I was 13 and Im now 16 years old, and my oldest characters have some very childish and rubbish names, perhaps you could also release a name changing NPC. My final request, is that of Tyrian character creation. It has been many years since the release of guild wars prophecies and the hairstyles, colours, faces and skin tones are very minimal and dull. Perhaps you could add a slightly larger range of skin tones, faces, hairystyles and hair colours to the prophecies character creation. It doesnt seem fair that factions and nightfall get such a varied selection in most of these and prophecies stays the same, dull and basic. I hope you consider my requests for they are all things im sure a large proportion of guild wars players would love to see. Thankyou for reading

Another Felldspar · Apr 09, 2009, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

For all of you newbloods out there, skill balances actually make the game more interesting.

Huge skill rebalances, especially ones that fundamentally change a meta (LoD to WoH comes to mind) normally make the game more interesting.

Hmmmm.... I am a (mostly) PvE player and I very much agree with part of what you are saying here. I love skill updates. It was worrisome to me when they started separating some of the PvE skills from PvP skills simply because I enjoyed adapting and playing with the changes to the skills even in PvE. They make the game more interesting. I just see no reason to be insulting to others while making your own, very valid, point.

If there are going to be new red dots to eliminate -- red dots that we have never seen before -- then waiting for the next skill update isn't that big of a deal. MOX was interesting; even though they used the same areas/backdrops/scenery there were new monsters and quests to enjoy, and that was great. I'd take more of that. I'd take a Lyssa's realm with new quests built entirely within an existing zone, under the lore that she is the Goddess of Illusion and once given true-sight the players can see more of what is what is really there.

Giving me either skill update or content update is enough to keep me interested. Storage update isn't all that great to me personally, but they've said over and over again that HOM changes and Storage is just small parts of what they have in the works. Let's see what they roll out before the bitch-fest starts.

Falling Petal · Apr 09, 2009, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Great Defiance

perhaps you could make some sort of NPC that allows you to change the appearance and even the sex of your character?

It's something that has been talked about before, most recently here.

coil · Apr 09, 2009, 04:47 PM // 16:47

this was such a good game 4 years ago

]HM[ Sabre Wolf · Apr 09, 2009, 04:48 PM // 16:48

Hey Regina, I think everyone, even most PvPers, are looking for the BIG update with the storage and HoM then anything else... if you cant do skill update, you cant do one... its not gonna hurt anything... I am sure everyone understands... the ones that give a hard time are the ones just flaming and dont care about the game anyways, so dont worrie about it. People who truely care about this game will not mind a pass on a skill update. I wasn't looking for one anyways since the current meta is still being tweaked...

Regina Buenaobra · Apr 09, 2009, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by wetwillyhip

actually if you read regina and lindsey's journal pages, they talk about the excitement that is going around the office for the update and saying to us that they are putting in so much work and both think we will like it. have you checked out the wiki talk pages for both of them? I see it on discussion topics regarding the April update.

When someone asked me whether they would like the update, or whether the update would be "worth waiting for" I told them that they would have to decide for themselves. I can't decide for players what value to place on the update. It depends on what people personally consider worthwhile and valuable. Just look at the different responses on the forums here. Not everyone has the same feeling about the information in the OP.

For me personally, yes I like the stuff in the upcoming content update. But I'm not going to make up your mind for you on whether you should like it or not. I do think that there is a lot in it that many players will be excited about, but at the end of the day, different people will have different reactions.

niek2004 · Apr 09, 2009, 04:55 PM // 16:55

I really hope the will make a separate skill balance update, because another MAT with Lingering, WE and P&H will be retarded.