Curse

Loot Junkie · Jul 04, 2009, 12:55 AM // 00:55

Everybody has their own perspective on the way this game should be, after playing this game 4+ years here is mine, and yes, this longwinded post is related to the OP's topic:

I absolutely hate that perfect items are so easy to farm up in this game, green and gold weapons in particular. You see, back in the day when chests didn't need a key or lockpick, you could play just about anywhere in the game except low level areas, get a purple or gold drop, then head to LA and sell the item. This to me was fun, it added to the "treasure hunt factor" of the game, knowing that no matter what you were doing you might get a drop worth talking about with your guildies (hey guys, i was doing the Bloodstone mission and i got a +30 sword pommel!!!). Its the same as when you get a black dye drop ANYWHERE in the game, it's awesome because you weren't expecting it. Then anet came out with the locked chests which always spit out a purple or gold item, it was at this time that I first heard the expression "merch food". Not long after that we got Sorrow's Furnace and PvE Tombs, which for the first time injected perfect green weapons into the economy.

For me this ended alot of the fun to this game. Because everything in this game is so damn easy to get, it makes most areas of the game absolutely mundane. How many times do you go vanquishing with the expectation that you might get an awesome drop along the way? This is why i don't mind the keg nerf. You should not be able to go and farm 30-40 gold(supposedly rare) items in an hour, even if they aren't the fanciest of skins. It was getting to the point that I was having a hard time selling 7 gold unid's for 4k in spamadan. While keg farming is definitely not the only thing wrong with this game, it is a step in the right direction. I'm surprised it took them this long to get around to it.

Regulus X · Jul 04, 2009, 03:37 AM // 03:37

I say just nerf farming in general (55, 130, 600, SF, etc.), make all skills in-game cost 25 energy and have 90 second recharge to weed out all of the player's interest, eventually emptying out the servers in an attempt at mass shut-down. This way they don't have to pay for it's upkeep any longer! =P That'd be a step in the right direction.

Pull the plug, Anet!

Coney · Jul 04, 2009, 03:45 AM // 03:45

Gotta hijack this thread. It's soo preposterous (READ: LAME) to nerf PvE skills because of PvP. But last patcfh, they were toooooooooooooo lazy to separate the two, so here were are.

It's more than pointless to nerf PvE, other than the Mesmer PvE skill CoP which was way OP. Other than that, it was just laziness on their part.

No need to nerf at this point, unless it's an OP build (CoP).

FoxBat · Jul 04, 2009, 04:06 AM // 04:06

Shadow Form is on the hitlist, stop bringing that up as a point of comparison.

themanj · Jul 04, 2009, 04:21 AM // 04:21

if all ur doing in this game is farming....go play another game. i have played this game since released and quit before nightfall because of ppl telling me this game was 'dead' and it 'sucked'.

after playing many other games, some competitively, some not, i have come to the conclusion that this is the best game for pvp ever.

even in its broken state its much better than alternatives

lol farming

MithranArkanere · Jul 04, 2009, 05:38 AM // 05:38

They are not against farming. There is nothing wrong with farming.

Problem comes when things are too fast, and/or done exclusively with a few professions.

One character killing a some monsters in 5..10 minutes is not a problem. Killing them in less than one is a problem. 8 characters of 3 professions clearing an entire area meant to be done in more than one hour and a half in 15 minutes is a problem.

IronSheik · Jul 04, 2009, 06:01 AM // 06:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

Hey, it's not my fault it's dying. It's a simple fact. And I'm not saying keg farming isn't still doable, it just makes me wonder why it was nerfed in the first place since so many people did it. If that's not how the game was meant to be played, why did they put Budger in then?

They nerfed it because....so many people did it. And the fact you only needed 3 skills to solo what was it....60 monsters in a little over a minute without getting so much as touched?

And I will tell you right now, budger wasn't put in to spam kegs for 'easy golds'
Why do you think HoS budger was nerfed? Why was SF budger made non spammable? Because you aren't supposed to kill shit that fast with no effort.

Still wondering?

Trader of Secrets · Jul 04, 2009, 07:02 AM // 07:02

Yea this is simplying arguing for easy moneymaking. Certain runs have been nerfed cuz of abuse, like the old HoS run also with the fast kegs. Permas are alrdy quite good enough to make your game income or try a 600 monk who can run almost every dungeon. Easy income still exists and just be lucky that Anet decided to keep them around.

lambda the great · Jul 04, 2009, 10:07 AM // 10:07

kill SF bring some skill back to the game.

the Puppeteer · Jul 05, 2009, 12:31 AM // 00:31

after a nerf they have a beer fest while reading the QQ comments here on the forum

Swift Thief · Jul 05, 2009, 01:18 AM // 01:18

Dude.. You know they buff more than they nerf. Also, keg farming was a retarded gimmick and I'm glad that it got nerfed.

Kendel · Jul 05, 2009, 01:22 AM // 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coney

Gotta hijack this thread. It's soo preposterous (READ: LAME) to nerf PvE skills because of PvP. But last patcfh, they were toooooooooooooo lazy to separate the two, so here were are.

It's more than pointless to nerf PvE, other than the Mesmer PvE skill CoP which was way OP. Other than that, it was just laziness on their part.

No need to nerf at this point, unless it's an OP build (CoP).

Hang on let me remove that veil of ignorance from in front of your eyes.

600/Smite.
Permasins.

The only people who don't think these should be nerfed are farmers, as such we shouldn't give a toss what they want because all they care about is themselves. Perma has become a vital component of speed runs and 600 can just duo practically everything.

They should've been nerfed from the very beginning instead of pussy footing around them like the idiots they are. All it achieved was leaving general PvE in the state its in, a complete RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing mess. When they eventually do nerf Shadow Form they either won't do it properly for fear of whining/ragequitting or they may actually grow a pair and completely stop it. Sadly my moneys on the former.

60s Recharge, this skill is disabled for 60 seconds plx.

BuD · Jul 05, 2009, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Permasin has been around longer than Ursan was. Im kinda curious why Anet would nerf pug groups (Ursan) & let the Permasins run rampant SC'ing almost everything in sight.

Why isnt there an outcry from the "community" that Permasins are ruining the game like they did for Ursan? I dont see a year long thread dedicated to permasins, or all those cool avatars with text over the SF Skill sayin "Abuse Me" etc.

Maybe Ursan was overpowered, it did bring Pugs back & got rid of most class discriminiation.

As far as the Ursan button mashing claim goes, isnt all that this game is....button mashing??? Weather its Ursan, Permasin, Terra Tank Ele, COP, all buttons must be mashed at one time or another, & theyre just as repetitive as Ursan button mashing.

Bug John · Jul 05, 2009, 01:29 PM // 13:29

there are some things Anet should consider for GW2, if they don't want to see complaints everywhere :

- nerf things immediately :

people are disappointed because keg farming has been used for months, I'm not saying it was not an exploit that had to be solved, but it had to be solved immediately

you give us things that may be too good to be balanced, leave then for one year, then nerf them, this is totally stupid

this applies to pvp too, it always took Izzy more than 3 months to solve problems in pvp meta, sometimes more, with many failed attempts, until he finally considers listening to what everybody is asking for, look what he did with soul reaping

- consider doing reasonable buffs :

try to offer new alternatives without introducing overpowered skills to replace those who got smiter's boon-ed

some skills got buffed correctly, but that's far from being the majority

- fire Izzy :

this guy fails at his job, and now he's going to screw both GW2 economy and balance before the release

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendel

The only people who don't think these should be nerfed are farmers, as such we shouldn't give a toss what they want because all they care about is themselves. Perma has become a vital component of speed runs and 600 can just duo practically everything.

the only place where you'll ever see a perma or a 600 is an outpost (if you're not a farmer, or don't group with them)

so, what's your problem with them ?

you can't afford this expensive fow armor or a q9 crystalline blade ?

let farmers farm, they have no influence on your gameplay

and enjoy the game the way you want, instead of telling others how they should do it

draxynnic · Jul 05, 2009, 01:53 PM // 13:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

I think the more curious issue is that people actually bother to make money in this game.

Apparently, a lot of people spend 8+ hours a day doing a monotonous activity for money ... and then come home and spend another 3~4 hours a day doing a monotonous activity for ... not money. Perhaps I'm odd, but I fail to see the appeal.

Oh, well said.

I've gained about 150K a month since the April update in fairly casual play and with no farming whatsoever (unless you count doing a zbounty with 10 characters, and I've only done that a handful of times - normally I do a zquest or zbounty once or twice if at all), and not including any gains for the XTH (and I didn't get any points for May, btw), nor the value of materials and other commodities I've accumulated. Maybe it's not great heaping piles of ecto, but... don't tell me that farming is the only way to earn income.

upier: Sorry, but to be perfectly honest I do think sometimes that maybe the Ritualist spirits are just a little too fast now. Obviously they were too slow before, but...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lycan X

As far as the Ursan button mashing claim goes, isnt all that this game is....button mashing??? Weather its Ursan, Permasin, Terra Tank Ele, COP, all buttons must be mashed at one time or another, & theyre just as repetitive as Ursan button mashing.

Try that with a Mesmer and see how far that takes you.

(And that's just the first thing that came to my head. Lots of builds require more finesse than activating skills indiscriminately on recharge, which is what I at least think of when I hear the term 'button-mashing')

Red Sonya · Jul 05, 2009, 01:59 PM // 13:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

Sorry, just had to have that as my title.

In all seriousness, I'm sure everyone has noticed the nerfs ANet does, and some people say certain skills need nerfed or buffed.

My question is, with the game slowly dying and no information on Guild Wars 2, why does ANet nerf things people enjoy doing? Example: keg farming. It was a good means of income, which is pretty much needed with the XTH broken now, and it got nerfed. That was something that people actually enjoyed doing since there was nothing else for them to do after beating all campaigns multiple times. You can only do that so much before you fall asleep in the process.

I know there are other nerfs, like apparantly the Tombs used to be great for trapper rangers but that got nerfed so now it's all perma sins. Why does ANet insist on nerfing things that people enjoy?

It seems to me things that people enjoy doing should be left as is, as it gives them something to do while waiting for GW2. Which, while we're on that subject, here's another question - is this ANet or 3D Realms? We've had no information on GW2, just like no information on Duke Nukem Forever. I hope GW2 doesn't take "forever" to come out.

But anyway, this is NOT a QQ thread, it's simply an inquiry. Why do you think things that people enjoy doing the most are what gets nerfed, and how do you feel about it? And if you think it's because the game is too easy without nerfs, then go play a different game and don't ruin it for the ones of us that enjoy it as is.

OiC you are banned awwwww? Oh well I'll answer you anyways. It's really pretty simple as over farming leads to over inflation. Over inflation leads to higher prices for goods people want and those that DO NOT FARM like SOME players will never be able to aquire them. Except for buying gold online for real life dollars and Anet/NCsoft wants to stop that.

Over farming and inflation eventually would lead to EVERYONE having to FARM just to keep up. People don't like to have to do what everyone else is doing, but, in fairness regular farming for a few ounces of gold is much better than someone making 100k an hour on some easy keg farm run or UW shard/ecto easy farm run.

In other words if Anet/NCsoft doesn't curb the OVER FARMING and make gaining gold for EVERYONE at a more reasonable and equal basis of gain and spend then the GOLD FARMALOT FARMERS are the ones who CASH in. So they must take control of the balance of income and spend or they become the contributors of GOLD SELLING online.

You have to remember it is NOT About Individual fun it is about fun for the whole, everyone not just selfish you.

Bug John · Jul 05, 2009, 10:20 PM // 22:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Sonya

OiC you are banned awwwww? Oh well I'll answer you anyways. It's really pretty simple as over farming leads to over inflation. Over inflation leads to higher prices for goods people want and those that DO NOT FARM like SOME players will never be able to aquire them. Except for buying gold online for real life dollars and Anet/NCsoft wants to stop that.

Over farming and inflation eventually would lead to EVERYONE having to FARM just to keep up. People don't like to have to do what everyone else is doing, but, in fairness regular farming for a few ounces of gold is much better than someone making 100k an hour on some easy keg farm run or UW shard/ecto easy farm run.

In other words if Anet/NCsoft doesn't curb the OVER FARMING and make gaining gold for EVERYONE at a more reasonable and equal basis of gain and spend then the GOLD FARMALOT FARMERS are the ones who CASH in. So they must take control of the balance of income and spend or they become the contributors of GOLD SELLING online.

You have to remember it is NOT About Individual fun it is about fun for the whole, everyone not just selfish you.

you're completely forgetting that farmers bring a higher supply of rare items in the economy, which tends to lower the prices

btw, people who play more and more efficiently will have more money, that's fair and logic

there are very few things in GW that are out of reach for the casual player nowadays, and very very few for a somewhat dedicated player (unded asian minis or old school low req weapons, things that cannot be obtained anymore), so instead of being envious, be happy, you can obtain anything you want in GW

White_Chaos · Jul 05, 2009, 11:01 PM // 23:01

Yeah they killed Urgoz
before it was a nice place to team up with pugs and kill the mean boss, now after the roj nerf nobody is there exept maybe a guild group passing throu

I hate farming factions with VQ -ing alone!

Bryant Again · Jul 05, 2009, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Disclaimer, yo: This poster agrees with the "nerfing" (i.e. balancing) of the game, just if you thought that I was ticked of them nerfing farming runs and whatnot.

What I do have a problem with though is the method to ANet's madness, and I'm upset in the sense that there isn't one. This is largely due to - you guessed it - permasins, and ANet's largely open feelings about them. This is confusing while on the same note they'll attempt to balance SoH, so it's pretty upsetting seeing how they do this process.

In direct reply to the op (why you banned D: ?), nerfing is used for two main things: 1. attempting to maintain variety (this goes hand in hand with buffing), and 2. keeping the game on the road the developer's intended, and what the road looks like is what we have *zero* clue about.

Loot Junkie · Jul 06, 2009, 01:02 AM // 01:02

If SF gives you immunity to both attacks and spells with no movement penalty, then why does Obs Flesh have the movement penalty when you can still get hit by attacks? This never made sense to me after SF became perma-able. For those comparing SF to ursan I'm sorry but it still takes skill to accomplish nice smooth UWSC's. With ursan you could roll an orange back and forth over the kb and get kills