Curse

the_jos · Oct 09, 2007, 11:32 AM // 11:32

Quote:

ALL THE FREAKING WARRIOR HENCHMEN USE CHARGE AS THEIR GOD DAMN ELITE.

I already mentioned that a buff to the hench (specially HM) would be nice and in some cases even a must.
And I don't oppose at all to that, I'd even help thinking about better builds if someone asks me.

Quote:

How about just one more hero? I don't see how that would hurt grouping any further, and it would add much more flexibility.

I Would not mind that at all and do see added value without hurting teaming too much.

spiritofdead · Oct 09, 2007, 12:33 PM // 12:33

I highly doubt Anet will pay any attention on this matter since they had decided not to increase the number of heroes quite a while ago already. It is too bad they did not allow people to bring more than 3 heroes in the group though.

zwei2stein · Oct 09, 2007, 02:02 PM // 14:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

...because I like to play my own builds and play GW the way I want to play it...

Kinda ironic from someone who uses textbook SF build (minus one skill).

Bryant Again · Oct 09, 2007, 02:07 PM // 14:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

Kinda ironic from someone who uses textbook SF build (minus one skill).

Called out!

As I've said before, I think it's just too unpredictable what will happen with 7 hero slots. Will it hurt pugging or do nothing to it? Will it encourage people to solo, or would people still dismiss the AI as "retardedlol" and still go with pugs? Can't tell, and that to me is possibly the best reason I can come up for not having any.

Longasc · Oct 09, 2007, 02:15 PM // 14:15

It is unlikely that ANet will do much for GW1 anymore at all.

They decided against 7 heroes, and there are many open issues that will not be taken care of besides this one. Some feel very strongly about this issue, but this debate is going on for so long by now that ANet does not care about it anymore.

They could implement it easily, maybe not flags for hero no. 4-7, but they could. They just won't, for design reasons and because they already decided against 7 hero teams. People already explained their possible reasons for this.

Some people want 7 heroes, others are against it, most are indifferent. But does anybody believe ANet will really DO something about it, now that they play the "all devs are working hard on GW2 card" for almost all suggestions?

There is almost no chance that 7 player hero parties are going to happen.

bhavv · Oct 09, 2007, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

Kinda ironic from someone who uses textbook SF build (minus one skill).

Read:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10200208

I play every elly bar thinkable. SF is just great, doesnt mean I cant play anything else.

When doing gaurdian of elona I was E/Rt healing in at least half of the missions, and Playing warder and water in a few (Water snarer for the listen to dunkoro mission, Ward against ham and stability warder vs tortureweb dryders, Geo spiker with Obi flame, Energy Blast, Magnetic surge vs abbadon for armor ignoring damage etc etc....). I finished Gaurdian of Elona in 3 days with the help of a guildie with full unlocks and equipped heroes like me XD.

SF is just standard in NM though cos I like playing it. Whats wrong with that? Would it be any better if I just blacked my skill bar out in paint?

Torino Cowell · Oct 09, 2007, 02:58 PM // 14:58

7 heroes? i don't think so , 3 heroes is enough , otherwise that just takes the point out of henchman and the balence won't be right for the other guild wars. this would also discourage people from starting with the other 2 guild wars , but going to NF instead . this should not happen

Bryant Again · Oct 09, 2007, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torino Cowell

this would also discourage people from starting with the other 2 guild wars , but going to NF instead .

That'd probably be a good thing in ANet's book since NF costs more than the other two : )

bhavv · Oct 09, 2007, 03:39 PM // 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torino Cowell

7 heroes? i don't think so , 3 heroes is enough , otherwise that just takes the point out of henchman and the balence won't be right for the other guild wars. this would also discourage people from starting with the other 2 guild wars , but going to NF instead . this should not happen

Henchmen have no point, they are retarded. This would encourage people from playing the other GW because they will have 7 heroes to use in them after buying NF.

Anyway, who cares if no one ever lets mhenlo in their team anymore? Its not exactly the end of GW, it doesnt cause any imbalance if player X decides to solo the game with heroes instead of henchmen.

Zahr Dalsk · Oct 09, 2007, 03:50 PM // 15:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_jos

I Would not mind that at all and do see added value without hurting teaming too much.

Adding seven heroes will not hurt teaming. Those of us who play H/H are not going to play with PUGs either way. (And if AI were fully disabled we simply would not play.)

Most people who play with PUGs already think that their fellow PUG members are already better than AI, and they will go on living in ignorance of the fact that heroes are better than the vast majority of players.

the_jos · Oct 09, 2007, 04:38 PM // 16:38

Quote:

or would people still dismiss the AI as "retardedlol" and still go with pugs?

I for one would not dismiss AI as retarted.
Take bhavv's post #489, which in my opinion shows some of the power of AI when the right skills are combined.
And I think a lot of experienced players would think the same.

I have this nice guildie that plays H&H a lot.
He knows how to combine them and when I asked his opinion on 7 heroes his responce was "3 heroes + 4 hench work great, 7 heroes would be ... wow".

Quote:

Most people who play with PUGs already think that their fellow PUG members are already better than AI...

Don't agree.
Many see PuGs as a good way to add more heroes to the team.
Except when running full human teams, but that's only a small part of pugging.
Full human teams are mostly in those situations where a lot of humans fail when playing H&H or when people are teaming up for fun.

Star Gazer · Oct 09, 2007, 05:17 PM // 17:17

simply put: pugging will never change. Hard Mode with 2 henchie monks (which, btw, they spam Healing Breeze + Orison of Healing) just simply isn't enough. With the playerbase decreasing due to the "been there, done that" feeling, there will be a need for more heros. Pugging will only last so long. Atleast with 7 heros, you will be able to actually play some of the areas without worrying about not being able to. If it wasn't for Sab's synergizing 3xNec builds, I would have never done HM.

I don't see why it is a bad idea to not implement 7 heros for hard mode use only. It wouldn't destroy the economy, and loot scaling has done away with pretty much farming in general.

I refuse to get into a "pug", with a 12 year old brat that thinks because hes wearing FoW (because of mommy's credit card) thinks he is better than I am. If there wasn't so many childish and immature players out there, maybe pugging would have been a way to go. Heros = More options for players. Getting rid of immature brats = more options for pugs.

bhavv · Oct 09, 2007, 05:44 PM // 17:44

I added 6 people that were long time friends since I started playing GW to my friends list a few weeks back. Guess what? They dont play the game anymore.

Im currently in between playing and quitting, theres very little left in the game that I enjoy, and when I find another game to play I will leave to play i.

Eg I took a 3 week break ages ago when I went a Civ 4 spree, a 2 week break a couple of weeks back to play Oblivion.

The problem there is that the single player games have an end. Or you get bored of them quickly. So I lod up guildwars and roll a sac monk in RA because theres nothing else there for me to enjoy. I've tried vanquishing and quite a few areas with H/H (about 25 throughout all three campaigns). But I simply dont enjoy it while being limited by retard henchmen with stupid skillsets that I dont enjoy playing with.

'Ogden Stonehealer is Using Strength of Honor on Little Thom!'
'Little Thom is Using Charge'

'Cynn is using Mind Burn!'

'Mhenlo is Using Healing Breeze!'

'Dunham is Using Crippling Anguish!'

'Aidan is Using Practiced Stance!'

'Claude is Using Grenth's Balance!'

Seriously, what a waste of party slots.

Although there are some useful / great henchmen outside of Gwen :

Sogolon and Herta in NF - usefull but not perfect.
Erys Vasburg, Daeman, seaguard gita in Cantha - Near perfect, just need GoH on gita and a different Res, or no res at all.

And also most of the Gwen henchies are perfect. Anet can make good henchmen, but prophecies and 50% of cantha suffer from crap useless ones.

Hott Bill · Oct 09, 2007, 05:50 PM // 17:50

I would like all heros to view the current energy, and hp of my entire party.

ChaoticCoyote · Oct 09, 2007, 08:25 PM // 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

Those of us who play H/H are not going to play with PUGs either way.

Speak for yourself. I PuG (usually helping on the difficult missions), play solo with H/H, and buddy gamed (note past tense) with my wife.

ANet's stance will make the game LESS SOCIAL because people like me will quit playing period...

...the hard deadline is the introduction of the "Bonus" missions. If full hero parties haven't been implemented by then, I'm gone. And no, you can't have my stuff.

Melon · Oct 09, 2007, 08:34 PM // 20:34

7 Heroes for president.

zwei2stein · Oct 09, 2007, 09:38 PM // 21:38

"If you vote for me all your dreams will come true."

Bryant Again · Oct 09, 2007, 10:59 PM // 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_jos

I for one would not dismiss AI as retarted.
Take bhavv's post #489, which in my opinion shows some of the power of AI when the right skills are combined.
And I think a lot of experienced players would think the same.

Sad thing is that most people don't think that AI is better than the average player. There's been numerous instances where people have been in mission outposts desperately looking for a group. They'll invite me, see my heroes, and uninvite. What he didn't know is that I would've given him a one-way ticket to victory along with a delicious double bonus. I dunno why some people seem to have so little faith in heroes.

Crom The Pale · Oct 09, 2007, 11:07 PM // 23:07

Hero's are only as good as the player who equips thier skil bars.

Given the numerous titles now in GW and the grind involved in almost all of them it is very limiting that we have to use only 3heros.

How many times have you been in a town and seen somebody spaming for a pug to vanquish a zone? Or Cartographer? Skill Capping?

There are a few, but only a very very small number of the still large population out there.

Vinraith · Oct 10, 2007, 01:32 AM // 01:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChaoticCoyote

Speak for yourself. I PuG (usually helping on the difficult missions), play solo with H/H, and buddy gamed (note past tense) with my wife.

ANet's stance will make the game LESS SOCIAL because people like me will quit playing period...

...the hard deadline is the introduction of the "Bonus" missions. If full hero parties haven't been implemented by then, I'm gone. And no, you can't have my stuff.

The simple fact is that between now and GW2 they're either going to have to let us have 7 heroes or the elite areas and various swaths of hardmode are basically going to become unplayable. As the population of the game shrinks there are going to be even fewer people in these (often already deserted) areas.