Curse

FoxBat · Aug 24, 2009, 09:45 PM // 21:45

Kinda surprised no-one has noticed.

Ever since Drojam came back up, the ZBounties are repeating in exactly the same order since June 11th or whenever the 2nd cycle started. Much like the zcombat has a 32-day cycle, apparently all the bounties are on one big cycle. Missions too are starting to repeat in the same order, starting with destruction's depths. Assuming the cycle isn't ever reset again, you should be able to predict which zthing is on what day for every category.

trankle · Aug 24, 2009, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosyfiep

then look thru and see how many bosses are from each chapter....we did like what 4 from prophecies?? (verata, the bone dragon whose name escapes me, kephet.....not many others), factions....a few more than prophecies, but still lacking.....havent looked thru for nightfall.....but it seems the lions share of the bosses are either :dungeon bosses, elite area bosses, or in eye of the north.....can any one quote the exact numbers?

With Prophecies bosses, there would seem to be two main issues: spawning and level. Obviously, Anet would get many annoyed forum posts by players who zoned multiple times, only to never get their boss spawn. The other issue is that there are normal mode rewards for every bounty, and Anet is probably not too keen on giving rewards for the likes of Cess Corpselighter, a level 7 charr in The Breach.

In Factions and Nightfall, there are many bosses that are right outside outposts. Most of the regular explorable bosses we've seen have been at least a bit of a journey from the nearest outpost, or have been bosses that some players have found difficult at some point (Mungri Magicbox, Arbor Earthcall, etc). Think of all the bosses in the Jade Sea and Echovald Forest, and think how many were farmed like mad at some point, because they were literally right outside the door.

I think that while there are a ton of bosses out there, Anet made their list of zBounty bosses with the following questions in mind: Is the boss part of a dungeon or elite area? It it guaranteed to spawn? Is the normal mode version at least level 20? Is the boss adjacent to an outpost? Is there something (boss' skills, nearby spawns, terrain) that makes the boss relatively challenging?

With these kinds of questions in mind, I'm not surprised that a huge number of bosses in the game were not included in the zBounty rotation.

Marverick · Aug 24, 2009, 10:15 PM // 22:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asia Skyly

Interesting... I went and looked at the list and infact, it does look like every mission in the game is listed. However, I honestly do not recall seeing Imperial Sanctum (Shiro) as a Zaishen quest. Perhaps I overlooked it.

Oh well, Tihark again! I love Tihark, easiest coppers in the game. Large bags here we go again!

It was offered on 8/15. Open up the last 3 months and Ctrl + F to find it.

However Pogahn Passage has not been offered.

Marverick · Aug 24, 2009, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by trankle

With Prophecies bosses, there would seem to be two main issues: spawning and level. Obviously, Anet would get many annoyed forum posts by players who zoned multiple times, only to never get their boss spawn. The other issue is that there are normal mode rewards for every bounty, and Anet is probably not too keen on giving rewards for the likes of Cess Corpselighter, a level 7 charr in The Breach.

In Factions and Nightfall, there are many bosses that are right outside outposts. Most of the regular explorable bosses we've seen have been at least a bit of a journey from the nearest outpost, or have been bosses that some players have found difficult at some point (Mungri Magicbox, Arbor Earthcall, etc). Think of all the bosses in the Jade Sea and Echovald Forest, and think how many were farmed like mad at some point, because they were literally right outside the door.

I think that while there are a ton of bosses out there, Anet made their list of zBounty bosses with the following questions in mind: Is the boss part of a dungeon or elite area? It it guaranteed to spawn? Is the normal mode version at least level 20? Is the boss adjacent to an outpost? Is there something (boss' skills, nearby spawns, terrain) that makes the boss relatively challenging?

With these kinds of questions in mind, I'm not surprised that a huge number of bosses in the game were not included in the zBounty rotation.

The normal mode reward could be lame (5 coins), but the hard mode would be +65 or something.

As for bosses that don't always spawn, ANet did one of those on the third day I think. You had to kill either the quickshot or the obsidian flame boss on Perdition Rock. So in that case, you can always get your bounty.
This would probably be a hassle to code, however.

glacialphoenix · Aug 24, 2009, 10:23 PM // 22:23

Quote:

I think that while there are a ton of bosses out there, Anet made their list of zBounty bosses with the following questions in mind: Is the boss part of a dungeon or elite area? It it guaranteed to spawn? Is the normal mode version at least level 20? Is the boss adjacent to an outpost? Is there something (boss' skills, nearby spawns, terrain) that makes the boss relatively challenging?

The thing is, Zmissions already let you do the missions under 'Young Heroes of Tyria' in NM, it's simply that the rewards for doing it in NM are all extremely insignificant, and doing them in HM is far more worthwhile if you're capable of doing so. I don't see why that attitude can't be taken towards bosses.

If the boss, for example, is near an outpost, and he's deemed easy to reach, lower the ZBounty reward. I can see the issue with not picking a boss that might not spawn (because, seriously, I wouldn't touch it anyway if you asked me to dig deep into a mission for a boss that might not turn up), but Factions and NF have even more elite skills to capture than Prophecies, and some of those skills can be obtained from more than one boss. Why are we seeing so few of them? =\

Quote:

As for bosses that don't always spawn, ANet did one of those on the third day I think.

Maxine and Harn Coldstone? The thing is that one OR the other will always spawn - it's either Maxine OR Harn, it doesn't matter which you kill. A boss like Spindle Agonyvein, however, who has four spawn points and might not appear at any of them if you're unlucky, should be out of the question.

**cosyfiep** · Aug 24, 2009, 10:53 PM // 22:53

ah the coldstones ...that's the 4th one I forgot. (and forgot the eldin at the ids run too...so 5)
Yes I understand that the prophecies bosses dont always spawn in the correct spot...however, there ARE a bunch that do (keystone signet on my mesmer...always the same place....skipping the fire islands ones.)

and easy?? murgi is almost right outside the door and not very hard. mobly? another easy one with even all henchies! Fenrir hard to get to???? nope.
There are more bosses they could toss into the pot....dont know why they dont, but eye seems to have a boat load of them (pywatt wasnt difficult to get to either...and only had to kill 4 mobs of queztals and avoid the others.....).....

there are tons of 'max' level bosses they could have us kill off---yes some are easy to get to.....but what about the avatars in nightfall??....some of those are pretty tough to kill off.

dont know.

trankle · Aug 24, 2009, 11:53 PM // 23:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by glacialphoenix

If the boss, for example, is near an outpost, and he's deemed easy to reach, lower the ZBounty reward.

I guess if I were trying to collect Zcoins to save up for a reward, I'd rather not see the list of bosses littered with 40-50 Zcoin rewards. I'd rather see repeats that are worth more coins than a bunch of low-effort, low-reward bosses.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosyfiep

and easy?? murgi is almost right outside the door and not very hard. mobly? another easy one with even all henchies! Fenrir hard to get to???? nope.
There are more bosses they could toss into the pot....dont know why they dont, but eye seems to have a boat load of them (pywatt wasnt difficult to get to either...and only had to kill 4 mobs of queztals and avoid the others.....).....

there are tons of 'max' level bosses they could have us kill off---yes some are easy to get to.....but what about the avatars in nightfall??....some of those are pretty tough to kill off.

I feel you. I think avatars are a great example of the kind of boss that would pass through the criteria I listed before. They are considered relatively challenging in HM, especially when considering their cohorts and the tactical advantage their forts give them. I have no idea why they wouldn't make rotation. I guess my brainstorming was more to try to explain why a lot of other bosses wouldn't make the cut. I guess for whatever reason, Anet wanted to keep the list of bosses similar in size to the list of missions? Not sure why, but it seems like that.

As for Mungri, if you do a search of Guru, his name comes up in a lot of threads with themes like "most annoying boss". He's the kind of boss that's easy enough for an experienced player, but he has a reputation for being a challenge to the less experienced. Likewise with Mobly. I know I've been caught between two or three bosses in his location in the past. I know how to better approach him now, but I sure got caught by surprise back in the day!

Barrage · Aug 25, 2009, 12:49 AM // 00:49

There are 1203 bosses in this game, one programmers NIGHTMARE if trying to work on Gw2 as well.

Also add about 45 to the one sum above because of vengeful aataxe and any other high end mobs.

Ya, a lot of opportunities, they could also add full dungeons to the Z Missions as well, but it's far to nice to dream, so we get this. a semi - large rotation, would rather get new ones.

Pinkest One · Aug 25, 2009, 04:38 AM // 04:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by vader

Mohby Windbeak again? That's the third time he's come up. I know the second time was due to a glitch or something with them resetting the order but a third time?

^This is a big turn-off, i understood when the rotation was screwed.... but cmon the randomness was what made it great.

Sjeng · Aug 25, 2009, 07:28 AM // 07:28

I would have loved to see more bosses too, but meh. Tihark and Mohby times 9 characters = easy coinage!

The Josip · Aug 25, 2009, 08:30 AM // 08:30

For people who say Zaishen quests got boring - I think many completely miss the point of these quests. The point of these quests is not in getting Armor Packs and other rewards. The point is that players are drawn to certain areas, which means that instead of having a difficulty finding people for the mission, you have 2 districts of players to choose from.

Of course, if someone doesn't feel like doing any missions anymore and just wants to grind, that doesn't mean Z quests are bad. They are good for what they are created for. And I have to say that my experience from PUGing Z quests is so far very positive (yay for finishing THKeep HM with 1 monk because the other abandoned team in the beginning). PUGing outside of Z quests has been a disaster though, whenever I tried it (and that even in NM). Actually I'll open new thread to see experience of others.

Arduin · Aug 25, 2009, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrage

There are 1203 bosses in this game, one programmers NIGHTMARE if trying to work on Gw2 as well.

The GW1 Live Team isn't working on GW2, it's a separate team.

I think Anet should throw some non-boss creature in the Bounty too. For isntance, not the normal Grawl that spawn outside of Ascalon, but something like the Barbed Grawl in the Southern Shiverpeaks.

jray14 · Aug 25, 2009, 01:33 PM // 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrage

There are 1203 bosses in this game, one programmers NIGHTMARE if trying to work on Gw2 as well.

Nah, 1203 of something is trivial with the right programming tools. So unless they completely botched the implementation to make it extraordinarily difficult to integrate into the code, the limitation has got to be merely a result of some suit saying "thou shalt have 66 bounties."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arduinna

I think Anet should throw some non-boss creature in the Bounty too. For isntance, not the normal Grawl that spawn outside of Ascalon, but something like the Barbed Grawl in the Southern Shiverpeaks.

Many are already non-bosses, like most of the EOTN end-of-dungeon foes, DoA foes, etc. I think I know what you mean though---those are all referred to as "boss-like foes," and it would be cool to see something regular that's not even boss-like.

ne33us · Aug 25, 2009, 02:25 PM // 14:25

@FoxBat
It's not that no one noticed, it is that fewer and fewer players care about Z-anything over the time.

@trankle
Your argument is valid for Z-bounty.
A lot of thinking is needed to make something worthwhile, challenging and fun to play. Well done for the devs.

Unfortunatelly, it seems that they didn't take the same amount of time to think about Z-missions like Tihark Orchand, Chahbek Village, Minister Cho's Estate.
Maybe Z-missions were brainstormed in another dev meeting.

My point is that it seems that they looked at the tree and they lost the forest all together.

snaek · Aug 25, 2009, 02:35 PM // 14:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosyfiep

though I do feel for the combat people...8 is just toooo few.

are you a pvp'r? because i don't know about you, but i would think a lot of ha'rs would wish it were ha zq everyday. the same would apply to someone who would want it to be ta zq or hb zq everyday or at least almost every day. if i had to wait 2 months for my next zq to show up again, personally i'd find it a little annoying.

glacialphoenix · Aug 25, 2009, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Quote:

I'd rather see repeats that are worth more coins than a bunch of low-effort, low-reward bosses.

Even so, I think there are enough bosses that the list can be expanded. =\

StormDragonZ · Aug 26, 2009, 03:57 AM // 03:57

I'm still hoping for Wagg Spiritspeak to be on the list, but since Mungri Magicbox is in the same zone as Wagg, I don't think it'll happen.

Other bosses I'm hoping for:

- Alitta Guilebloom in Arbor Bay.
- Saushali the Frustrating in The Shattered Ravines.

**cosyfiep** · Aug 26, 2009, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

Kinda surprised no-one has noticed.

Ever since Drojam came back up, the ZBounties are repeating in exactly the same order since June 11th or whenever the 2nd cycle started. Much like the zcombat has a 32-day cycle, apparently all the bounties are on one big cycle. Missions too are starting to repeat in the same order, starting with destruction's depths. Assuming the cycle isn't ever reset again, you should be able to predict which zthing is on what day for every category.

you are so very right....I just checked wiki and yep they are

.

sad, they could do so much more with the bosses, but gw is passe so I guess we should be happy they are doing anything with it.

(and no I dont usually pvp, but I would think that at least a few more options would be nice, unless you enjoy doing exactly the same thing ....)

sigh

kazjun · Aug 26, 2009, 05:26 AM // 05:26

Been repeating for awhile. Check out the bottom of this page:

http://guildwars.wikia.com/wiki/Talk...hallenge_Quest

The guys been predicting for awhile and has hit the quests and bounties 100% so far since repeats. A bit sad that its just a set table rather than random missions/bounties, but I guess it just means you can look up when the missions you need come up and can go pick them up then rather than having to check in every day. Though I think someone forgot about Pogahn passage...