Curse

bitchbar player · Jan 02, 2010, 02:54 PM // 14:54

For ones i have to agree with Borat

Trip555 · Jan 02, 2010, 03:39 PM // 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

Sure, UW and DoA are HARD if you can't rely on some form on invinci tank, but it's supposed to be. And there not even doing enough with taking 600 smite and SF away. ANY form of tanking which requires nothing more than bashing some skills should be nerfed.

People in PvE need to learn again what kiting, body blocking, retreating (when you know you're gonna wipe) and pushing means.

Of course you can retreat doing Wastes, Pits or Horseman, however then the monsters head towards the Reaper and you get returned to the outpost.

Similar situation in Gloom.

In the Foundry of Fail the Spiders in room 2 may attack your backline right away (bad spawn) with no choice of the tank getting aggro. Room 3 and 4 are also very hard to pull/tank and if you are lucky enough to clear the whole foundry you have to get weak Snakes out of strong attacking Hordes (might get stuck).
After all this mess you still have to beat two bosses.
People try and try and at some point are just getting a Runner for 20k each.

Reformed · Jan 02, 2010, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trip555

In the Foundry of Fail the Spiders in room 2 may attack your backline right away (bad spawn) with no choice of the tank getting aggro. Room 3 and 4 are also very hard to pull/tank and if you are lucky enough to clear the whole foundry you have to get weak Snakes out of strong attacking Hordes (might get stuck).
After all this mess you still have to beat two bosses.
People try and try and at some point are just getting a Runner for 20k each.

Try it without a tank at all sometime and run an imbagon. Placement is irrelevant when you are always fighting from a midline position. It then just boils down to pulls and extremely basic aggro control. You can even take the snakes around with you rather than locking them into the notch in room 3.

toocooltang · Jan 02, 2010, 06:30 PM // 18:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

Godforbid, you're going to have a build with damage dealers that will actually have to coordinate damage, frontliners who will actually have to coordinate body blocks, and a backline which will actually have to pay some attention instead of spamming Healing seed/party/seed of life.

Sure, UW and DoA are HARD if you can't rely on some form on invinci tank, but it's supposed to be. And there not even doing enough with taking 600 smite and SF away. ANY form of tanking which requires nothing more than bashing some skills should be nerfed.

People in PvE need to learn again what kiting, body blocking, retreating (when you know you're gonna wipe) and pushing means.

Ever since Anet introduced redicilous farming builds (SF, 600 smite) the PvP community went to shit aswell. Mainly because there is no more influx of PvE'ers, as PvP is concidered "too hard" for them. On top of that, since the last year, the few PvE'er that DID dear to venture in PvP did so without getting rid of their PvE mentality. They came to PvP for one reason, and one reason only: to farm their title as fast as possible with as least skill required as possible.

Obviously, it's too late to save PvP now, but I wouldn't mind seeing all the builds that caused this mindset amongst PvE'ers go. No reason whatsoever why you should be able to just wiki a build for an ELITE area in HARD MODE and steamroll through it...

Wait, you want me to play the game instead of running through all the mobs then using sliver armor/radiation field/finish him/ymlad to kill the reapers?

Seriously though, amen dude.

lishi · Jan 02, 2010, 07:11 PM // 19:11

To be fair, you actually dont have to kill the reaper.

They are kinda key NPC and the game will boot you from UW if they die.

Other than that ya. I still think SF has to be nerfed, even if DayWay milked me a Dhuum's soul reaper.

Devastating Flames · Jan 02, 2010, 10:02 PM // 22:02

i would like to see shadow form maid have a cool down of 120 seconds like the avatars do that would great stop all the permas right then and thier.

Tenebrae · Jan 02, 2010, 10:21 PM // 22:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devastating Flames

i would like to see shadow form maid have a cool down of 120 seconds like the avatars do that would great stop all the permas right then and thier.

That would also destroy the skill and thats not the point ..... if it was , anet would "smitebooned" SF long ago. I hope that this skill update reworks the entire skill .

The Last Battle · Jan 02, 2010, 10:25 PM // 22:25

nerfing stuff like this is one of the reasons normal players turn to hacking..

Killed u man · Jan 02, 2010, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trip555

Of course you can retreat doing Wastes, Pits or Horseman, however then the monsters head towards the Reaper and you get returned to the outpost.

Similar situation in Gloom.

In the Foundry of Fail the Spiders in room 2 may attack your backline right away (bad spawn) with no choice of the tank getting aggro. Room 3 and 4 are also very hard to pull/tank and if you are lucky enough to clear the whole foundry you have to get weak Snakes out of strong attacking Hordes (might get stuck).
After all this mess you still have to beat two bosses.
People try and try and at some point are just getting a Runner for 20k each.

You've pretty much proven the point I'm trying to make. You're here complaining (or atleast bringing up) the fact that you can have a random -bad- spawn. IS that not the very definition of a "HARD" mode, and "ELITE" area?

My intire point is that nowadays, if there isn't a detailed guide on wiki, people thinks it's impossible to do. If wiki says: "If you have a bad spawn, resign out", people will do that.

Sure, you COULD have bad luck, and they spawn behind your backline, and that's where the "HARD" in hardmode comes in, or "ELITE" in elite area. Your Monks will have to have the brains to MOVE around and loose aggro. Your frontliners will have to change position aswell. Your intire teamsetup has to change according to the situation.

This is closer to PvP than anything else in PvE. And what did Anet do? They allowed redicilous builds to farm this... And sometimes, PvE should overcome. Sometimes you SHOULD party wipe, cuz that's the only way people are going to learn from there mistakes.

"Hey, we keep dying because our Monks are never on the right position, how about having them CHANGE position?"

And then the line between PvE (farm) and PvP (skill) becomes so thin, people can make the jump alot more easily.

Arduin · Jan 02, 2010, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Last Battle

nerfing stuff like this is one of the reasons normal players turn to hacking..

Because removing the easy button and overpowered stuff those 'normal players' are using extensively makes them look for another easy button.

At least hacking will get those players banned.

Wuhy · Jan 02, 2010, 10:51 PM // 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Last Battle

nerfing stuff like this is one of the reasons normal players turn to hacking..

what the FFFFFFFFFFF are you talking about? seriously... its disturbing...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenex Xclame

YES

The ORIGINAL playerbase bought this game for mainly 2 reasons, one it is free and two because YOUR skill actually mattered, with the way the game is now, you dont even have to learn to play the game, you buy the game you go on wiki copy paste a build, read the notes and you spearhead through almost everything in this game

Guildwars is far from boring, you do realize you can do UW just for the ectos that drop on the way, the green you could hopefully get and the drops you can get from the chest and still have fun right?Just because you want to get things without doing any work for it, does not mean you should be able to,speaking of money why the hell do you need money?Most things in this game are cheap as dirt,ow what you want the new shiny stuff as soon as it comes out?Sorry you cant,it is not supposed to be easy to get new shiny stuff, otherwise what would be the point.

It is obvious you dont care about the game and game breaking problems,but for the rest of us who do letting Anet know what we think is the only way we can get things fixed.

^this...

zjmc · Jan 02, 2010, 10:57 PM // 22:57

This may have been said before but if they anet does choose to nerf the main tank builds causing run times of UW, FoW, and DoA to increase substantially then I really hope the drop rates of rare items from said areas increase proportionally. I doubt anyone wants to do 90 minute runs of UW or FoW with the current drops we are all getting.

Karate Jesus · Jan 02, 2010, 10:58 PM // 22:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wuhy

what the FFFFFFFFFFF are you talking about? seriously... its disturbing...

^this...

To be fair, the nerfing of HFFF is one of the things that made botting JQ and FA so popular and made afk'ing luxon faction popular.

Nerfing can lead to people cheating the game; however, that's a bit of a stretch.

Jae Onasi · Jan 02, 2010, 11:13 PM // 23:13

If you're going to nerf farming builds, at least make the drops in PvE worth more, or drop more gold off of monsters, particularly outside of UW or FW. You're addressing a symptom (easy farming leading to massive price drop in ecto and obsidian shards) but not the problem--people need a way to make decent gold without having to spend 8 years playing the game. I farm raptors for holiday drops and gold because it's one of the fastest ways for me to get something special like elite armor or party points. The weapons that drop from the raptors, however, are generally just merch food, even in HM. However, doing 10 raptor runs in about a half hour nets me a lot more Asuran points and gold than vanquishing that entire zone in 2 hours does. It costs a ton of money to fill the HoM, and the drops you get even in the higher end areas of all the games, and EotN which is supposed to be a high-end expansion, are just not profitable enough to cover those costs unless you farm or are a power-trader.

If you make it a lot more profitable, reputation point-wise, title-wise and financially, to do non-farming tasks when you nerf the builds, at least you'll take the sting out of the pain of farm-build loss for some of us.

Arduin · Jan 02, 2010, 11:14 PM // 23:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by zjmc

This may have been said before but if they anet does choose to nerf the main tank builds causing run times of UW, FoW, and DoA to increase substantially then I really hope the drop rates of rare items from said areas increase proportionally. I doubt anyone wants to do 90 minute runs of UW or FoW with the current drops we are all getting.

Increase droprate-> better chance at the end-chest -> more rare skinned weapons in the game -> supply increases -> prices go down -> people complain about not being able to make money because drops are shitty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jae Onasi

people need a way to make decent gold without having to spend 8 years playing the game.

Or people could care less about virtual wealth.

Killed u man · Jan 02, 2010, 11:24 PM // 23:24

You guys seem to miss that the value of items is still based on the basic supply and demand system known in economics.

If FoW, UW and DoA became EXTREMELY HARD and LONG, people would definatly think twice about doing it. But this also mean there will be NO MORE income of ecto's whatsoever, nor shards or any other material. So over time, these will rise, and rise, untill people find a nice break-even between time invested and rewards for these elite areas.

Too bad GW is at the end of it's lifespan, and there is a very low demand for crafting materials. This will make it take really long before you notice any sever change in prices. (People simply don't want FoW anymore, because they already have it, or because of the many other options you didn't had during Prophecies days)

Tenebrae · Jan 02, 2010, 11:25 PM // 23:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arduin

Increase droprate-> better chance at the end-chest -> more rare skinned weapons in the game -> supply increases -> prices go down -> people complain about not being able to make money because drops are shitty

Or people could care less about virtual wealth.

Or people could care less about ppl that would cry if drop rate in elite areas increase ..... oh wait , those ppl matters -3 .

gwkbar · Jan 02, 2010, 11:47 PM // 23:47

nerf 100b plz

nerf mark of pain

upier · Jan 03, 2010, 12:30 AM // 00:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

monks, kitting, ...

Am I correct in my assessment that you do not PvE?

Twin Blade Warriror · Jan 03, 2010, 03:12 AM // 03:12

awesome going to buff hammer wars ^^ i never use in pve but maybe after update..maybe something fun to do