Curse

Nimble Night · Jan 26, 2010, 05:59 PM // 17:59

I thought we had agreed that randomly buffing elites was a bad idea? If you wanted it to see more play you should have removed the 1sec cast on Mel Shot and reduced its recharge. That way its a less reliable snare but can be used for spreading bleeding. So if you need a reliable snare on the ranger you bring Crip Shot.

The rest of the ranger reworks look good. However Glass Arrows should have been reworked, nerfing it out of play completely, after having such a long period of time to change it, is just sloppy.

I personally didn't see anything wrong with ride the lightning, at 10e + 1sec cast as well as exhaustion, I thought it was relatively balanced. Although it was never used outside of defensive spikes, so I'm not overly sad to see it go.

What I was hoping to get from this update was:

All the changed except for the buff to Crippling Shot.

A nerf to all of the currently broken speed buffs, ie: Illusion Of Haste, Dash, Storm Djinns, etc. To the point that they are all on the same level as Windborne Speed. This would decrease people reliance on water eles.

Freezing Gust should get the same treatment as Winters Embrace.

Powerblock toned down so people will run primary eles and necros.

Revert to Aegis to keep ranger interrupts in check.

Changes to Vicious Attack and perhaps Spear of Lightning.

It would be nice to see LoD be viable again also, but should require a high divine favour investment to stop it being abused by midline characters.

Karate Jesus · Jan 26, 2010, 06:06 PM // 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

Quick Shot was probably the last skill on the Ranger that needed a nerf, esspecially with Needling Shot removed as synergy.

The Quick Shot nerf made me laugh so hard. It's almost like nerfing Signet of Removal or something....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

Also, Sundering/Penetrating shot LOOKS like a buff, but it's actually a nerf considering the .5 second aftercast. the total time not is bumped up to 1.25 from 1 second.

Actually, you're wrong. It is a buff. Sundering/Penetrating shots have a PvP/PvE skill split. They're only adding the aftercast to the PvP versions.

The PvE versions shouldn't have an aftercast....although, it still doesn't make them very good (single target damage in PvE zzzzz)

Apok Omen · Jan 26, 2010, 06:09 PM // 18:09

If I may summarize everybody's opinions on the update:

MoI/Cultist's Fervor/Non-Elite Bow Attacks/ Glass Arrows/ Lightning Reflexes changes are good.

Quick Shot shouldn't be changed (trust me, it won't be abused in spikes mainly due to no added damage)

Cripshot doesn't need a buff (If anything, make it 1sec recharge instead of 2sec, but please, for the love of god, don't make it undodgable)

Nerf recharge on Freezing Gust as well (8 seconds should do it)

Don't make Soldier's Fury give cracked armor in PvE.

That is all.

veteran_player · Jan 26, 2010, 06:11 PM // 18:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wiki

Soldier's Fury will be given a similar downside as Aggressive Refrain. "Whenever a shout or chant ends on you, you suffer from Cracked Armor (10 seconds)." The purpose of this change is to force paragons to make a choice between defense (higher armor) or offense (increased attack speed). We do not expect PvE paragons to be harmed by this change; so we're letting it apply to both PvE and PvP.

To say that this will not harm PvE Paragons is outrightly absurd.

Its is hard enough to encourage people to make Paragons for PVE.

I'd ask why but there is no point, it has never been more clear to me that you guys do not play your own game.

So disapointing.

MisterB · Jan 26, 2010, 06:45 PM // 18:45

No, cracked armor on Soldier's Fury won't hurt PvE Paragons. It will only discourage some people that play them. Cracked armor doesn't matter, but that is the chief argument against Aggressive Refrain, along with how to maintain it.

PvE Paragons are rarely targeted, and you still have 86 armor even with the condition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

The Quick Shot nerf made me laugh so hard.

I had the same reaction.

Over Nine looo · Jan 26, 2010, 07:01 PM // 19:01

I see Cripshot being nerfed worse than ever before now that it's been buffed to a more godly level. They should've left it alone. Nerfing for the sake of GvG while letting some changes apply to PvE, too? o_0 Doesn't make sense to me, but w/e.. I can understand the nerf to rangers because of Glass Arrows beefing up spikes, but you can't have two elite at once, can you? So, why nerf Quick Shot? Is it a "JIC" measure? Are they worried that R-Spikers would employ other preps and couple them with Q.Shot? *shrugs* I'm happy with the L.Reflexes change though because LR + NS made rangers pretty frustrating to attack. I don't see R/A's being addressed in this update. Blood Spike debuffing along with party-wide nerfs, and even a change in life steal sounds strangely exciting. I don't see anything new; I guess they're delivering new skills and functionalities February [or so they say..]. So all in all we've got a plethora of nerfs, one or two teeny weeny buffs, new skill changes are yet to come, and until then we must wait some more. See ya'll February!

Apok Omen · Jan 26, 2010, 07:04 PM // 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Over Nine looo

I don't see R/A's being addressed in this update.

Nerfing LR will hurt R/A's, basically making them slightly less fragile versions of SA sins.

*lemming* · Jan 26, 2010, 07:11 PM // 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apok Omen

Quick Shot shouldn't be changed (trust me, it won't be abused in spikes mainly due to no added damage)

Trust me, if it's the last twitch attack skill without aftercast, someone will use it in a spike build.

Karate Jesus · Jan 26, 2010, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemming

Trust me, if it's the last twitch attack skill without aftercast, someone will use it in a spike build.

And that someone will be terrible at the game.

No +damage makes it worthless. It has been for years. The only people that have run it were Gamependium people who got it to the #1 spot on their website.

Redvex · Jan 26, 2010, 07:57 PM // 19:57

Ok pvp changed but why also nerfing ranger in pve?
Oh well but they are gonna to buff warrior pve

MisterB · Jan 26, 2010, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Most of the ranger skill updates are PvP only.
Only Marauder's, Quick, Needling, Hunter's, Precision, Melandru's, and Crippling Shot will change in PvE. None of those are exactly useful in PvE. Sundering and Penetrating Shot(PvE) will change slightly, from 1 second activation to 3/4 + 1/2 recovery. Those 2 will effectively go from 1 second to 1.25.

The Quick Shot nerf in PvE is still absurd. It was pretty awful already, and now it has an extra half second of recovery attached.

Chthon · Jan 26, 2010, 09:04 PM // 21:04

It's not at all clear to me from the notes whether the extra cooldown on fixed-time bow attacks applies to PvE or not. If so, it's a terrible nerf to a class that's already very weak in PvE. If not, this update will have very little PvE effect.

Regarding Soldier's Fury and Quick Shot in PvE. These are already terrible skills. While it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to nerf bad skills, it also doesn't do a whole lot of harm.

Krill · Jan 26, 2010, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apok Omen

Nerfing LR will hurt R/A's, basically making them slightly less fragile versions of SA sins.

Meh...people are still going to keep running hoards of them in HA. SA was a strong and underused elite on primary sins before the R/A madness and won't go away without a wrecking ball to the whole template or the skill itself.

I just don't get this mentality:

Buff a bunch of useless bow attacks to 1s activation --> recognize two years later this was a problem after they have been abused every which way.

Buff a bunch of useless dagger attacks to 1/2 activation --> recognize this is a problem...when, Christmas 2011?

Fay Vert · Jan 26, 2010, 09:42 PM // 21:42

Individually, the ranger nerfs seem to make some sense. However, take them as a package and this seems to me to be a stupid nerfbat out of conrol.

Xsiriss · Jan 26, 2010, 09:48 PM // 21:48

Ok now give us the other half. You're incredibly pathetic for splitting it two and dealing both halves very late anet.

Desert Rose · Jan 26, 2010, 09:51 PM // 21:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

All the bow changes feel a little overkill - a 1-1.5 second aftercast akin to interrupts would've been easier than gutting everything like this.

Doesn't ranger interrupts, like all 0.5s ranged attack skills, already have an 1.25s aftercast delay?!

*lemming* · Jan 26, 2010, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

And that someone will be terrible at the game.

No +damage makes it worthless. It has been for years. The only people that have run it were Gamependium people who got it to the #1 spot on their website.

Being able to chain three attack skills on a spike is what makes Glass Arrows rangers dangerous, not the +18 damage on Power Shot.

Revelations · Jan 26, 2010, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Desert Rose

Doesn't ranger interrupts, like all 0.5s ranged attack skills, already have an 1.25s aftercast delay?!

Correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

They have a 3/4 second aftercast delay.

Incorrect. Play a dshot monk. If you miss it, you die.

Axel Zinfandel · Jan 26, 2010, 11:03 PM // 23:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

The Quick Shot nerf made me laugh so hard. It's almost like nerfing Signet of Removal or something....

I know. If anything, it could really use the buff in PvE.

Quote:

Actually, you're wrong. It is a buff. Sundering/Penetrating shots have a PvP/PvE skill split. They're only adding the aftercast to the PvP versions.

The PvE versions shouldn't have an aftercast....although, it still doesn't make them very good (single target damage in PvE zzzzz)

The notes they stated HIGHLY suggested that this change is universal. I can't assume either way, becuase I can see them taking it both ways, though I feel inclined to believe you on that.

Sure, they are single target, but low recharge, so still good in PvE.

jazilla · Jan 27, 2010, 01:01 AM // 01:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

No, cracked armor on Soldier's Fury won't hurt PvE Paragons. It will only discourage some people that play them. Cracked armor doesn't matter, but that is the chief argument against Aggressive Refrain, along with how to maintain it.

PvE Paragons are rarely targeted, and you still have 86 armor even with the condition.

I had the same reaction.

Paras in PvE need encouragement to play. Maybe if the test krewe would make them more viable in PvE you guys could keep hitting them with the nerf crotch bat some more for PvP. Seriously though, is there anything more annoying than playing a support class in PvE and not having it be versatile enough to have like 10 builds that are fun for it?