Curse

Shut A You Face · Mar 02, 2010, 06:15 PM // 18:15

I have a Sin. Yes I have used SF. No, I have never done UWSC or any other SC. I use mostly a Rit.
There..got that all out of the way.
I have been lurking the forums for quite some time now. Even before i actually joined guru. I actually think that working with new skills is fun and very enjoyable. However, It is my opinion that the folks who cried so much about SF never have done SC's, etc. These people probably never would have either. Why do they care so much about what other people do? I don't..
For those people, it's usually about dumbing down everything so they can get what they want. The typical leveling of the playing field. For those people an "A" for effort is what they want, I suppose. You get a medal for trying...or in this case, titles, HoM, etc...not for actually achieving. Seems indicative of our culture in the U.S. today.

Let the elites of the game play as they play. And as for the rest of us...Let's try to get better if you want to obtain titles, HoM, ecto or whatever it is you want.

My two cents

Orry · Mar 02, 2010, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shut A You Face

I have a Sin. Yes I have used SF. No, I have never done UWSC or any other SC. I use mostly a Rit.
There..got that all out of the way.
I have been lurking the forums for quite some time now. Even before i actually joined guru. I actually think that working with new skills is fun and very enjoyable. However, It is my opinion that the folks who cried so much about SF never have done SC's, etc. These people probably never would have either. Why do they care so much about what other people do? I don't..
For those people, it's usually about dumbing down everything so they can get what they want. The typical leveling of the playing field. For those people an "A" for effort is what they want, I suppose. You get a medal for trying...or in this case, titles, HoM, etc...not for actually achieving. Seems indicative of our culture in the U.S. today.

Let the elites of the game play as they play. And as for the rest of us...Let's try to get better if you want to obtain titles, HoM, ecto or whatever it is you want.

My two cents

Actually, most of the people whining about SF being overpowered were against the dumbing down of the game. Once someone elses playstyle effects yours directly it becomes a problem. Shadow Form as it was dumbed down the game a lot, in fact Shadow Form as it is still dumbs down the game a lot, tanking really, really dumbs down what Guild Wars is.

Shadow Feathers · Mar 02, 2010, 06:33 PM // 18:33

More QQ... I would have never expected this

snaek · Mar 02, 2010, 06:45 PM // 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

SF and 600/Smite were not farming builds.

Farming builds are, by their very nature, limited in scope. 55 is an example. In certain areas, it dominates everything it meets. However, if you try to use it as a general PvE build...the results aren't pretty.

This is a good thing. 55 should not be touched for this reason.

However, SF and 600/Smite weren't like this. They dominated most of the game, and often did it better than entire parties (admittedly, SF was much worse in this regard). That is not farming. That is taking a hammer and smashing PvE into little bitty pieces with it.

this right here invalidates op's point. you say anet wants to provide fun for everyone? how does forcing everyone to roll a sin accomplish this? at least ursan let you play whatever class you wanted. at the peak of sf, the gw mentality was: "sin or gtfo"

Bryant Again · Mar 02, 2010, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Man I remember the days when ANet actually tried to prevent farming, those were interesting times...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

The recent mess only confirms we're on the wrong track now. All in the name of balance, just like the inquisition did things in the name of god, they're just beliefs of a fanatic group. It's no secret that it is the people who scream the loudest that seem to be the most intolerant for a differing point of view. And that's not what GW needs. Did the TK play a huge role in that? I don't know, but if they did, Anet should let them go and take control in own hands again.

I sincerely hope Anet realises their mistake and will make certain play styles less dull again, like 600/smite.

Thank you.

Some would consider that we've been off the track for years on end now. I personally feel that if a fraction of a party is able to go into an area and be successful that something is wrong, either with the enemy composition or with the balancing of skills.

Kook~NBK~ · Mar 02, 2010, 07:30 PM // 19:30

Soooo....Which A-Net employee is a reincarnation of Torquemada?

Inquisition = Bad thing. Lots of people tortured and burned at the stake.
Latest Skill Update = Good thing. Fixed a major problem with the game, and the only thing that got burned (sort of) was a GW box.

Seriously, though - restoring Elite areas to the point where they deserve the title "Elite" is much better for the game than leaving them (UW) the joke they turned into thanks to the different "god modes" that were out there.

Gun Pierson · Mar 02, 2010, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

this right here invalidates op's point. you say anet wants to provide fun for everyone? how does forcing everyone to roll a sin accomplish this? at least ursan let you play whatever class you wanted. at the peak of sf, the gw mentality was: "sin or gtfo"

First year after release, people were solo farming griffs, hydras, troll cave, ethins, avicara and UW with warriors, monks, eles, necros, you name it. And that was before sins were even born. Not to forget rangers who could barrage whole areas on their own. Nobody was excluded, except maybe the mesmers.

EDIT: And nobody cared, because all the cool kids were playing PVP.

The-Bigz · Mar 02, 2010, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryant Again

Some would consider that we've been off the track for years on end now. I personally feel that if a fraction of a party is able to go into an area and be successful that something is wrong, either with the enemy composition or with the balancing of skills.

I completely agree with you. A Massive Multiplayer Online RPG should be exactly that. Different classes work in different areas for different purposes, players should work together towards a common goal, and playing an online game like a console game killed any type of love I had for PvE in Guild Wars.

EDIT: What I'm trying to say is that people themselves killed the fun of it, and A-Net let this go by un-noticed and are now doing something too late to fix it. Leave the 'I can do this solo' ego at the door when you play an online team based RPG next time. That was directed at the elitists.

snaek · Mar 02, 2010, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by gun pierson

First year after release, people were solo farming griffs, hydras, troll cave, ethins, avicara and UW with warriors, monks, eles, necros, you name it. And that was before sins were even born. Not to forget rangers who could barrage whole areas on their own. Nobody was exluded, except maybe the mesmers.

exactly, and you still can mostly--but everyone chose to farm with sf/600 instead because it was broken. thats why sf/600 was bad, and thats why sf/600 was nerfed. so whats your point?

MMSDome · Mar 02, 2010, 07:46 PM // 19:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

Some of you need to be reminded what GW stands for and that it's not all about the way you play only.

This has been Anet's view for years:
'ArenaNet tries to keep the game fun for everyone while still providing fun and rewarding play for solo farmers.'

The recent mess only confirms we're on the wrong track now. All in the name of balance, just like the inquisition did things in the name of god, they're just beliefs of a fanatic group. It's no secret that it is the people who scream the loudest that seem to be the most intolerant for a differing point of view. And that's not what GW needs. Did the TK play a huge role in that? I don't know, but if they did, Anet should let them go and take control in own hands again.

I sincerely hope Anet realises their mistake and will make certain play styles less dull again, like 600/smite.

Thank you.

God forbid you need to learn a new build.

Hope you enjoy this update, I know I do!

Cuilan · Mar 02, 2010, 07:47 PM // 19:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMSDome

God forbid you need to learn a new build.

Hope you enjoy this update, I know I do!

Pretty much sums it up for solo-farmers. Thanks, MMSDome.

Lest121 · Mar 02, 2010, 07:52 PM // 19:52

Nerf 55 monk build too.

Aldo wants more · Mar 02, 2010, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

exactly, and you still can mostly--but everyone chose to farm with sf/600 instead because it was broken. thats why sf/600 was bad, and thats why sf/600 was nerfed. so whats your point?

I can take your point with regards to SF, but the 600/smite argument doesn't hold for me. 600/smite is a duo/trio team build and is not invicible like the previous versions of SF.

Did those of us that enjoyed 600/smite duo/trio really affect your gameplay? Personally I didn't make my sin Perma as i enjoy playing with others, and that just so happened to be in the form of 600/smite.

Orry · Mar 02, 2010, 08:02 PM // 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldo wants more

I can take your point with regards to SF, but the 600/smite argument doesn't hold for me. 600/smite is a duo/trio team build and is not invicible like the previous versions of SF.

Did those of us that enjoyed 600/smite duo/trio really affect your gameplay? Personally I didn't make my sin Perma as i enjoy playing with others, and that just so happened to be in the form of 600/smite.

600/smite ran a lot of dungeons, that affected my gameplay quite a bit by reducing those that i could form a group to actually attempt to play it with.

Tullzinski · Mar 02, 2010, 08:13 PM // 20:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orry

600/smite ran a lot of dungeons, that affected my gameplay quite a bit by reducing those that i could form a group to actually attempt to play it with.

Really? So you were forced to 600/smite or did you hook up with like minded people and complete any area you wanted.

I will say that you may be the first person to actually come closes to answering my question of how others using XXX build may affect someone.
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But there is an issue with general PUGs failing most of the time. Memories of Thunder Keep come to mind way back in the day. I cannot count the amount of Pug fails over that mission.

tmakinen · Mar 02, 2010, 08:16 PM // 20:16

Well, spirit spamming is still your one-size-fits-all solo farming solution, I can't say that I'm seeing any noticeable difference after the minor nerf.

Other than that, my preferred approach to particular builds breaking 'elite' content would be to adjust that content instead of the builds, since loot scaling already takes care of the normal content. Something like this has been tried on some occassions but I've got the feeling that the applied solutions weren't anywhere near optimal.

Spiritz · Mar 02, 2010, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

SF and 600/Smite were not farming builds.

See the difference? There is nothing wrong with farming. If Anet really had a problem with it they would have nerfed SoS into the ground, or killed 55 monks.

Dont forget w/n raptor farmers - how long before they get swiped at by anets nerfbat of pain ?
And why is it most of the ppl qq`ing now about sf are the same ppl who qq it was too op - must be bad 1 minute to be gloating about sf nerf then waking up next morning and finding out it still exists

Aldo wants more · Mar 02, 2010, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orry

600/smite ran a lot of dungeons, that affected my gameplay quite a bit by reducing those that i could form a group to actually attempt to play it with.

Whenever we want to do dungeons and don't want to/can't run it with 600/smite we only have to ask our guildies and alliance for volunteers to make a team. Did you ask yours?

Orry · Mar 02, 2010, 08:39 PM // 20:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tullzinski

Really? So you were forced to 600/smite or did you hook up with like minded people and complete any area you wanted.

I will say that you may be the first person to actually come closes to answering my question of how others using XXX build may affect someone.
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But there is an issue with general PUGs failing most of the time. Memories of Thunder Keep come to mind way back in the day. I cannot count the amount of Pug fails over that mission.

For the most part i haven't been able to complete most dungeons, and most people just tell me to "get a run" if I try to LFG X Dungeon

Orry · Mar 02, 2010, 08:45 PM // 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldo wants more

Whenever we want to do dungeons and don't want to/can't run it with 600/smite we only have to ask our guildies and alliance for volunteers to make a team. Did you ask yours?

I like running things with PUGs, but if none form due to people getting runs there is a problem. I do ask my alliance for help, that is how i completed the dungeons that I do have done.