Curse

Countess Marie · Jun 08, 2010, 07:42 AM // 07:42

I can understand why you might want to move this to the Necro section, and I'm not going to plead with you, but if you would read this before you moved it to make sure you want to.

I was thinking a lot about Minion Mastery and Death Magic lately (and just read on a forum where people were talking about MM.) Not the state of it recently, but back near release. I didn't get the game in April, I got it in the middle of July, so I can't say I was there at the beginning.

But, when was the first time you guys really respected Death Magic in high-level content?

For me, I was always trying to figure out how to make it work. I remember the first day I heard about v-sac and I was like WHAT?! The guy was like "Yeah, dude, you can cap it from vereta in the villainy quest ( lol ). +10 regen?!

But I never thought it got any respect by the masses until Sorrows Furnace. I'm not going to claim to be the first MM in SF, but the whole dwarf area of the game was a MM playpen because they didn't hit that hard or do much AoE. I remember being like oooh yeah, time to shine. And everyone wanted necs to run SS or worse, BIP. I was like... MM LFG?? And they'd be like... stfunub. "We'd rather bring another nuker!" Of course, the best time for Necros was SF (gear exploit and all) because every group wanted two (SS and MM.)

Am I seeing this differently than other people? I admit I was a noob at first. And I even got to SF late (a day or two.) But when I got there nobody was running MM. And I hadn't seen MM really take off in other spots (maybe in places like THK or Thirsty River.)

And the spite from watching everyone turn into Necro lovers overnight gave me no qualms about buying every Bortak item I could find and selling it for 100k+ ectos :P

-CM

Pleikki · Jun 08, 2010, 08:02 AM // 08:02

Well I loved it in 2005 before it was nerfed, and well when remade my necro as my main in 2006 i used it as MM for almost year :d

By the nerf i mean when u used be able have dozens of minions and so on :d

Lodar Aric · Jun 08, 2010, 08:40 AM // 08:40

I remember Glyph of Renewal + Verata's Sacrifice was godly at the time. I ran a MM before SF was released, but they really took off when it did come out.

I wasn't happy with the minion cap at the time but I can see now why they had to change it.

The Josip · Jun 08, 2010, 08:43 AM // 08:43

MM was always overpowered and still is.

Check how many people use MM heroes and how many use mesmer heroes. Exactly.

Luminarus · Jun 08, 2010, 08:47 AM // 08:47

Atm minions can:

Tank, Body block, nuke, melee, easy respawn, trigger Pain Inverter, and live near indefinately.

Why would u run anything else?

Kumu Honua · Jun 08, 2010, 09:11 AM // 09:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

MM was always overpowered and still is.

Check how many people use MM heroes and how many use mesmer heroes. Exactly.

What about those who use both?

majoho · Jun 08, 2010, 09:42 AM // 09:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luminarus

Atm minions can:

Tank, Body block, nuke, melee, easy respawn, trigger Pain Inverter, and live near indefinately.

Why would u run anything else?

Because the heroes does it better than I ever could

Xenomortis · Jun 08, 2010, 10:09 AM // 10:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by majoho

Because the heroes does it better than I ever could

Then you suck.

Let me give you a tip on how to be better than a hero Minion Bomber:
Learn to run Order of Undeath without lots of self-heals.

Scary · Jun 08, 2010, 10:38 AM // 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

MM was always overpowered and still is.

Check how many people use MM heroes and how many use mesmer heroes. Exactly.

It is strong and usefull, not overpowerd

aspi · Jun 08, 2010, 10:40 AM // 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

MM was always overpowered and still is.

Check how many people use MM heroes and how many use mesmer heroes. Exactly.

Maybe mesmers just suck? I don't care much about them, I also fail to see how a mesmer could ever replace a MM in a group. Unless it is in areas with no corpses. Even then I'd rather take a ranger or even a warrior before I think about bringing an annoying mesmer with me.

garethporlest18 · Jun 08, 2010, 10:42 AM // 10:42

I don't run MM because I rather watch someone play tennis. IE: it's boring, like knitting or something horrible.

But yeah the first time I respected MMing was in 2005 when I was a nabhat and trying to do Galarath, I'm sure you all remember that one. Our necro had like 20 minions out and I thought that was pretty awesome, but I don't think I ever utilized it like that. For all other death magic..eh I've always used it. But when I was able to put together a semi-decent non boring attack build with DM post NF, that's when I started primarily using my necro as a DM necro when I H/Hed.

Oh and the only way a mesmer wouldn't be underpowered when compared to a MM is if the MM part was taken out of the game or reduced to a Smiters Boon state which would upset people.

Fusylum · Jun 08, 2010, 11:21 AM // 11:21

I try to use an MM everywhere

AlsPals · Jun 08, 2010, 11:24 AM // 11:24

Ah, classic MMs. Minion Factory PvP is fresh in my head....One necro sacs, rezmer, and keep raisin them POS till the clock was done. Then watch opponents spam chat with explitives when they are being squirted by dozens(I wanna say hundred easy) bone minions. Those were the days.

zwei2stein · Jun 08, 2010, 11:52 AM // 11:52

In old days necromancers were not understood at all.

My favorite one was "Yeah, right, put 12 into sr, 12 into healing. Now when your teammate dies, you will have energy to delay his friend's death by two seconds! Primary necormancer healing s.u.c.k.s., noob, just uninstall."

Oh, how funny it is now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Then you suck.

Let me give you a tip on how to be better than a hero Minion Bomber:
Learn to run Order of Undeath without lots of self-heals.

You are still going to operate under peak efficiency for human necromancer player (do not use death magic ...), but o well, that is ancient debate.

I just wonder how this would change if death nova was more like dwaynas sorrow: targeting-friendly aoe allowing to ehcnant all minions in one cast.

Dame Laureline · Jun 08, 2010, 12:15 PM // 12:15

I highly dislike MM. It's like their dumb minions are taking all the fun to human players. As a necro I play blood magic. I'm unhappy lifestealing was nerfed, but i'ts still OK.

Xenomortis · Jun 08, 2010, 12:28 PM // 12:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

You are still going to operate under peak efficiency for human necromancer player (do not use death magic ...), but o well, that is ancient debate.

Yes, but that is not the point.

majoho · Jun 08, 2010, 12:46 PM // 12:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Then you suck.

Let me give you a tip on how to be better than a hero Minion Bomber:
Learn to run Order of Undeath without lots of self-heals.

Aww you HAD to make an insult, so I'm going to make the assumption that you have acne.

You seriously think any human can cast "death nova" better than a Hero?

Divine Ashes · Jun 08, 2010, 12:51 PM // 12:51

I used to run an MM in the old 5 man Oro runs like 4 years ago. Having 40-50 minions just crush everything on screen was and still is the greatest thing I've seen on GW lol.

Risus · Jun 08, 2010, 01:03 PM // 13:03

MM's aren't overpowered, especially in hard mode. If you ever say "Sabway much" then recognize that sabway is 3 MM's with bars specifically made to have the MM's excel in Hard Mode. Ever try running Discord in Hard Mode (or even NORMAL MODE) in an area with AoE? BaiBai minions.

And here is the fact about Death Nova on players vs AI. AI can find minions and cast on them immediately. Players have to mouse over the huge ball of minions, guess which one has Death Nova or not, repeat repeat repeat repeat. AI wins.

chullster · Jun 08, 2010, 01:41 PM // 13:41

Human MM's are still fun to play and powerful in HM. Have a go and see what happens when you have 12 bone fiends level 22-23, then hit OoU with Death magic at 21, and plant your 3 ebon wards, using the damage one first.

You need a necro/rit healer hero, or a human with good reflexes to keep up, but it's worth it for the fun. Greater damage for greater risk.