Curse

superraptors · May 13, 2012, 11:50 AM // 11:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Showtime

TL DR

just read up to the part where you are saying if you didn't own one your opinion doesn't mean squat, thats wrong i got a ded zhed from a friend for free, i honestly do not give a shit if the prices on it fell and if it lost its value, might have lost its uniqueness but its the thought that counts. im glad they made some of the high end minis acquireable now by the masses because this game will be dead soon so it is still going to be worthless(as it should be, non-droppable weapons should have always been the rarest things in the game).

drkn · May 13, 2012, 01:14 PM // 13:14

Quote:

Now, to explain, people have been buying asian minis to hold there money without having a stash full of ecto. As the years have passed and these pets have not been released, they have been a safe method of holding money.

Tbh this is the only valid argument on the 'anti' side provided in the whole thread. ANet screwed people's investments - not purposely, i guess, but they did. Denying that would be a sure sign of mental issues.
Then again, there were many more shifts in investments' value (investments as in: gold-holders, items used as currency 'higher' than platinum) throughout the game's history. Compare ectos from the beginning, from the SCs' peak and from now; compare armbraces at various moments of the game's life. Sure, all those changes were kind of playerbase-induced, in a sense that ANet did nothing that introduced them so directly as now, but keep in mind that UW SCs has become longer because of the developer's updates (heck, it was possible in the first place, making ectos at 4,5k each, because of ANet's decisions with the game).
Now, i would understand all the whining if adding the rarest pets to presents was ANet's tactic to fight off the uneven distribution of goods in the game; if they wanted to 'punish' the wealthiest both by devaluating their assessments and by making more random people somewhat on par with them, in terms of possessions. But i'm pretty sure that no one at ANet thought about it this way - ectos against merch stones that they simply found a good idea in it, honouring their 7y players not only by helping them with their HoMs (no white minis), but also by giving them off chance to get a very rare and thus cool pet. We might feel a little let down because of no new pets, simply because we got used to new shinies every april, but there's nothing really wrong about the course they chose.

To even elaborate a bit more on the topic of lost assessments, it's very comparable to real estate speculators and all kinds of traders - sure, they can anticipate some dwindlings of the market every now and then, but no one will really predict a total crash. Companies wouldn't go bankrupt if it was that easy.
There always are external forces having influence on our money power - in the wonderful world of video games, the developers are nearly almighty and, actually, it's quite okay - as long as they don't, purposely, destroy players' goods this or that way. And there was 'always' this small possibility that ANet eventually add asian pets to in-game sources, like Z-Chest - an idea postulated pretty often here, in Guru's Sardelac.

Now there's another issue - there has to eventually be a hard cap for how much you can pay for something, given how GW trades work. I do agree that the current cap of 100k per trade is ridiculous and removing any caps on storing gold, in the chest or at characters, would be one of the best updates ever. But that cap is there.
So, to 'ignore' it, people started using other currencies. Gold - plat - ecto - braces - minis. Ok, understendable.

Now, imagine that there was only one Kanaxai in the whole game, and the second rarest item - or at least minipet - was Vizu. The trick is that there would be substantially more Vizus - like 50 - but still that'd be second-best, only after the one Kanaxai (just theorising, and giving a plastic idea). So the Kanaxai would be probably worth 100k + 7 Vizus - because that's the most one can pay for another item.
Sounds right.
So, there's still only one Kanaxai, but much much more other minis, and other items, so that - in the extreme - they're devaluated below a stack of braces. Then the Kanaxai would be, at most, 100k + 7*250 braces - because there's no other way to trade more between two people.

Suddenly braces are made 50g each at a trader, so the Kanaxai is 100k + 7*250 ectos.
It still is the most expensive item in the whole game.
What happens then is more people store their money in ectos - because neither braces nor highend minis are reliable anymore. Prices of ectos skyrocket, affecting obsidian-wanna-haves, but essentially still keeping the Kanaxai worth hell-a-lot in rough gold. Sure, it'd probably be considerably less, but still much more than you'd need to buy everything you ever wanted - the difference wouldn't be that bad.

Now imagine someone happened in the opposite direction - within the current market, some new unique item type would be introduced. All things would be one-of-a-kind, and they'd be even rarer than asian pets. It doesn't matter what would it be, but for example think of mounts - let's ignore the game's mechanics now, we're talking only about the market and currencies.
So there are new mounts, ANet issued like 10 total, each one is different and unique, and they're actually of some use to people. How much would one be - seven Kanaxais?
And what if there are more mounts, comparable to pets right now - white, purp, gold and five truly unique green ones; the mounts (or whatever other item type - as i said, insert anything here) would become the 'higher' currency than the pets, pandas included.

What i'm saying is that if asian pets are indeed devaluated beyond being usable as highend currency, the braces and ectos will go considerably up in their value.
What i'm also saying is that everything about getting asian pets from birthday presents is fine, market-wise. Sure, some of the wealthiest who kept their fortunes in rarest pets would get their fortunes somewhat smaller, but still big enough to buy them whatever they need. And if you're collecting in-game, pixel-generated cash and highend pets as currency only for the sake of amassing imaginary wealth, then i have some really bad news for you.

Händler · May 13, 2012, 01:37 PM // 13:37

its not as simple as that man

there are weapons that are prolly even rarer than unded kanaxai like purelys q7 15^50 broad (before he custod it ofc) or that perfect uncond axe that is quite famous now on guru but still ppl were willin to pay more for an unded kana than they would have paid for those weapons and those weapons were at least of use compared to the kana

Ditto · May 13, 2012, 01:45 PM // 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordiego

I worked my ass off to get some of the asians in my hom. And I mean it literally, I sat in front of the screen mashing stuff for hrs... and for what? Now they give these minis for free?!

LET IT GO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Showtime

So why am I against the 7th years giving out asian minis. BECAUSE IT ISNT FAIR TO THE OWNERS/COLLECTORS OF ASIAN MINIS. This isn't the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing kiddie league where they dont keep score and both teams win. Well this didn't use to be, but now... Its all a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing sham. GWAMM/HOM/etc all bullshit. Give it to everyone. Make it as easy as showing up.

LET IT GO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ewon

This is not just QQ. I happen to disagree with a choice that Anet has made. If you are a mindless drone who is cool with anything that Anet does, congrats, you are simple money to them. You cannot take every disagreement with Anet as QQ, and whining. I'm sorry, but if you don't have an opinion, or you can step up and disagree with someone, I want nothing to do with you.

LET IT GO.

Breathe. Move on. If seeing a flying lawnmower and a smiling gorilla didn't make you smile and laugh at the situation then you really need to calm down and back away from your computer.

What exactly has anyone lost here? What did Anet take from anyone? Ego? Please. Time? It's your own damn fault for spending vast amounts of time pouring into a game for items that you MUST know may and will become utterly irrelevant someday.

If you weren't playing this game to have fun, you're doing it wrong.

I returned after 2 years to discover that many of my titles and rare items were not so rare and some more openly accessible. Big effing deal. I still love my shineys. Do I give half a shit about them, ultimately? Nah. THIS IS A GAME. I'll continue to enjoy what I have and enjoy the game until I make the switch to GW2. I've had fun. I can walk away at any time knowing that. And I have. I can say I personally feel like I've gotten my moneys worth out of these games. If you don't - sorry for you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Firestorm

What is this, occupy guild wars?

Pretty much. All we need is some guy taking a shit up against Professor Yakkington.

Premium Unleaded · May 13, 2012, 01:58 PM // 13:58

I suppose those people who are baww'ing their eyes out over this must have to delude themselves that they've not wasted away their lives grinding for pixels with no intrinsic value.

Reformed · May 13, 2012, 02:04 PM // 14:04

Rate seems exceptionally low, nothing to worry about. Dupe is a much larger issue seeing as how they could, in theory, saturate the market with an unlimited supply.

jayson · May 13, 2012, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ditto

If you weren't playing this game to have fun, you're doing it wrong.

This right here is what it's all about. Well said!

jazilla · May 13, 2012, 03:14 PM // 15:14

I am disappointed in the people that always update wiki for not getting all the "new" 7th year minis up on the wiki yet. People posted screens of what was in WiK and WoC gifts and boxes almost immediately after those things went live and they were up on the wiki in seconds. People post legitimate screens(not talking about the fake ones that are obvious, talking about the ones that are obviously real) and some of those pets still aren't on the list. Protecting your virtual investments over omitting info from the fan base is shady. Stop being shady.

ACWhammy · May 13, 2012, 03:19 PM // 15:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazilla

I am disappointed in the people that always update wiki for not getting all the "new" 7th year minis up on the wiki yet. People posted screens of what was in WiK and WoC gifts and boxes almost immediately after those things went live and they were up on the wiki in seconds. People post legitimate screens(not talking about the fake ones that are obvious, talking about the ones that are obviously real) and some of those pets still aren't on the list. Protecting your virtual investments over omitting info from the fan base is shady. Stop being shady.

Speaking of wiki, have Mini Oola and Ooze been confirmed? If so, they are not on the "miniature" page on the wiki, but they are on the "birthday present" page.

Kook~NBK~ · May 13, 2012, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACWhammy

Speaking of wiki, have Mini Oola and Ooze been confirmed? If so, they are not on the "miniature" page on the wiki, but they are on the "birthday present" page.

Yes, they both exist. I've seen people with 'em at various times.

MithranArkanere · May 13, 2012, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazilla

I am disappointed in the people that always update wiki for not getting all the "new" 7th year minis up on the wiki yet. People posted screens of what was in WiK and WoC gifts and boxes almost immediately after those things went live and they were up on the wiki in seconds. People post legitimate screens(not talking about the fake ones that are obvious, talking about the ones that are obviously real) and some of those pets still aren't on the list. Protecting your virtual investments over omitting info from the fan base is shady. Stop being shady.

That's one of the reasons I want to much an actual trade system in this game.
With the current system, it actually impossible to know the value of things. There's only estimations based on a limited set of players willing to trade.
The value a few players give to something is not the value it really has.

While external tools are limited to those that use it frequently and do not show the actual situation, an in-game market easily accessible while playing includes everyone as shows how things are with more accuracy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ditto

[...]

It's called "Elitism".

*runs from the flames*

It's the truth. Truth is like the asbestos of logic. No need to run from fires while bearing it.

No matter how much their paid for them, the origin of many of them was random.
The origin of these ones is till random, but instead being awarded to anyone, they are awarded to loyal players that had accounts older than 7 years.
The main difference now is that prices won't go up and up reaching ludicrous prices as these miniatures disappear by being customized or deleted along bans or when the owner 'leaves' GW to never come back.
As less players are in game willing to pay they'll go down, and older accounts have less activity they will go up. So their prices will probably move towards a more reasonable range, and more people will get to enjoy them.

If that's bad, may Kormir herself come here and say so before I end writing this post...
Nope. No goddess of truth. So it must be good.

Purely Purity · May 13, 2012, 07:50 PM // 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazilla

Freaking out about a virtual economy in a virtual world is border line crazy.

No, spending a lot of time (months, years) saving to get something very expensive only to have it devalued a few months later isn't just borderline crazy, but downright obscene and very infuriating.

If you think this is just about money, you're wrong (and very blind). High end minis used to be a sign of prestige and something you could be proud to have earned. Now all you have to do is double click on a birthday present. What's so proud about that?

Lordkrall · May 13, 2012, 07:51 PM // 19:51

So it just comes down to e-penis?

Purely Purity · May 13, 2012, 07:53 PM // 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coast

or some other weapons

(non custod sword)

Man up already coast xD

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lordkrall

So it just comes down to e-penis?

And no... It comes down to all the work you put into something being worth nothing and pissed all over when you were proud of your accomplishment. Its no different than buying a car with cash or finishing a mortgage only to have them stolen and be left on a curb with your fist up your butt.

Lordkrall · May 13, 2012, 08:07 PM // 20:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purely Purity

And no... It comes down to all the work you put into something being worth nothing and pissed all over when you were proud of your accomplishment. Its no different than buying a car with cash or finishing a mortgage only to have them stolen and be left on a curb with your fist up your butt.

Isn't that more or less the definition of e-penis?

Nerel · May 13, 2012, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purely Purity

No, spending a lot of time (months, years) saving to get something very expensive only to have it devalued a few months later isn't just borderline crazy, but downright obscene and very infuriating.

If you think this is just about money, you're wrong (and very blind). High end minis used to be a sign of prestige and something you could be proud to have earned. Now all you have to do is double click on a birthday present. What's so proud about that?

"Prestige" and "something earned"? Does that apply to the people who originally got the vast majority of these rare pets in a lottery?

Fear my prestigious random lottery skills!

The overwhelming number of these 'rare' minis were given to players at random, dumb luck at work. Just because you or others paid a fortune for them doesn't change that one bit.

Getting one 'randomly' from a 7th year present is no more or less 'prestigious' than getting one in a random lottery or other giveaway.

No matter, the QQs make it all worthwhile.

Seven 7th year gifts so far, ALL purples, nothing rare... a few char shaman's and an Oola for me... and I really don't care. I'd sell the rest of my 7th year presents but I don't care about the money either, I'm here for the entertainment

jayson · May 13, 2012, 08:47 PM // 20:47

Miniature Longhair Yeti

Japan region Netcafe promotion (500 were given through lucky draw)

Taiwan region Nightfall preview event GM game winning prizes (250 were given)
Nightfall title contest prizes (61 were given)

100 awarded by the PCGameplay (Netherlands and Belgium) golden miniature contest.
Brand the Bosses (2007) optional prize for a Winner, Honorable Mention or Finalist.
Europe Massive Mini Pet Giveaway

Given as prize to the finalists (unknown number awarded) of the Halloween Art Contest 2007

Miniature Naga Raincaller

Japan region Netcafe promotion (500 were given through lucky draw)

Taiwan region Nightfall preview event GM game winning prizes (250 were given)
Nightfall title contest prizes (61 were given)

Brand the Bosses (2007) optional prize for a Winner, Honorable Mention or Finalist.
Mini Mania Contest
Europe
100 awarded by the PCGameplay (Netherlands and Belgium) golden miniature contest. Massive Mini Pet Giveaway

Given as prize to the finalists (?? awarded) of the Halloween Art Contest 2007

Miniature Oni

Japan region Netcafe promotion (500 were given through lucky draw)

Taiwan region Nightfall preview event GM game winning prizes (250 were given)
Nightfall title contest prizes (61 were given)
Guild Wars Official blog lucky draw (10 were given)

Brand the Bosses (2007) optional prize for a Winner, Honorable Mention or Finalist.
Europe
100 awarded by the PCGameplay (Netherlands and Belgium) golden miniature contest. Massive Mini Pet Giveaway

Given as prize to the finalists (?? awarded) of the Halloween Art Contest 2007
7th Year Birthday Present

Miniature Island Guardian

Each Member of the Top 3 Teams in the Japanese Guild Wars Championship. (8 Members per team x 3 Teams = 24 Miniatures Given)
Taiwan Signup to Help New Players during the first two weeks of Nightfall Contest. 50th-99th People to sign up received Island Guardians (50th-99th People = 50 Miniatures Given)
Taiwan Nightfall Title Contest (61 Miniatures Given)
Halloween Art Contest 2007 prizes (10 awarded)
1 new one in Wintersday contest

Miniature Shiro'ken Assassin

A total of 75 of these miniatures were awarded to players as follows:
Europe: 20 awarded during PCGameplay's Massive Mini Pet Giveaway (Netherlands and Belgium)
North America: 45 given during the Mini Mania Contest.
Taiwan: 10 given in tournament

Miniature Zhed

Japan region Netcafe promotion (40 were given through lucky draw)

Taiwan region Guild Wars Official Blog (10 were given through lucky draw)

Europe Massive Mini Pet Giveaway (20 were given through lucky draw)

Miniature Vizu

Japan region Netcafe promotion (20 were given through lucky draw)

Taiwan region GW official blog lucky draw (9 prizes)

Europe
10 awarded by the PCGameplay (Netherlands and Belgium) golden miniature contest. Through the Massive Mini Pet Giveaway

Contest Halloween Art Contest 2007 (10 prizes)

7th Year Birthday Present [verification requested]

Look at the sum of these minis and the bolded words. Almost all of the minis were introduced through lucky draws and random contests which have nothing to do with "working hard" in GW.

It's not the fault of the players who also like these minis. It's the fault of players who value these minis so highly that they themselves raise the prices to unimaginable levels. If you worked so hard for the mini then go and complain to the person you bought it from because they're the one who charged you 18 thousand hours worh of "work" no one else, to get it. That may be a hard pill to swallow but it's good medicine. And Prestige? Do you honestly think the general playerbase even cares? You can say we like the minis and yeah, you'd be right. But most of us would be just happy to have one as opposed to making sure someone else doesn't. That's what defines a better player.

Selfish greed and the need to be recognized because you WASTED your time getting something that means so little to most other people is your own burden to bear.

KamikazeChicken · May 13, 2012, 08:58 PM // 20:58

I figured Anet would just add all those skins under different names and call it fair game a year or two ago. This works too, even though it's later than I expected. Here's hoping for Island Guardians!

T-Strudel · May 13, 2012, 09:08 PM // 21:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayson

It's not the fault of the players who also like these minis. It's the fault of players who value these minis so highly that they themselves raise the prices to unimaginable levels. If you worked so hard for the mini then go and complain to the person you bought it from because they're the one who charged you 18 thousand hours worh of "work" no one else, to get it. That may be a hard pill to swallow but it's good medicine. And Prestige? Do you honestly think the general playerbase even cares? You can say we like the minis and yeah, you'd be right. But most of us would be just happy to have one as opposed to making sure someone else doesn't. That's what defines a better player.

Selfish greed and the need to be recognized because you WASTED your time getting something that means so little to most other people is your own burden to bear.

This a thousand times.

**cosyfiep** · May 13, 2012, 09:19 PM // 21:19

I think that the FEW that are being introduced thru the presents will probably only replace the ones that were removed from the game on banned accounts--so we will probably be back to where it was in ...2007? I HIGHLY doubt that there will be TONS of these flooding the market (besides the supposedly duped ones---) so those high and epeen mighty can stay on their horses and the few LUCKY DRAWS amongst us may join them.

(by the time I get mine this will all be passed...so I will keep my 3 joras and mini kirin as no one really wants purples anyways).