Curse

Kuldebar Valiturus · Jan 26, 2007, 04:10 AM // 04:10

Just a time entry. The intervals set for logging are usually chosen with server load in mind. Polling every account very frequently would slow everything down to a crawl. So, an interval is selected.

On 2007-01-21 at 19:36:42.000 4 events occurred to the account during the window since the LAST update.

I'm just saying, I wouldn't be too hung up on the time stamps.

For example: on these forums you have a window of opportunity to EDIT your post before an edit tag is used to show the post was edited.

Andyke · Jan 26, 2007, 11:35 AM // 11:35

Yes thats true, but if you edit 4 of them the times will be different

Also I do not really like the 'key logger' excuse, if you ever used a key logger then you would know that the output is nothing more then a text file showing all the keystrokes you have made. It will never say 'my user id and password for guildwars are ...'. So a hacker will see a username in the form of an e-mail address and a password, there he goes but what is it for? Now unless you enter Guild Wars with the message 'Hellow I am in Guild Wars' its going to be a little harder then that, so if the hacker is not bothered with ready the whole logfile he might find out, download the game, install the game and log onto the game. Now it seems this hacker has the intention to do harm so he is going to delete characters, only 4 out of 8?? Wow what a rush! But its doubtful that this is going to be the case.

So lets presume that he installed some 3rd party software to who knows what ... with Guild Wars, the hacker in this case knows what Guild Wars is and has it installed. Now lets all presume that we are the hacker, what would we do in this situation. Right lets go trough all his chars and look for the rare skin weapons, lets go the vault and see if he has allot of gold and ecto's and other expensive materials. Yet it seems that in his case he still has all his gold and ecto's and other valuable materials, he even has 4 other chars and nothing is missing on those. So I think the thieving hacker is out of the question!

Lets not even go into virus, spyware or adware, they do not delete chars in GW.

A script? Yes, but then this is a very genius script, to be able to log in, select gw chars, recognize screen names (ocr technology) and start deleting them. I don't think so!!! The reason is very simple, it would delete everything and it doesn't make the process go any faster since its server side based and it cannot make the deletion go any faster.

As an IT engineer I receive this sort of situations on a dayly bases, not with GW of course, but files that disappear and so on, the biggest mistake is to make assumptions about what could have gone wrong, no you look at the evidence and make an analysis based on what you got. And what do we have here?

We have officials showing him a log file that 4 chars have been deleted at exactly the same time, now your explanation about log files doesn't make sense because log files don't poll every 30 seconds or even 60 seconds, if they would then they would need giant server rooms just to do that on its own. No my friend, log files are based on operations and it will only add a piece of information follow by a certain operation and it will use the exact time stamp for it.

We also have a mail stating that the operation occurred from his own IP address, I am afraid by doing so they have actually placed hackers out of the picture, so that leaves us with him deleting his own chars and as we know it is impossible to delete 4 chars at the same time client side.

But true evidence comes out of how people react and respond and the way Areanet is responding by not willing to respond on the matter anymore tells us allot. They seem to simply ignore him and the fact that he is a 'CUSTOMER' doesn't seem to interest them the least.

The fact that he spend allot of time to getting his chars were they were and to get them a nice armor and weapons is simply whipped of the table as if it doesn't matter, I even wonder if you can take legal actions against Areanet based on all of this.

Kuldebar Valiturus · Jan 26, 2007, 11:48 AM // 11:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andyke

We have officials showing him a log file that 4 chars have been deleted at exactly the same time, now your explanation about log files doesn't make sense because log files don't poll every 30 seconds or even 60 seconds, if they would then they would need giant server rooms just to do that on its own. No my friend, log files are based on operations and it will only add a piece of information follow by a certain operation and it will use the exact time stamp for it.

We also have a mail stating that the operation occurred from his own IP address, I am afraid by doing so they have actually placed hackers out of the picture, so that leaves us with him deleting his own chars and as we know it is impossible to delete 4 chars at the same time client side.

But true evidence comes out of how people react and respond and the way Areanet is responding by not willing to respond on the matter anymore tells us allot. They seem to simply ignore him and the fact that he is a 'CUSTOMER' doesn't seem to interest them the least.

The fact that he spend allot of time to getting his chars were they were and to get them a nice armor and weapons is simply whipped of the table as if it doesn't matter, I even wonder if you can take legal actions against Areanet.

OK...let's take a look at possibilities:

A. The OP is lying/misrepresenting.

B. ANet has a software bug/rogue account admin deleting characters.

C. The OP has a compromised account (ie. someone has access to his account and computer/or from the same IP)

Which out of the 3 is most probable?

Andyke · Jan 26, 2007, 01:46 PM // 13:46

Well being in the position that he is a friend, knowing that he has 1 computer, knowing that it isn't wireless, knowing that I was playing with him at the time that the event occurred.

I would go for B, and I am pretty sure that this might occur in a certain situation, but I guess we will talk again about it when it happens to you and you can't find any reason on your computer that might have caused this.

LaraManiac · Jan 26, 2007, 01:47 PM // 13:47

This is the job that ArenaNet should be doing - it's nice to read that there are quite a few of you out there that obviously understand more about the possiblilities of how this has happened than I do. But, gawd forbid, if this happened to me I wouldn't know anything about server logs, key loggers, OPs etc this is ArenaNet's job - I'm a customer and I've paid for my goods now I want the service I deserve.

I've been playing Guild Wars for almost two years now, never had a bad word to say about ArenaNet, in fact I considered them very highly, but this is a bad show - they can't just dismiss this issue with "It's your own fault - get over it!!!!!"

Kuldebar Valiturus · Jan 26, 2007, 02:05 PM // 14:05

I have an open ticket with ANet at the moment concerning PlayNC Master account issues, I received a non-automated reply first thing this morning.

In regards to Andy being a "witness' to the character deletions; I would only suggest to both you and the OP that there is very likely something not being accounted for here and it doesn't necessarily mean that ANet is to blame.

I've been a Guild Wars player for almost 2 years now but the only thing that comes close to this issue (that I heard about) was a case where deleting PvP only characters would also delete another character. Now, this was never confirmed, but it was posted about on this forum.

Most problems are repeatable. If they happen once, they tend to happen more than once, especially in electronics and software. So, time will tell.

Andyke · Jan 26, 2007, 02:16 PM // 14:16

They might not have another choice then to dismiss you and act like its your own fault. Let me elaborate on this and please tell me what you think of it.

If there is indeed a bug that causes for the lost of characters in a certain situation and Areanet is aware of it, will they admit to it?

I guess that the second question would need to be, can Areanet see the difference between chars lost in this way or chars been deleted by yourself.

If yes then Areanet should admit to it and take responsibility!

But what if they are aware of it and can't see the difference, if they admit to that then everyone can delete chars and star complaining and ask for compensation in whatever gold, ecto's and so on .... Because of the fact that they have stated in that past that they cannot restore chars in anyway, this would mean that they are maybe forced to lie about it?

I wonder what Gaile Gray will have to say about this, nothing much I presume since the technical department has stated that it would not elaborate any further on this matter.

Kuldebar Valiturus · Jan 26, 2007, 02:46 PM // 14:46

It's a tricky issue. Much like reporting a Dragon in your garage to the police, they show up at your house to take a look but don't see it. You explain to them that's because the Dragon is invisible.

It doesn't absolutely mean that you are wrong or delusional, maybe there is a Dragon, maybe it is invisible. But, the police can't deal with it.

Unfortunately, this is a Bermuda Triangle type problem. But, the truth will work it's way out.

If the problem has such a rare occurrence it may never be fixed.

But, bear in mind that Trouble Tickets produce a permanent record. You can go to PlayNC Support and review all the tickets that have been opened on your account. So, as evidence piles into ANet/PlayNC, any endemic problem regarding spontaneous character deletions will be staring them in the face.

LaraManiac · Jan 26, 2007, 04:26 PM // 16:26

But this is no comfort in the meantime for the players whose hardwork building up their various characters over the past two years is all just blown away in the wind!! Let me tell you if I had half of my characters deleted, no not half even just one of my characters deleted, I would play merry hell up. Come on ArenaNet you haven't let us down thus far why so now????