Gaile, why no official forums? - Guild Wars Forums

Tozen · Apr 05, 2005, 02:04 AM // 02:04

You do an amazing job at filling out posts on multiple sites and I have to commend you for that. You're by far one of the best Community Managers I've ever seen at a company.

It's not really that I don't love you posting on these forums, it's simply that I often feel that your hard efforts go to waste when being spread out so thinly. For example, today I checked your posts at gwonline.net and found no news of the "big project" until I went here.

I can only imagine the interaction between community and ArenaNet if you guys supported your own forums. If not that, then at least a "shredder" (see worldofwar.net) that could automatically link us to posts that you've made on other fansites.

Thank you!

Soiled Egg Roll · Apr 05, 2005, 02:50 AM // 02:50

Having an official forum would cost a lot of time and money. Right now, Arenanet doesn't have too much time, and I don't think they want to higher webmasters and people to moderate these forums. Also, if you look at the world of warcraft forums, you can see that it becomes nothing but spam, flames and complaints.

Synthos · Apr 05, 2005, 02:53 AM // 02:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soiled Egg Roll

you can see that it becomes nothing but spam, flames and complaints.

Thats been GuildWars forums recently as well :/
Somethin sure frustrated a whole bunch of people

Tozen · Apr 05, 2005, 03:00 AM // 03:00

That's true, but there are key differences between the ArenaNet Staff and the Blizzard Staff.

In a recent interview with Caydiem for WoW, she gave three answers to practically every question asked of her:

1. We're thinking about it.
2. No plans at this time.
3. I can't tell you at the moment.

This is opposed to ArenaNet giving us paragraph-long explanations to tough questions every single weak in their Fansite Friday (which I hope continues after the game is released.)

The key difference between ArenaNet and Blizzard is that ArenaNet has a full game plan buts bases A LOT more of their game off public requests than most companies. This isn't to say that they don't have boundaries set and their own primary plan that comes first, only that the community and ArenaNet really share a beautiful harmony.

To give an example of sharp contrast, I've been going to the Planetside forums for years now and have yet to see a single suggestion from their suggestions forum become a reality.

However, notice that this thread doesn't give ArenaNet only one option. Being able to read developer posts is important if any game related to the MMORPG genre hopes to succeed, and providing links works equally well.

Soiled Egg Roll · Apr 05, 2005, 03:01 AM // 03:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Synthos

Thats been GuildWars forums recently as well :/
Somethin sure frustrated a whole bunch of people

I think that's because everyone's getting anxious of the release. I know I am. 23 days till release, still seem so far away.

Inde · Apr 05, 2005, 03:05 AM // 03:05

Problem with official communities: To a certain degree, they hurt their fansite communities. They are also a chore moderating and managing.

Synthos · Apr 05, 2005, 03:08 AM // 03:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soiled Egg Roll

I think that's because everyone's getting anxious of the release. I know I am. 23 days till release, still seem so far away.

This forum im happy to say is allot more adult and respectfull then some other forums that ive seen. Its really pleasent

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tozen

That's true, but there are key differences between the ArenaNet Staff and the Blizzard Staff.

In a recent interview with Caydiem for WoW, she gave three answers to practically every question asked of her:

1. We're thinking about it.
2. No plans at this time.
3. I can't tell you at the moment.

This is opposed to ArenaNet giving us paragraph-long explanations to tough questions every single weak in their Fansite Friday (which I hope continues after the game is released.)

The key difference between ArenaNet and Blizzard is that ArenaNet has a full game plan buts bases A LOT more of their game off public requests than most companies. This isn't to say that they don't have boundaries set and their own primary plan that comes first, only that the community and ArenaNet really share a beautiful harmony.

To give an example of sharp contrast, I've been going to the Planetside forums for years now and have yet to see a single suggestion from their suggestions forum become a reality.

However, notice that this thread doesn't give ArenaNet only one option. Being able to read developer posts is important if any game related to the MMORPG genre hopes to succeed, and providing links works equally well.

That gives me a nice perspective of Areanet thank you

I really really enjoy that they take our suggestions, but i think the earlier days of beta testing the game were the best. The forums were allot more relaxed, with less people and better suggestions. Overall the community just seemed nicer, some of the other forums seem to be run by 13 year olds now getting away with the maximum they can short of being banned. I really hope once people get past the Korea thing or something else happens to distract the masses this will return.

Spooky · Apr 05, 2005, 03:48 AM // 03:48

My thoughts are probably going to seem biased, based on my position, but I actually prefer the way things are being done now as opposed to having one amalgamated "Official" forum.

Most of us that are involved on fansites (at least the older or larger ones) are also involved with the Alpha test. As such, we have a direct line to ArenaNet. Those that choose to make the most of this position can act as very efficient 'go-betweens' for the community to AN, and vice-versa. As an example, if we see something that we feel are good ideas or suggestions, we can distill it and present it directly to the people that need to hear these kind of things. The same goes for feedback on just about anything - ranging anywhere from customization to mission difficulties. This way, they get the information they need while continuing to go about their job - they don't have to peruse the convoluted mass that often becomes an Official forum in order to get it done.

It is also considerably easier to maintain order when things are divided up such as they are now. There is enough population among the bigger forums to keep them moving, but they're refined enough in their purpose that people can find one that they feel they are 'best suited' to. With one Official forum - people will feel that that is where they must post - which tends to draw very, very large numbers. Any time you put a lot of people together, there are going to be arguements, which begets trolling, which begets flame wars .. in the end, things tend to spiral down to the lowest common denominator. Managing a forum like that .. I know from experience, it is a full time job that offers no rewards, and especially no thanks.

Marksmann · Apr 05, 2005, 03:54 AM // 03:54

Well, I, for one, do indeed appreciate the effort that you, Spooky, and the other admins put into running things here. Consider yourself Thanked.

SSE4 · Apr 05, 2005, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooky

My thoughts are probably going to seem biased, based on my position, but I actually prefer the way things are being done now as opposed to having one amalgamated "Official" forum.

I pretty much agree with you. And although it's far easier to manage smaller "clusters", the presence of a several fan-based forums as opposed to one big official forum also allows multiple places for people to talk and converse without everyone going to one place. It also spreads influence easier, because with multiple "access" points to Guild Wars related forums and information, it is more widespread in scope, in that it will reach more people faster. There is a genuine feeling to community forums, because unlike "official" forums, individual fan-run forums are probably more accomodating to the new player in a sense.

Oh and I love the Eclair avatar btw.

Gaile Gray · Apr 05, 2005, 06:53 AM // 06:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tozen

This is opposed to ArenaNet giving us paragraph-long explanations to tough questions every single week in their Fansite Friday (which I hope continues after the game is released.)

I can't tell you how much this made me smile. I think "paragraph-long" is being kind. I believe I've gone on for multiple paragraphs sometimes.

The truth is, though, I've been sort of pondering if I should try not to go into so much detail. I mean, a quick, straightforward answer might do. But I also weighed the whole "trying to give value for each answer" thing, and making sure that if the answer was "we'll see," that you guys might know a bit more about just what it is we're considering as we weigh a suggestion or a new design concept. The question weeks ago about "Why can't we rejoin in the middle of a mission" had an extremely long answer (yes, I rambled

) but that was because it was important to me that I try to explain things, try to say "There's a ton to think about."

Things are seldom "Yes," but are mostly "Yes, because..." or "We believe yes, but have to think about A, B, and C." I figure when I was following game development, I would have given my eye teeth to know this sort of stuff, so I try my best to share with you guys, too.

Quote:

The key difference between ArenaNet and Blizzard is that ArenaNet has a full game plan buts bases A LOT more of their game off public requests than most companies. This isn't to say that they don't have boundaries set and their own primary plan that comes first, only that the community and ArenaNet really share a beautiful harmony.

Harmony. Great word! When you figure ArenaNet hired this CRM before they hit Employee No. 10, you know how important the community, and the individual members of the community, are to our team, and to Guild Wars. This is borne out by Guild Wars having the best community in the game industry. Seriously.

Now about that "Why no official forums," the answer lies in focus. We make games, and the fansites make great forums! We really like the eclectic and varied nature of our community; we love that each fan forum has a different tone and a different feel. It's like looking at a gallery of fine paintings -- all distinctive and valued. Official forums just aren't in our future; we have too much faith in places like this and too much interest in having a diverse and spectacularly personal community. Maybe in the future, but I somehow don't think so. When everyone is being so well served, why change?

William of Orange · Apr 05, 2005, 07:09 AM // 07:09

You can always trust highly involved and motivated fans to take the initiative and start on something great.

The multitude of good forums out there, and the exceptional forums which jump out from the good ones, have shown that people are committed to seeing Guild Wars going on to do great things for the gaming community, and also that we as a community wish to support the game in whatever ways we have open to us, whether it be through posting suggestions in the Official Suggestions thread or making use of the /bug or Bug Report threads in game and on the forums. For months now I've been looking forward for the release of Guild Wars, and these forums are a nice way to help me pass the time and to think about what I want to be doing once the game is released for public play.

Your answers to interview questions so far Gaile have been excellent, I would say that if you're ever hesitant as to whether or not you should go more in-depth on a certain subject, just go with the safe bet that people would give an arm and a leg (or

Quote:

my eye teeth

) to catch the low-down on what's happening with game progress and to entice us with those tantilizing teasers. You have shown so far that yourself and the ArenaNet staff in general does care about the community and will do what you can to make the Guild Wars experience fair and enjoyable.

Cheers.

Virtuoso · Apr 05, 2005, 12:37 PM // 12:37

Please don't make an official forum and please hire more CM's such as yourself. The WoW forums make me want to gouge my eyes out with a wooden spoon, and don't get my started on Caydiem or Enoyix (Fangtooth is not as bad). I think I'd get swiftly banned from these forums if I spoke my mind about those two...

-Virt

Apr 05, 2005, 02:04 AM // 02:04	#1
Tozen Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Apr 2005 Guild: All Senses Failed [aSF] Profession: A/N	Gaile, why no official forums? You do an amazing job at filling out posts on multiple sites and I have to commend you for that. You're by far one of the best Community Managers I've ever seen at a company. It's not really that I don't love you posting on these forums, it's simply that I often feel that your hard efforts go to waste when being spread out so thinly. For example, today I checked your posts at gwonline.net and found no news of the "big project" until I went here. I can only imagine the interaction between community and ArenaNet if you guys supported your own forums. If not that, then at least a "shredder" (see worldofwar.net) that could automatically link us to posts that you've made on other fansites. Thank you!

Apr 05, 2005, 02:50 AM // 02:50	#2
Soiled Egg Roll Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ripon, Wisconsin Guild: IVEX Profession: Mo/	Having an official forum would cost a lot of time and money. Right now, Arenanet doesn't have too much time, and I don't think they want to higher webmasters and people to moderate these forums. Also, if you look at the world of warcraft forums, you can see that it becomes nothing but spam, flames and complaints.

Apr 05, 2005, 03:00 AM // 03:00	#4
Tozen Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Apr 2005 Guild: All Senses Failed [aSF] Profession: A/N	That's true, but there are key differences between the ArenaNet Staff and the Blizzard Staff. In a recent interview with Caydiem for WoW, she gave three answers to practically every question asked of her: 1. We're thinking about it. 2. No plans at this time. 3. I can't tell you at the moment. This is opposed to ArenaNet giving us paragraph-long explanations to tough questions every single weak in their Fansite Friday (which I hope continues after the game is released.) The key difference between ArenaNet and Blizzard is that ArenaNet has a full game plan buts bases A LOT more of their game off public requests than most companies. This isn't to say that they don't have boundaries set and their own primary plan that comes first, only that the community and ArenaNet really share a beautiful harmony. To give an example of sharp contrast, I've been going to the Planetside forums for years now and have yet to see a single suggestion from their suggestions forum become a reality. However, notice that this thread doesn't give ArenaNet only one option. Being able to read developer posts is important if any game related to the MMORPG genre hopes to succeed, and providing links works equally well.

Apr 05, 2005, 03:05 AM // 03:05	#6
Inde Site Contributor Join Date: Dec 2004	Problem with official communities: To a certain degree, they hurt their fansite communities. They are also a chore moderating and managing.

Apr 05, 2005, 03:48 AM // 03:48	#8
Spooky Bokusatsu Tenshi Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bellevue, WA Guild: KEA Profession: E/Mo	My thoughts are probably going to seem biased, based on my position, but I actually prefer the way things are being done now as opposed to having one amalgamated "Official" forum. Most of us that are involved on fansites (at least the older or larger ones) are also involved with the Alpha test. As such, we have a direct line to ArenaNet. Those that choose to make the most of this position can act as very efficient 'go-betweens' for the community to AN, and vice-versa. As an example, if we see something that we feel are good ideas or suggestions, we can distill it and present it directly to the people that need to hear these kind of things. The same goes for feedback on just about anything - ranging anywhere from customization to mission difficulties. This way, they get the information they need while continuing to go about their job - they don't have to peruse the convoluted mass that often becomes an Official forum in order to get it done. It is also considerably easier to maintain order when things are divided up such as they are now. There is enough population among the bigger forums to keep them moving, but they're refined enough in their purpose that people can find one that they feel they are 'best suited' to. With one Official forum - people will feel that that is where they must post - which tends to draw very, very large numbers. Any time you put a lot of people together, there are going to be arguements, which begets trolling, which begets flame wars .. in the end, things tend to spiral down to the lowest common denominator. Managing a forum like that .. I know from experience, it is a full time job that offers no rewards, and especially no thanks.

Apr 05, 2005, 03:54 AM // 03:54	#9
Marksmann Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: In my house in America Guild: Knights of the Fell Republic, (KOFR) Profession: E/Mo	Well, I, for one, do indeed appreciate the effort that you, Spooky, and the other admins put into running things here. Consider yourself Thanked.

Apr 05, 2005, 12:37 PM // 12:37	#13
Virtuoso Krytan Explorer Join Date: Mar 2005	Please don't make an official forum and please hire more CM's such as yourself. The WoW forums make me want to gouge my eyes out with a wooden spoon, and don't get my started on Caydiem or Enoyix (Fangtooth is not as bad). I think I'd get swiftly banned from these forums if I spoke my mind about those two... -Virt