Underworld=Hard....no VERY HARD! - Page 3 - Guild Wars Forums

egads · Jun 13, 2005, 02:38 PM // 14:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kha

Other players who have played heavy defense warriors may have great builds and be just as good/better as I am, but from playing both extremes of a warrior in UW(heavy defense to heavy offense), I found a constant, higher DPS build will keep the group safer.

Thanks for the advice. For some reason I'd got it in my head that defense was the best way to go for all Warriors in PvE. I'll try loading up with more offensive skills to get those casters down faster.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dansamy

Yes, for every "x" exp you get, you receive "y" refund points.

Where x = 250 and y = 1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike

Don't bother going to the UW if your anything but a W/Mo As geting killed in ONE hit from full health in the UW is not what i call fun in fact i would call that stupid.

You're doing something wrong if you're dying that quickly. Are you Ascended with the best armour yet?

Weezer_Blue · Jun 13, 2005, 02:41 PM // 14:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wa$d

Im a lvl 20 acended warrior/monk, all infused 1.5K knights armor, max gold hammer and i cant get 3 feet without getting killed. I did the Underworld with a full group of lvl 20 infused and we kill about 6 mosters, then we died. am i missing something? i think if it is this hard for me it must be hard for many others! I think the difficulty should be turned down. (Dont get upset if you think it shouldn't its just my opinion, if u disagree then provide a reason for yourself)

I personally found the Underworld to be rediculously easy. All I've got to do is cast Protective Spirit and those Aatxes in the beginning can't do 100+ damage a hit. Are you missing something? Yeah. A protection monk or a geomancer spamming wards or a ranger or elementalist blinding everything in sight. Oh. And I hate to break it to you, but W/Mo's aren't invincible.

Sentinel · Jun 13, 2005, 04:30 PM // 16:30

The UW and Fissure take teamwork !!!!!

You need people that been there before and know what they are doing.
At least 2 W, 2 nukers, 2 healers and either a 3rd
warrior or a 3rd nuker and a long range puller.

Rules:
1: You bring mobs to you, you don't go to them.
2: You never pull the next mob until everyone is ready for it.
3: Someone calls targets and then everyone attacks that called
target. (nothing will get you killed faster than attacking seperate
targets)
4: Patience
5: If you are a noob in the UW or fissure(for me that means you haven't been there for more than 5 times each) listen to the others and follow their directions.
6: If you haven't finished the game you have no business in the UW/fissure.
(sounds harsh but it's the stinking truth. Go finish the missions in the ring of fire and then come back. You'll be a better player by then, a better team player as oppose to a team liability)

The warriors need to be smart and work together. Against heavy damage melee opponents like aatxes you need to block them first and prevent them from reaching the squishes in your team. Form a line and work on your strafing as means of blocking. The nukers will do the most damage after you block them but you need to have damage skills to finish them off. You also need skills to make yourself durable and give a chance to your healers to cast a healing spell or 2 :-)

Against mixed groups monks are a high priority target, then elementalists then mesmers and then the warriors. This is where calling targets needs to be perfect. Also that's where an interupt skill or 2 will do you the most good.
Nothing more annoying than hitting on a monk that keeps healing himself and the others.

I play a sword W/M and after messing a bit with my build I found the following to be a good compromise:

12 :sword
11 : healing
8: Smite

Sever artery
gash
savage slash
final thrust
healing breeze
healing hands
mending
baltazar's spirit

I cast Baltazar's spirit at the beggining, wait a bit until energy full, then
cast mending. Energy regeneration comes from B's spirit cause you WILL get attacked a lot.
Against Monks and other casters I save the SS for when they cast to not only interupt them but punish them for even trying to.

When I join a group for smites I switch SS for Baltazar's aura to help with the nuking since i can't even touch the damn little bugs...lol

Anyway, a good group, as always, will make the difference in this. With good groups I never touch my healing skills. With bad groups... well let's just stay I carry DP a lot...:-)

As a final note, there is a recipe of sorts for UW/fissure that an ever expanding group of players know about. You stick to the recipe and things are easy. You deviate from the recipe and things become harder.

Sent.-

Stayfrosty · Jun 13, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42

I admit it was hard at first.. but now my guild has a 5 man team we go out there with.. 2 monks, an ele (fire), a warior, and me, a smiting w/mo, basically what we do is this.. we let our warrior get 60 DP, then he removes all of his armor and after this we find that the enemies like to attack him only.. so then our monks cast PS and breeze/healing seed on him and he never dies ever.. and the ele/me sit back and nuke everything

Kha · Jun 13, 2005, 05:09 PM // 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stayfrosty

I admit it was hard at first.. but now my guild has a 5 man team we go out there with.. 2 monks, an ele (fire), a warior, and me, a smiting w/mo, basically what we do is this.. we let our warrior get 60 DP, then he removes all of his armor and after this we find that the enemies like to attack him only.. so then our monks cast PS and breeze/healing seed on him and he never dies ever.. and the ele/me sit back and nuke everything

Be in a group AND fight naked?

It's a dream come true to me. Is there somewhere I can sign up for this guild?

dansamy · Jun 13, 2005, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stayfrosty

I admit it was hard at first.. but now my guild has a 5 man team we go out there with.. 2 monks, an ele (fire), a warior, and me, a smiting w/mo, basically what we do is this.. we let our warrior get 60 DP, then he removes all of his armor and after this we find that the enemies like to attack him only.. so then our monks cast PS and breeze/healing seed on him and he never dies ever.. and the ele/me sit back and nuke everything

OMG! You have got to let me join you guys for one run. I would love to see the invincible naked warrior!

Spike · Jun 14, 2005, 12:59 AM // 00:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by egads

You're doing something wrong if you're dying that quickly. Are you Ascended with the best armour yet?

Yes i finished the game and got the best armour so had a friend and we BOTH got killed in ONE hit from full health. I will just stick to exploreing the southen shiverpeaks at least there i can survive more then 1 hit and it does'nt cost anything to enter and we don't need europe to have favour.

dansamy · Jun 14, 2005, 01:17 AM // 01:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike

Yes i finished the game and got the best armour so had a friend and we BOTH got killed in ONE hit from full health. I will just stick to exploreing the southen shiverpeaks at least there i can survive more then 1 hit and it does'nt cost anything to enter and we don't need europe to have favour.

LMAO! It's few and far between, but I have seen it happen.

Gbuslayer · Jun 14, 2005, 02:22 AM // 02:22

Quote:

(nothing will get you killed faster than attacking seperate

What about dancing naked in front of them?

Sentinel · Jun 14, 2005, 12:56 PM // 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gbuslayer

What about dancing naked in front of them?

I stand corrected. Dancing naked in front of the aaxte will get you killed way faster!!

In that light, I wonder who will die faster, a L 1 with full starting armor

or a naked L 20

stumpy · Jun 14, 2005, 05:01 PM // 17:01

I hope they dont make the underworld easier. Its all I got left. If I dont have anything challenging or at least too pass the time until chapter 2 comes with just as difficult creatures, then theres really nothing for me here anymore.

I enjoy jumping into a group or travelling with my guildies in u/w or fissure (vent conversations are great) meet some smart players ... then again you do leave yourself vulnerable when you pick up someone, because lets face it, a n00b in the u/w will get not only you dead, but your team. I love how they deal 200 damage, I saw a great picture of a nude character take over 750 damage (for giggles). I understand your frusteration with having the -30dp out the gate ... but can only offer you some peace of mind ... it will get better with experience. Moreso than not listen to the above posts. You need a definate protective monk, and 2 healers. Less tanks the better, no more than 2 or your making it harder on your healers, and coordination. Its harder to achieve this with random pick-up groups ... but if your serious about playing in here, take your time to build a group that (all members) have the time to play ... then you will all gel together as the battles progress.

Creston · Jun 14, 2005, 05:48 PM // 17:48

You know, I never really considered the benefits of protection spells, but now that I see just how much damage some of these things do, I'm really beginning to reconsider my viewpoint. Protective spirit always seemed useless to me (I mean, there's so few monsters that even DO 40-50 damage per blow that it didn't seem worth it.)
But against monsters that do 250 damage per blow, hehe, suddenly that 40 seems a whole lot better.

Great thread.

Creston

Pandora's box · Jun 14, 2005, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by stumpy

I hope they dont make the underworld easier. Its all I got left. If I dont have anything challenging or at least too pass the time until chapter 2 comes with just as difficult creatures, then theres really nothing for me here anymore.

To my opinion every corner of this game should be available for everyone, and a solo player should be able to beat every level. This is clearly not the case with underworld/fissure. Without starting a discussion about teamplay etc. again, the solution for this all is simple (and I wonder why ex-Blizzard employes did not think of this): Let the AI determine how many chr's are playing a level and ajust the monster levels to this. It has been done succesfully in Diablo II: Lord of destruction. With every person entering the map the monsters grew stronger. The same can be done with rewards. This way underworld/fissure will stay as tough as they are for an 8 player party, and when 1 player enters he/she can have a tough game too... But no longer impossible!

Coldplayer44 · Jun 14, 2005, 06:41 PM // 18:41

I am not to the underworld yet but what are the levels and types of monsters u fight down there.

dansamy · Jun 15, 2005, 02:24 AM // 02:24

I think they were all at least level 24.

Spike · Jun 15, 2005, 02:41 AM // 02:41

try lvl 29 at least thats the one that killed me in one hit. I can handle lvl 24's as thats whats around droknars forge.

Duality · Jun 15, 2005, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sentinel

6: If you haven't finished the game you have no business in the UW/fissure.
(sounds harsh but it's the stinking truth. Go finish the missions in the ring of fire and then come back. You'll be a better player by then, a better team player as oppose to a team liability)

i'm going to disagree with this one. i haven't finished the game with my mo/me, and i was the only healer, with phaedrus being the protection monk, and our group did fine. whether or not someone -has- finished a mission they haven't tried yet has no bearing on thier ability to be a good team player.

Kha · Jun 15, 2005, 02:47 AM // 02:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sentinel

6: If you haven't finished the game you have no business in the UW/fissure.
(sounds harsh but it's the stinking truth. Go finish the missions in the ring of fire and then come back. You'll be a better player by then, a better team player as oppose to a team liability)

Not even close to the truth. People have been playing UW since beta. Last missions do not prepare you any more for UW than completing up to Sanctum Cay in beta. All you need is how to make an effective build, ability to understand your foes and allies, and common sense.

Sentinel · Jun 15, 2005, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kha

Not even close to the truth. People have been playing UW since beta. Last missions do not prepare you any more for UW than completing up to Sanctum Cay in beta. All you need is how to make an effective build, ability to understand your foes and allies, and common sense.

Up to Sactum Cay? Come on Kha, that's not even 2/3s of the game.
You really want 2 or 3 people that just completed Sactum Cay in your group
before you enter UW?
I guess it's doable if they are uber competent but boy that's awfully risky.
They don't even have access to Elite skills yet until much later than Sactum Cay.
I know, Elite skills are not required for UW but it's nice to have the option
when you tweak your build.

Couple of days ago I joined a group that was asking for a tank. The leader was a L18 and there was a L17 and a L19. I ask the guys if they have done this before. They said NO. I asked, 'are you guys even ascented yet?',
they said 'no but we seem to be doing ok'

Would you have stayed in that group Kha? I'm sorry but I only have a couple of hours every other night available to play the game and I don't want to waste my time in doomed groups like that.

I don't know how things were in beta. I wasn't part of that. I know this though: I would never say to people that finished Sactum Cay: 'You are now ready for the UW' That's just crazy talk

Well, that's my opinion anyway and for my 125g I'd rather join a group with as much experience as possible. My success rate in UW has improved greatly ever since I realised that.

dansamy · Jun 15, 2005, 03:40 PM // 15:40

Some of the monsters are level 24. I was in there again last night and made note of the levels of critters that we were killing. I'm going to agree with some of the other posters in here that once you learn how to handle it, UW is not as hard as you thought. Can I last for hours down there? Without a good team, no. With a good team, maybe. Provided that no one gets stupid.

Jun 13, 2005, 04:30 PM // 16:30	#43
Sentinel Academy Page Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somerset, NJ Guild: aB	The UW and Fissure take teamwork !!!!! You need people that been there before and know what they are doing. At least 2 W, 2 nukers, 2 healers and either a 3rd warrior or a 3rd nuker and a long range puller. Rules: 1: You bring mobs to you, you don't go to them. 2: You never pull the next mob until everyone is ready for it. 3: Someone calls targets and then everyone attacks that called target. (nothing will get you killed faster than attacking seperate targets) 4: Patience 5: If you are a noob in the UW or fissure(for me that means you haven't been there for more than 5 times each) listen to the others and follow their directions. 6: If you haven't finished the game you have no business in the UW/fissure. (sounds harsh but it's the stinking truth. Go finish the missions in the ring of fire and then come back. You'll be a better player by then, a better team player as oppose to a team liability) The warriors need to be smart and work together. Against heavy damage melee opponents like aatxes you need to block them first and prevent them from reaching the squishes in your team. Form a line and work on your strafing as means of blocking. The nukers will do the most damage after you block them but you need to have damage skills to finish them off. You also need skills to make yourself durable and give a chance to your healers to cast a healing spell or 2 :-) Against mixed groups monks are a high priority target, then elementalists then mesmers and then the warriors. This is where calling targets needs to be perfect. Also that's where an interupt skill or 2 will do you the most good. Nothing more annoying than hitting on a monk that keeps healing himself and the others. I play a sword W/M and after messing a bit with my build I found the following to be a good compromise: 12 :sword 11 : healing 8: Smite Sever artery gash savage slash final thrust healing breeze healing hands mending baltazar's spirit I cast Baltazar's spirit at the beggining, wait a bit until energy full, then cast mending. Energy regeneration comes from B's spirit cause you WILL get attacked a lot. Against Monks and other casters I save the SS for when they cast to not only interupt them but punish them for even trying to. When I join a group for smites I switch SS for Baltazar's aura to help with the nuking since i can't even touch the damn little bugs...lol Anyway, a good group, as always, will make the difference in this. With good groups I never touch my healing skills. With bad groups... well let's just stay I carry DP a lot...:-) As a final note, there is a recipe of sorts for UW/fissure that an ever expanding group of players know about. You stick to the recipe and things are easy. You deviate from the recipe and things become harder. Sent.-

Jun 13, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42	#44
Stayfrosty Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: May 2005 Guild: Marduke guild	I admit it was hard at first.. but now my guild has a 5 man team we go out there with.. 2 monks, an ele (fire), a warior, and me, a smiting w/mo, basically what we do is this.. we let our warrior get 60 DP, then he removes all of his armor and after this we find that the enemies like to attack him only.. so then our monks cast PS and breeze/healing seed on him and he never dies ever.. and the ele/me sit back and nuke everything

Jun 14, 2005, 05:01 PM // 17:01	#51
stumpy Jungle Guide Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Canucklehead BC, Canada Guild: Advanced Necro Undead Society	I hope they dont make the underworld easier. Its all I got left. If I dont have anything challenging or at least too pass the time until chapter 2 comes with just as difficult creatures, then theres really nothing for me here anymore. I enjoy jumping into a group or travelling with my guildies in u/w or fissure (vent conversations are great) meet some smart players ... then again you do leave yourself vulnerable when you pick up someone, because lets face it, a n00b in the u/w will get not only you dead, but your team. I love how they deal 200 damage, I saw a great picture of a nude character take over 750 damage (for giggles). I understand your frusteration with having the -30dp out the gate ... but can only offer you some peace of mind ... it will get better with experience. Moreso than not listen to the above posts. You need a definate protective monk, and 2 healers. Less tanks the better, no more than 2 or your making it harder on your healers, and coordination. Its harder to achieve this with random pick-up groups ... but if your serious about playing in here, take your time to build a group that (all members) have the time to play ... then you will all gel together as the battles progress.

Jun 14, 2005, 05:48 PM // 17:48	#52
Creston Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: May 2005	You know, I never really considered the benefits of protection spells, but now that I see just how much damage some of these things do, I'm really beginning to reconsider my viewpoint. Protective spirit always seemed useless to me (I mean, there's so few monsters that even DO 40-50 damage per blow that it didn't seem worth it.) But against monsters that do 250 damage per blow, hehe, suddenly that 40 seems a whole lot better. Great thread. Creston

Jun 14, 2005, 06:41 PM // 18:41	#54
Coldplayer44 Ascalonian Squire Join Date: May 2005 Location: Amarillo, Texas Guild: Warriors Oath Profession: W/E	I am not to the underworld yet but what are the levels and types of monsters u fight down there.

Jun 15, 2005, 02:24 AM // 02:24	#55
dansamy Chasing Dragons Join Date: May 2005 Location: Lost in La-La Land Guild: LFGuild Profession: Mo/Me	I think they were all at least level 24.

Jun 15, 2005, 02:41 AM // 02:41	#56
Spike Jungle Guide Join Date: May 2005 Location: In front of my PC Guild: Kai Profession: E/Mo	try lvl 29 at least thats the one that killed me in one hit. I can handle lvl 24's as thats whats around droknars forge.

Jun 15, 2005, 03:40 PM // 15:40	#60
dansamy Chasing Dragons Join Date: May 2005 Location: Lost in La-La Land Guild: LFGuild Profession: Mo/Me	Some of the monsters are level 24. I was in there again last night and made note of the levels of critters that we were killing. I'm going to agree with some of the other posters in here that once you learn how to handle it, UW is not as hard as you thought. Can I last for hours down there? Without a good team, no. With a good team, maybe. Provided that no one gets stupid.