Does not Stone Summit Carver = dwarf? - Guild Wars Forums

Cobalt · Sep 06, 2005, 01:13 PM // 13:13

I am totally ticked right now, spent 3 days getting the pieces to make a killer dwarfslaying axe to use in the new Sorrows Furnace and it appears to be a POS!

I got a max +15>50 axe put a +19dmg vs dwarfs and customized it for +20dmg which should stack and give me +54 dmg vs dwarves.

I popped over to Granite Citadel walked outside and attacked a Stone Summit Carver and only averaged -4 dmg hits!

A Stone Summit Carver is considered a Dwarf in the game right?

Akimb0 · Sep 06, 2005, 01:17 PM // 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobalt

I am totally ticked right now, spent 3 days getting the pieces to make a killer dwarfslaying axe to use in the new Sorrows Furnace and it appears to be a POS!

I got a max +15>50 axe put a +19dmg vs dwarfs and customized it for +20dmg which should stack and give me +54 dmg vs dwarves.

I popped over to Granite Citadel walked outside and attacked a Stone Summit Carver and only averaged -4 dmg hits!

A Stone Summit Carver is considered a Dwarf in the game right?

theyre stone summit, so yes. Whats the actual damage on your weapon? im assuming max, was it 1 vs 1 or other factors? Does GW have a serious amount of flaws? yes.

Armada Hunter · Sep 06, 2005, 01:22 PM // 13:22

I hope you notice that it's percentage and not directly attack power that gets raised.

15% 19% 20%

Rancour · Sep 06, 2005, 01:24 PM // 13:24

That might be a possiblity.

Could it be that it says something like "19% more damage vs. Dwarves (when enchanted/hexed/in stance)"

Akimb0 · Sep 06, 2005, 01:30 PM // 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armada Hunter

I hope you notice that it's percentage and not directly attack power that gets raised.

15% 19% 20%

54% yes, so to be doing 4 dmg he must of only been doing around 3 to start with.

Cobalt · Sep 06, 2005, 01:49 PM // 13:49

Here is a pick of what I am using this shows -5 hit I get between -7 and -3.
perhaps the VS mods just dont stack right. I got a nice +20% deathbane axe grip that I was going to use for an axe for Fissure and UW but dont think so now.

Endowed Johnson · Sep 06, 2005, 01:54 PM // 13:54

ok, max dmg axe = 5-28
+15% = 0.90 - 4.2
+19% = 1.14 - 5.32
+20% = 1.20 - 5.60
__________________
TOTAL = 9.24 - 43.12 BEFORE armor is considered into it.

Lets assume you are fighting a lvl 20 character even though every mob after droknar's is already higher than that. Further assumed is armor of 80, and 0% armor penetration. That will reduce it to 6.53 - 30.49. This DOES NOT factor in absorption by means of runes nor armor type. Now lets assume since you are fighting a dwarf of higher level, that he actually has a higher armor level than you... say 100. It further reduces to 4.62 - 21.56. Again, that isn't factoring in absorption thru runes or armor type.... nor from level difference. I would suggest you go Necro subclass and use weaken armor.

Calculator used = http://www.guildwarsguru.com/calculators/guru_armor.php

Another place to look is your Axe Attribute level. If it is less than 12, you are only doing a percentage of the max damage for the weapon.

ApOcAlYpSe · Sep 06, 2005, 02:28 PM // 14:28

Do you have the appropriate level in your axe mastery? that kind of dmg kind of looks like you are hitting a critical with one of the starter weapons.

just a thought.

Cobalt · Sep 06, 2005, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endowed Johnson

Another place to look is your Axe Attribute level. If it is less than 12, you are only doing a percentage of the max damage for the weapon.

My Axe Attribute level is at 12 so thats fine but by seeing the math the VS mods are virtually useless at least with dwarves (although I got some hits in the low 20"s with Pent Blow), Anet did armor overkill with them. I think I am much better off using a +armor or + health mod but will wait and see what level they are in Sorrows Furnace. If they are level 24 or higher I probably won't waste my time with using Warrior just use my Ele instead it can actualy do some real damage to them.

Akimb0 · Sep 06, 2005, 02:31 PM // 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endowed Johnson

ok, max dmg axe = 5-28
+15% = 0.90 - 4.2
+19% = 1.14 - 5.32
+20% = 1.20 - 5.60
__________________
TOTAL = 9.24 - 43.12 BEFORE armor is considered into it.

Lets assume you are fighting a lvl 20 character even though every mob after droknar's is already higher than that. Further assumed is armor of 80, and 0% armor penetration. That will reduce it to 6.53 - 30.49. This DOES NOT factor in absorption by means of runes nor armor type. Now lets assume since you are fighting a dwarf of higher level, that he actually has a higher armor level than you... say 100. It further reduces to 4.62 - 21.56. Again, that isn't factoring in absorption thru runes or armor type.... nor from level difference. I would suggest you go Necro subclass and use weaken armor.

Calculator used = http://www.guildwarsguru.com/calculators/guru_armor.php

Another place to look is your Axe Attribute level. If it is less than 12, you are only doing a percentage of the max damage for the weapon.

but even if he had armour 100....the dmg range is still higher than he is currently dealing, and even max absobtion rune wouldnt change this. gg Anet - bugged half ass game.

ChoKILLate[FDG] · Sep 06, 2005, 03:08 PM // 15:08

What is your strength at? This helps armor pierce!....and why the hell aren't you using Executioner's strike, cyclone axe, or Penetrating blow!? Eventually you also want Evicerate! Remember you are fighting level 24 dwarfs, so armor penetration is important.

Also, did they cast any spells on you like weakness that we just can't see from your screen? One more thing, I found it usefully to get a helm that specializes in each weapon mastery. Then I add a major rune that is identical to the helm. This gives me a +3 to each weapon, and all I have to do is change out helms!

I will try with my warrior who has a non-max damage axe with sundering (armor penetration). I will take note of a regular hit and one with Exectionoer's strike.

striderkaaru · Sep 06, 2005, 03:17 PM // 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobalt

Here is a pick of what I am using this shows -5 hit I get between -7 and -3.
perhaps the VS mods just dont stack right. I got a nice +20% deathbane axe grip that I was going to use for an axe for Fissure and UW but dont think so now.

as a warrior, your primary purpose in the fissure or uw is to tank the aggro, not to deal damage. that's the nuker's job. i would say forget about the +dmg% grips and go fortitude, defense, or enchanting.

nailz · Sep 06, 2005, 03:21 PM // 15:21

fortitude grips are useless junk. But like striderkaaru said...your job isn't to deal damage...it's to absorb damage

Cobalt · Sep 06, 2005, 03:31 PM // 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoKILLate[FDG]

What is your strength at? This helps armor pierce!....and why the hell aren't you using Executioner's strike, cyclone axe, or Penetrating blow!? Eventually you also want Evicerate! Remember you are fighting level 24 dwarfs, so armor penetration is important.

Also, did they cast any spells on you like weakness that we just can't see from your screen? One more thing, I found it usefully to get a helm that specializes in each weapon mastery. Then I add a major rune that is identical to the helm. This gives me a +3 to each weapon, and all I have to do is change out helms!

I updated the pic it is smaller but full view as you can see no spells.

I did try with Penetrating blow and hit in the lower 20"s.I also tried with my other axe that has +20 below and +30 health and custom +20 and got better dmg near full health then I did with the Dwarfslaying axe. I just don't think the VS dmg is stacking correctly with other +dmg mods, it seems like the VS mod is doing minus instead of plus for its portion.

Lord Bentam · Sep 06, 2005, 03:52 PM // 15:52

I've noticed the same thing .. My R/W Axe warrior is hitting low 5-6's on anything .. but if I use skills it goes up to 20 or so .. Bug?

Endowed Johnson · Sep 06, 2005, 04:29 PM // 16:29

no, not a bug. Your attribute lvl, your level vs mob lvl, absorption, and armor level all play a part in it. Most people don't even consider the level difference for starters.

ChoKILLate[FDG] · Sep 06, 2005, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Ok, I went back to the same exact area with my axe warrior. His mastery is 15 and strength is 10. The axe I use is a Sundering gold sephis axe. It does 5-26 (not max), damage +13%, armor pen +10% (10% chance), armor +7 vs elemental attacks, customized +20%.

My normal damage was between 9-14. My average was 12. When I used Executioner's strike, I did between 45-60 damage, with ave being 54.

What is your strength?

Cobalt · Sep 06, 2005, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoKILLate[FDG]

What is your strength?

I have 12 axe and 10 stren 11 tac (shield req)

Savio · Sep 06, 2005, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobalt

I am totally ticked right now, spent 3 days getting the pieces to make a killer dwarfslaying axe to use in the new Sorrows Furnace and it appears to be a POS!

I got a max +15>50 axe put a +19dmg vs dwarfs and customized it for +20dmg which should stack and give me +54 dmg vs dwarves.

I popped over to Granite Citadel walked outside and attacked a Stone Summit Carver and only averaged -4 dmg hits!

A Stone Summit Carver is considered a Dwarf in the game right?

I'd assume that Stone Summit are Dwarves, since you don't fight the Deldrimor Dwarves

I should state that you should be using more Axe attack skills and put more points into Axe mastery (14 would be ideal for PvE) if you want to do some real damage. Against high level mobs, especially heavily armored Warriors/Carvers and Rangers, you aren't going to do much damage with normal attacks. Note that the mobs themselves aren't doing much more damage than you are doing.

Using the damage calculator, some iffy math, and the approximate damage range you were dealing (3-7 damage), it seems like the Stone Summit have approximately 140-150 armor, assuming no damage absorption. Subtract the max shield, and you get about 120-130 armor, which sounds okay considering they're higher level Warriors then you.

If we calculate in -2 damage absorption (Knight's/Ascalon/whatever they wear) however, then they have 120-130 armor total, 100-110 armor without the shield, which sounds closer to the standard human Warrior setup. -4 damage absorption (armor and shield) would give you a base armor rating of 110-120 armor with the shield (90-100 without). I'm not for certain how the mechanics of damage on enemies go though.

I tested this out earlier by myself, with 14 Axe Mastery and 9 Strength, and got about the same damage against Carvers doing normal attacks with my max, non-customized Sundering Pickaxe of Warding with +12% while in a stance. I'm thinking that perhaps they have high armor vs physical attacks? I'll have to test this with my Icy Axe later.

Barazur · Sep 30, 2005, 09:12 PM // 21:12

This thread stimulated my curiosity and so I did the following test:

SETUP
Strenght 12, Sword 14, Tactics 2
NO SKILL used (this is base damage).
NO condition or hex over me or the target foe.
At least 30 swings have been done with each weapon to ensure consistency.

FOES
A. lvl 13 skeleton rangers outside Bergen
(will test more)

WEAPON 1 (my old winglbade):
max dmg 15-22 Sword req11
+15%>50%
+20% customized
dmg 24-50

WEAPON 2 (skeletonslaying):
max dmg 15-22 Sword req9
+15%>50%
+20% vs. skeletons
+20% customized
dmg 29-59

WEAPON 3 (deathbane):
max dmg 15-22 Sword req9
+15%>50%
+20% vs. undead
+20% customized
dmg 29-59

Conclusions
1. Skeletons ARE undeads.
2. The 20% additional damage is calculated after the other mods or so it seems.
3. IMHO is worth it.

Sep 06, 2005, 01:13 PM // 13:13	#1
Cobalt Krytan Explorer Join Date: Aug 2005 Profession: Mo/W	Does not Stone Summit Carver = dwarf? I am totally ticked right now, spent 3 days getting the pieces to make a killer dwarfslaying axe to use in the new Sorrows Furnace and it appears to be a POS! I got a max +15>50 axe put a +19dmg vs dwarfs and customized it for +20dmg which should stack and give me +54 dmg vs dwarves. I popped over to Granite Citadel walked outside and attacked a Stone Summit Carver and only averaged -4 dmg hits! A Stone Summit Carver is considered a Dwarf in the game right?

Sep 06, 2005, 01:49 PM // 13:49	#6
Cobalt Krytan Explorer Join Date: Aug 2005 Profession: Mo/W	Here is a pick of what I am using this shows -5 hit I get between -7 and -3. perhaps the VS mods just dont stack right. I got a nice +20% deathbane axe grip that I was going to use for an axe for Fissure and UW but dont think so now. Last edited by Cobalt; Sep 06, 2005 at 03:22 PM // 15:22..

Sep 06, 2005, 03:08 PM // 15:08	#11
ChoKILLate[FDG] Krytan Explorer Join Date: Jul 2005 Guild: [FDG]-Fudge Profession: Mo/Me	What is your strength at? This helps armor pierce!....and why the hell aren't you using Executioner's strike, cyclone axe, or Penetrating blow!? Eventually you also want Evicerate! Remember you are fighting level 24 dwarfs, so armor penetration is important. Also, did they cast any spells on you like weakness that we just can't see from your screen? One more thing, I found it usefully to get a helm that specializes in each weapon mastery. Then I add a major rune that is identical to the helm. This gives me a +3 to each weapon, and all I have to do is change out helms! I will try with my warrior who has a non-max damage axe with sundering (armor penetration). I will take note of a regular hit and one with Exectionoer's strike. Last edited by ChoKILLate[FDG]; Sep 06, 2005 at 03:17 PM // 15:17..

Sep 06, 2005, 05:44 PM // 17:44	#17
ChoKILLate[FDG] Krytan Explorer Join Date: Jul 2005 Guild: [FDG]-Fudge Profession: Mo/Me	Ok, I went back to the same exact area with my axe warrior. His mastery is 15 and strength is 10. The axe I use is a Sundering gold sephis axe. It does 5-26 (not max), damage +13%, armor pen +10% (10% chance), armor +7 vs elemental attacks, customized +20%. My normal damage was between 9-14. My average was 12. When I used Executioner's strike, I did between 45-60 damage, with ave being 54. What is your strength? Last edited by ChoKILLate[FDG]; Sep 06, 2005 at 05:46 PM // 17:46..

Sep 30, 2005, 09:12 PM // 21:12	#20
Barazur Jungle Guide Join Date: Aug 2005 Guild: Arcana Animi [ARAN] (Currently recruiting) Profession: W/	deathbane and skeletonslayer This thread stimulated my curiosity and so I did the following test: SETUP Strenght 12, Sword 14, Tactics 2 NO SKILL used (this is base damage). NO condition or hex over me or the target foe. At least 30 swings have been done with each weapon to ensure consistency. FOES A. lvl 13 skeleton rangers outside Bergen (will test more) WEAPON 1 (my old winglbade): max dmg 15-22 Sword req11 +15%>50% +20% customized dmg 24-50 WEAPON 2 (skeletonslaying): max dmg 15-22 Sword req9 +15%>50% +20% vs. skeletons +20% customized dmg 29-59 WEAPON 3 (deathbane): max dmg 15-22 Sword req9 +15%>50% +20% vs. undead +20% customized dmg 29-59 Conclusions 1. Skeletons ARE undeads. 2. The 20% additional damage is calculated after the other mods or so it seems. 3. IMHO is worth it.

Sep 06, 2005, 01:22 PM // 13:22	#3
Armada Hunter Academy Page Join Date: Apr 2005	I hope you notice that it's percentage and not directly attack power that gets raised. 15% 19% 20%

Sep 06, 2005, 01:24 PM // 13:24	#4
Rancour Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Camp Rancor (Rancour :D) Guild: I'm a free spirit (that's not what the guild is called, I just am) Profession: W/R	That might be a possiblity. Could it be that it says something like "19% more damage vs. Dwarves (when enchanted/hexed/in stance)"

Sep 06, 2005, 01:54 PM // 13:54	#7
Endowed Johnson Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Aug 2005 Guild: Male Order Brides Profession: Mo/	ok, max dmg axe = 5-28 +15% = 0.90 - 4.2 +19% = 1.14 - 5.32 +20% = 1.20 - 5.60 __________________ TOTAL = 9.24 - 43.12 BEFORE armor is considered into it. Lets assume you are fighting a lvl 20 character even though every mob after droknar's is already higher than that. Further assumed is armor of 80, and 0% armor penetration. That will reduce it to 6.53 - 30.49. This DOES NOT factor in absorption by means of runes nor armor type. Now lets assume since you are fighting a dwarf of higher level, that he actually has a higher armor level than you... say 100. It further reduces to 4.62 - 21.56. Again, that isn't factoring in absorption thru runes or armor type.... nor from level difference. I would suggest you go Necro subclass and use weaken armor. Calculator used = http://www.guildwarsguru.com/calculators/guru_armor.php Another place to look is your Axe Attribute level. If it is less than 12, you are only doing a percentage of the max damage for the weapon.

Sep 06, 2005, 02:28 PM // 14:28	#8
ApOcAlYpSe Academy Page Join Date: Mar 2005	Do you have the appropriate level in your axe mastery? that kind of dmg kind of looks like you are hitting a critical with one of the starter weapons. just a thought.

Sep 06, 2005, 03:21 PM // 15:21	#13
nailz Banned Join Date: Aug 2005	fortitude grips are useless junk. But like striderkaaru said...your job isn't to deal damage...it's to absorb damage

Sep 06, 2005, 03:52 PM // 15:52	#15
Lord Bentam Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: May 2005 Location: Around the corner. Guild: Muffins of Wrath (MoW) Profession: Mo/Me	I've noticed the same thing .. My R/W Axe warrior is hitting low 5-6's on anything .. but if I use skills it goes up to 20 or so .. Bug?

Sep 06, 2005, 04:29 PM // 16:29	#16
Endowed Johnson Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Aug 2005 Guild: Male Order Brides Profession: Mo/	no, not a bug. Your attribute lvl, your level vs mob lvl, absorption, and armor level all play a part in it. Most people don't even consider the level difference for starters.