Question About Assassin Daggers (Zealous) - Guild Wars Forums

Government Flu · Jun 25, 2007, 09:12 AM // 09:12

Okay, so my assassin is close to beating Nightfall, and I'm probably going to go on to Factions. I have two perfect weapons for green farming with him, so that's not an issue. However, I think I'd like an edge before I go back to Factions...

Here's my question: I've noticed many of the assassin daggers are zealous, and with critical eye and the chance to double strike, the energy gain is decent...but I spam 5 energy attack skills along with a few that cost 10. (Utilities, mainly.)

Are zealous daggers worth the minus 1 energy degen? Please share your input. I'd especially like to hear from people who have an assassin as their primary character and have used them as much as I use my warrior.

Skuld · Jun 25, 2007, 09:26 AM // 09:26

1 pip of energy regen provides 1 energy every 3 seconds.

Daggers hit every 1.33 seconds, that is 1 energy every 1.33 seconds.

Factor in double strikes, 16 dagger mastery can hit every 0.99 seconds.

You've lost 1 energy every 3 seconds and gained 1 energy every 0.99 seconds at 16 dagger mastery.

As long as you are hitting in combat, very much worth it

Ferret · Jun 25, 2007, 10:07 AM // 10:07

I pretty much only use zealous daggers with my Assassin, they are generally the best option to keep your skills going without running out of energy.
I do have 20/20 daggers too, but rarely use them.

samcobra · Jun 25, 2007, 12:46 PM // 12:46

sundering is shit, especially on daggers. The low base damage and high rate of attack means vamp is much more useful for daggers. Also, if you're talking about pve, then it really doesn't matter, since you use stupid shit like critical eye that you just DONT have room for on a real assassin bar. That being said, if you're running 13 crit and not having energy problems, I'd suggest vamp daggers. Zealous is quite useful if you're running an energy intensive combo where you spend energy faster than you regain from crit strikes. This usually involves multiple 10-energy skills chained together or spamming things with moebius without adequate crit spec.

Destinyy · Jun 25, 2007, 01:00 PM // 13:00

Full radients, NF skin daggers with +5e and zealous = hardly ever running out of energy...

I run 40E on my sin and never have E problems, and I don't need to use Critical eye or anything like that...

So yeah, Zealous is fef worth it dude!!!

Alas Poor Yorick · Jun 25, 2007, 01:24 PM // 13:24

Zealous works very well

In fact, because of zealous, my favorite daggers are ones that are very unpopular with most sins. I love Kenshi's Butterfly Daggers. They have a double negative energy attribute: -5 to balance +15% damage all the time and the -1 regain from zealous. But I found that with high dagger mastery I was usually gaining energy fast enough that the -5 energy to begin with didn't matter and the +15% damage added to the 20% for customizing them made a huge difference. They are not good for every situation but I love them for general purpose fighting.

On a somewhat related note - does anyone know any builds that actually use furious daggers? It would almost have to be A/W of somekind.

zknifeh · Jun 25, 2007, 01:34 PM // 13:34

zealous daggers are awsome... its pretty much all i use. altho if im running a build that has high critical chance and good emanagement(i.e.[skill]black lotus strike[/skill]) then i switch to my shiros daggers. so zealous are definately worth it

Government Flu · Jun 25, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27

(Hopefully this didn't double post.)

Okay, well...I run a build that uses 12 critical strikes, 11 dagger mastery, and 11 shadow arts. Will zealous still yield a bigger bonus of energy for me?

HawkofStorms · Jun 25, 2007, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Zealous is technically worth it on every weapon except the slower attacking ones like hammer and scyles (though since they can hit multiple foes at once it balances out). If you use any sort of Increased Attack Speed or aoe attack its also works out.

You will always get improved energy with the +1 energy per hit weapons, so long as you are hitting your foe (ie a build where you don't attack a lot, or as long as you aren't blinded or constantly getting blocked).

dargon · Jun 25, 2007, 08:47 PM // 20:47

Government Flu: one thing to note about your attributes, if you get your critical strikes up to 13, you'll get 3 energy each time you get a critical hit, at 12 you only get 2.

Sergeant of Marines · Jun 25, 2007, 11:54 PM // 23:54

I personally Like Zealous on Daggers, it is well worth it, IMO I think that the 20/20 ap is the worst mod you can put on a weapon for a melee characters.

Skuld · Jun 26, 2007, 08:02 AM // 08:02

Quote:

On a somewhat related note - does anyone know any builds that actually use furious daggers? It would almost have to be A/W of somekind.

Try "Watch Yourself!" + Soldier's Defense (though you probably won't get any use out of the furious, "Watch Yourself!" charges up fast enough, heh).

Jun 25, 2007, 09:12 AM // 09:12	#1
Government Flu Krytan Explorer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Guild: Paradoxa Zoloft Asylum [PXZ] Profession: W/R	Question About Assassin Daggers (Zealous) Okay, so my assassin is close to beating Nightfall, and I'm probably going to go on to Factions. I have two perfect weapons for green farming with him, so that's not an issue. However, I think I'd like an edge before I go back to Factions... Here's my question: I've noticed many of the assassin daggers are zealous, and with critical eye and the chance to double strike, the energy gain is decent...but I spam 5 energy attack skills along with a few that cost 10. (Utilities, mainly.) Are zealous daggers worth the minus 1 energy degen? Please share your input. I'd especially like to hear from people who have an assassin as their primary character and have used them as much as I use my warrior.

Jun 25, 2007, 10:07 AM // 10:07	#3
Ferret Elite Guru Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: England Guild: Ferrets Unity of Rogues (FUR) Profession: R/Mo	I pretty much only use zealous daggers with my Assassin, they are generally the best option to keep your skills going without running out of energy. I do have 20/20 daggers too, but rarely use them. __________________

Jun 25, 2007, 09:26 AM // 09:26	#2
Skuld Furnace Stoker Join Date: Sep 2005 Guild: Thousend Tigers Apund Ur Head [Ttgr] Profession: A/	1 pip of energy regen provides 1 energy every 3 seconds. Daggers hit every 1.33 seconds, that is 1 energy every 1.33 seconds. Factor in double strikes, 16 dagger mastery can hit every 0.99 seconds. You've lost 1 energy every 3 seconds and gained 1 energy every 0.99 seconds at 16 dagger mastery. As long as you are hitting in combat, very much worth it

Jun 25, 2007, 12:46 PM // 12:46	#4
samcobra Krytan Explorer Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: USA Profession: Mo/Me	sundering is shit, especially on daggers. The low base damage and high rate of attack means vamp is much more useful for daggers. Also, if you're talking about pve, then it really doesn't matter, since you use stupid shit like critical eye that you just DONT have room for on a real assassin bar. That being said, if you're running 13 crit and not having energy problems, I'd suggest vamp daggers. Zealous is quite useful if you're running an energy intensive combo where you spend energy faster than you regain from crit strikes. This usually involves multiple 10-energy skills chained together or spamming things with moebius without adequate crit spec.

Jun 25, 2007, 01:00 PM // 13:00	#5
Destinyy Banned Join Date: Mar 2007 Guild: Faction of War [ARES]	Full radients, NF skin daggers with +5e and zealous = hardly ever running out of energy... I run 40E on my sin and never have E problems, and I don't need to use Critical eye or anything like that... So yeah, Zealous is fef worth it dude!!!

Jun 25, 2007, 01:24 PM // 13:24	#6
Alas Poor Yorick Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Mar 2007	Zealous works very well In fact, because of zealous, my favorite daggers are ones that are very unpopular with most sins. I love Kenshi's Butterfly Daggers. They have a double negative energy attribute: -5 to balance +15% damage all the time and the -1 regain from zealous. But I found that with high dagger mastery I was usually gaining energy fast enough that the -5 energy to begin with didn't matter and the +15% damage added to the 20% for customizing them made a huge difference. They are not good for every situation but I love them for general purpose fighting. On a somewhat related note - does anyone know any builds that actually use furious daggers? It would almost have to be A/W of somekind.

Jun 25, 2007, 01:34 PM // 13:34	#7
zknifeh Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Kamadan Guild: Acolites of Anguish [aOa] Profession: A/	zealous daggers are awsome... its pretty much all i use. altho if im running a build that has high critical chance and good emanagement(i.e.[skill]black lotus strike[/skill]) then i switch to my shiros daggers. so zealous are definately worth it

Jun 25, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27	#8
Government Flu Krytan Explorer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Guild: Paradoxa Zoloft Asylum [PXZ] Profession: W/R	(Hopefully this didn't double post.) Okay, well...I run a build that uses 12 critical strikes, 11 dagger mastery, and 11 shadow arts. Will zealous still yield a bigger bonus of energy for me?

Jun 25, 2007, 08:24 PM // 20:24	#9
HawkofStorms Hall Hero Join Date: Aug 2005 Profession: E/	Zealous is technically worth it on every weapon except the slower attacking ones like hammer and scyles (though since they can hit multiple foes at once it balances out). If you use any sort of Increased Attack Speed or aoe attack its also works out. You will always get improved energy with the +1 energy per hit weapons, so long as you are hitting your foe (ie a build where you don't attack a lot, or as long as you aren't blinded or constantly getting blocked).

Jun 25, 2007, 08:47 PM // 20:47	#10
dargon Furnace Stoker Join Date: May 2005 Guild: The Seraphim Knights [TSK] Profession: R/	Government Flu: one thing to note about your attributes, if you get your critical strikes up to 13, you'll get 3 energy each time you get a critical hit, at 12 you only get 2.

Jun 25, 2007, 11:54 PM // 23:54	#11
Sergeant of Marines Desert Nomad Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Japan Guild: [트두므s], Guild Leader Profession: Mo/	I personally Like Zealous on Daggers, it is well worth it, IMO I think that the 20/20 ap is the worst mod you can put on a weapon for a melee characters.