-5 vs. -2 shields - Page 2 - Guild Wars Forums

Zodiak · Mar 10, 2008, 03:33 PM // 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by KamikazeChicken

You're always better off using +armor shields.

I have some old style Tyrian shields that have both:

-2dmg while stance -2 while enchanted
-2dmg while X +10AR vs X
-5dmg(20%) & +10AR vs X

on them. Those 3 kind of shields are my favorite

Gift3d · Mar 10, 2008, 04:07 PM // 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bohya

-2 is conditional

5/20 is uncondititinal

Honestly this sums it up. It depends what your skill bar looks like and what type of character you're playing. It's not a contest, it is a preference.

Magikarp · Mar 10, 2008, 04:17 PM // 16:17

-5 20% is a no from me, especially me being a mainstream warrior.

i want more armor from my explorable area/arena. moar sheelds meen moar guud.

HawkofStorms · Mar 10, 2008, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

Get the point. GW is not about bad and good. Its about rare! -5 20% is rarer and thus exclusie and more disirable. Its all about the epeen and the money!

That is kinda correct. Perfect -5 20% mods are rare, and thus expensive, so people think they are good. The same reason why 20/20 sundering mods are expensive and rare (because there is more variations and possibilities to get 17/20, 18/20, and 19/20 mods). Dumb people think big numbers = better, so they pay more.

kobey · Mar 10, 2008, 04:59 PM // 16:59

Oh and retirees like me tend to use 20/20 and -5(20%) too

since I don't bring the shield or sword out to kill anymore, having it "perfect" or look nicer is more important

Zodiak · Mar 10, 2008, 05:13 PM // 17:13

What happens though with the -2dmg While in Stance mod is that, it really isnt conditional that much if you think about it.

While Drunken Master may not be the BEST stance in the game, it WILL last for 90 seconds and give you a 15% increased attack and movement speed while not drunk.

That alone can be good/bad depending on your view, but what it WILL do is give you 90 seconds of activation for your shield's -2dmg while in stance mod.

Chthon · Mar 10, 2008, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagmaRed

For PvE, a stance/enchantment shield is better, as long as you have the ability to use those skills. Consider it, with rough numbers.

-2/stance (and using a stance essentially 100% of the time)

You get hit 100 times, you take -200 damage.

-5/20% (and assuming the 20% works exactly 20%)

You get hit 100 times (damage reduction accurs 20 times), you take -100 damage.

So in a perfect scenario (stance/enchant, etc. are all guaranteed) you take half as much damage with a -2 shield than with a -5 shield.

Now, a Paragon has no stances, and neither do most casters. So unless you are using a stance skill of some kind, or working with an enchantment based build/team, you would do better with a -5/20%

As mentioned, if you do something with a Bonder, then the -2/enchant is the best option.

PvP, however, will see most people using multiple shields with multiple mods, and switching based on your enemy.

This post sums everything up pretty much perfectly.

PvP - Get a whole collection of 10 AL vs X shields.
PvE - Unless you want to spend a char slot on a squire to carry your massive shield collection, get -2 stance/ench, whichever your build supports.

michaelhunter81 · Mar 11, 2008, 12:34 PM // 12:34

guess I should have metioned earlier that i was talking about a warrior.

well thanks alot guys all this info should help out.

Keithark · Mar 11, 2008, 12:56 PM // 12:56

My warrior usually has a blind reduction or cripple reduction mod on the shield, he has plenty of armor but can't kill anything if he cant see

Faer · Mar 11, 2008, 01:28 PM // 13:28

A -2, -5, or -3 physical damage shield doesn't do shit against anything else. A set of +10AL shields will protect you from just about everything.

That being said, -2 > -5, but +10AL > *.

fenix · Mar 11, 2008, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Yeah, Faer is right. There's NO reason to use a -5 (20%) or even a -2 when you can use a +10 AL. It's silly to do so, because the +10 will help you 100% of the time, whereas the -2 and -5 are ONLY vs physical damage, so aren't very helpful at all.

That being said, the 20% shorter Blind/Cripple are both excellent choices as well.

Rushin Roulette · Mar 11, 2008, 01:52 PM // 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenix

Yeah, Faer is right. There's NO reason to use a -5 (20%) or even a -2 when you can use a +10 AL. It's silly to do so, because the +10 will help you 100% of the time, whereas the -2 and -5 are ONLY vs physical damage, so aren't very helpful at all.

That being said, the 20% shorter Blind/Cripple are both excellent choices as well.

That being said, the same applies to the +10AL mods, they are even more conditional.

The -2 to -5 mods are against physical which is blunt, slashing and piercing.

+10AL for physical is only against one particualr type of damage; slashing, piercing, or blunt. If you are carrying a +piercing shield and get hit by a hammer warrior, you get +0AR for that attack.

Having said that, +10AR is nearly always better if you have the correct shield at the right time... but for lazy players like me I still prefere to have one -3/+60HP^hexed shield and maybe a -2/+45^enchanted/stanced.

fenix · Mar 11, 2008, 01:56 PM // 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rushin Roulette

That being said, the same applies to the +10AL mods, they are even more conditional.

The -2 to -5 mods are against physical which is blunt, slashing and piercing.

+10AL for physical is only against one particualr type of damage; slashing, piercing, or blunt. If you are carrying a +piercing shield and get hit by a hammer warrior, you get +0AR for that attack.

Having said that, +10AR is nearly always better if you have the correct shield at the right time... but for lazy players like me I still prefere to have one -3/+60HP^hexed shield and maybe a -2/+45^enchanted/stanced.

True, but +10 shields are for every single damage type in the game (except the silly ones, like Chaos and Holy). So really, they are the best option, unless you have no money...then go with 20% shorter condition, or settle for a common damage type (ie, Fire)

Div · Mar 11, 2008, 06:11 PM // 18:11

-5/20% works out to be a 1 physical damage reduction every hit. -2/stance works out to be a 2 physical damage reduction every hit. If you have drunken master or something, then the -2 is obviously...twice as good. However, neither compare with something like +10 vs slashing or piercing, as it can prevent 10-20 damage a hit about 50% of the time while fighting physicals (which works out to a lot more than the other crappy mods).

Chthon · Mar 11, 2008, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenix

Yeah, Faer is right. There's NO reason to use a -5 (20%) or even a -2 when you can use a +10 AL. It's silly to do so, because the +10 will help you 100% of the time, whereas the -2 and -5 are ONLY vs physical damage, so aren't very helpful at all.

That depends on the mobs. If you're fighting a homogeneous mob of ice imps, a +10AL vs Cold shield is going to work on every hit. If you're fighting a mixed mob of Kournans, the warriors aren't going to politely stand there and wait for you to change off the fire shield that works against the eles to your slashing shield, and the paragons aren't going to wait for you to change off the slashing shield to your piercing shield, etc. Against most mixed mobs, +10AL vs X is often going to end up applying to a small percentage of the hits you take. On the other hand, -2 stance/ench is likely to apply to 60%-70% of the hits you take (since most mixed mobs are skewed towards physicals and physicals attack faster). That makes -2 stance/ench a better choice for most mixed mobs.

[edit: 10AL vs slashing might keep up with -2 stance/ench against some mixed mobs, particularly in earlier parts of the game without paragons and assassins adding so much piercing damage to the mix.]

-5 20% is only a good mod if you're facing mixed mobs and you've just got no way to keep up a stance or enchantment at all (not even an enchantment coming from a teammate). Otherwise it's junk.

Sword · Mar 11, 2008, 06:38 PM // 18:38

-5 20% is absolute garbage

Mar 11, 2008, 01:28 PM // 13:28	#30
Faer La-Li-Lu-Le-Lo Join Date: Feb 2006	A -2, -5, or -3 physical damage shield doesn't do shit against anything else. A set of +10AL shields will protect you from just about everything. That being said, -2 > -5, but +10AL > *. __________________ Stay Breezy

Mar 10, 2008, 04:17 PM // 16:17	#23
Magikarp Desert Nomad Join Date: Nov 2007 Guild: [HAWK]	-5 20% is a no from me, especially me being a mainstream warrior. i want more armor from my explorable area/arena. moar sheelds meen moar guud.

Mar 10, 2008, 04:59 PM // 16:59	#25
kobey GW Retiree Join Date: Nov 2005 Guild: Sg Unknown [KATE] Profession: W/	Oh and retirees like me tend to use 20/20 and -5(20%) too since I don't bring the shield or sword out to kill anymore, having it "perfect" or look nicer is more important

Mar 10, 2008, 05:13 PM // 17:13	#26
Zodiak Jungle Guide Join Date: May 2005 Location: Gatineau, Qc, Canada Guild: Kiss of Anguish [KISS] Profession: P/W	What happens though with the -2dmg While in Stance mod is that, it really isnt conditional that much if you think about it. While Drunken Master may not be the BEST stance in the game, it WILL last for 90 seconds and give you a 15% increased attack and movement speed while not drunk. That alone can be good/bad depending on your view, but what it WILL do is give you 90 seconds of activation for your shield's -2dmg while in stance mod.

Mar 11, 2008, 12:34 PM // 12:34	#28
michaelhunter81 Academy Page Join Date: Apr 2006 Guild: House Valhaad Profession: W/D	guess I should have metioned earlier that i was talking about a warrior. well thanks alot guys all this info should help out.

Mar 11, 2008, 12:56 PM // 12:56	#29
Keithark Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Nov 2006 Guild: Be Aggressive B E Aggressive [AGRO] Profession: E/Me	My warrior usually has a blind reduction or cripple reduction mod on the shield, he has plenty of armor but can't kill anything if he cant see

Mar 11, 2008, 01:40 PM // 13:40	#31
fenix Major-General Awesome Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Aussie Trolling Crew HQ - Event Organiser and IRC Tiger Guild: Ex Talionis [Law], Trinity of the Ascended [ToA] ????????????????&# Profession: W/	Yeah, Faer is right. There's NO reason to use a -5 (20%) or even a -2 when you can use a +10 AL. It's silly to do so, because the +10 will help you 100% of the time, whereas the -2 and -5 are ONLY vs physical damage, so aren't very helpful at all. That being said, the 20% shorter Blind/Cripple are both excellent choices as well.

Mar 11, 2008, 06:11 PM // 18:11	#34
Div I like yumy food! Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Where I can eat yumy food Guild: Dead Alley [dR] Profession: Mo/R	-5/20% works out to be a 1 physical damage reduction every hit. -2/stance works out to be a 2 physical damage reduction every hit. If you have drunken master or something, then the -2 is obviously...twice as good. However, neither compare with something like +10 vs slashing or piercing, as it can prevent 10-20 damage a hit about 50% of the time while fighting physicals (which works out to a lot more than the other crappy mods).

Mar 11, 2008, 06:38 PM // 18:38	#36
Sword Jungle Guide Join Date: Jun 2006 Profession: Mo/	-5 20% is absolute garbage