+3 energy vs +30 armor - Page 3 - Guild Wars Forums

Avarre · Apr 30, 2008, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Kal

More health doesn't change your rate of health recovery. Hence, in a prolonged conflict, survivors will not stop you running out of health. If health is an issue, change build or playstyle.

Except rate of health recovery is nonexistent as players do not rely on regen.

Painbringer · Apr 30, 2008, 03:17 PM // 15:17

Most of the time it all depends what I find on the way adventuring

I am cheap

The Meth · Apr 30, 2008, 03:20 PM // 15:20

+ energy mods are useless until you are at 0 energy.
+ health mods are useless until you are at 0 health.
+ armor mods are effectively 'health management', helping you all the time.

The difference? You can control your energy pretty well, or at least you should be able to. Not to mention with good swapping you have +47 energy on a weapon swap. Your health on the other hand is at the whims of the enemy. Having that small + health buffer is often the difference between life and death vs. a spike. Against pressure however, it is best to have + armor mods on, then switch to + health on when in danger of death, thereby getting the best out of both mods.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Kal

More health doesn't change your rate of health recovery. Hence, in a prolonged conflict, survivors will not stop you running out of health. If health is an issue, change build or playstyle.

This is partially true. More accurately, instead of saying survivor's doesn't change your rate of health recovery, you should say it doesn't save you health. Armor effectively heals you, because you take less damage in the first place. In PvE, this is completely true, because there you aren't entering the area expecting to get that low on health in the first place. But in PvP the difference between the half second you gain from +60 health is more then enough time to get a life saving heal.

snaek · Apr 30, 2008, 03:22 PM // 15:22

pve = radiants
pvp = survivors

i usually wear teh +al equip on my chest, and sometimes legs
depending on my class/insignias available

spells (non-projectile) always target chest
mostly everything else is like...
~45% chance to hit chest?
~30% chance to hit legs?
~8% chance for other pieces?

i cant remember teh exact numbers,
can someone confirm the exact numbers?

JR · Apr 30, 2008, 03:23 PM // 15:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Kal

More health doesn't change your rate of health recovery. Hence, in a prolonged conflict, survivors will not stop you running out of health. If health is an issue, change build or playstyle.

Energy regens in combat, health does not. Therefore, max health is infinately more important than max energy. Especially when you take into account (as others have said) your health is always at the mercy of your enemy, and your energy rarely is.

Tzalaran · Apr 30, 2008, 03:23 PM // 15:23

i've always used Radiant on my chest and legs for my P/Me.

he needs the extra 5 energy with the builds i've always used.

imo, most armor insignias are worthless since they only affect the piece of armor they are on now, and i've never had a situation where a character i play has full survivors and was left with < 40 HP. if you are getting that low, your dead anyway... (my necro with full radiant has come out of battles in UW with 11 HP before though... and without the extra 8 energy i wouldn't have gotten off the killing spell...)

to each their own. one school of though isn't correct and the other invalid... its what works best for that individual.

The Meth · Apr 30, 2008, 03:29 PM // 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tzalaran

i've always used Radiant on my chest and legs for my P/Me.
he needs the extra 5 energy with the builds i've always used.
imo, most armor insignias are worthless since they only affect the piece of armor they are on now, and i've never had a situation where a character i play has full survivors and was left with < 40 HP. if you are getting that low, your dead anyway... (my necro with full radiant has come out of battles in UW with 11 HP before though... and without the extra 8 energy i wouldn't have gotten off the killing spell...)
to each their own. one school of though isn't correct and the other invalid... its what works best for that individual.

You shouldn't be needing just 5 more energy on the two classes in the game who's primary attributes are effectively infinite energy machines. Besides, you realize on your necro you could have just swapped to a high energy set and gotten 30 more energy, and at the same time had greater armor or health right?

In your case, yes +energy is correct, but only because your builds are bad ones that can't effectively manage energy in the first place.

snaek · Apr 30, 2008, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR

The only possible logic behind this statement is 'PvE is easy so it doesn't matter what you take anyway'. Other than that, you are wrong. If your build actually gets a tangible benefit from radiant then you would be using it in PvE or PvP. The point is that in 90% of situations this is not the case, and survivors is simply better.

i'm going to assume that u dun pve?

surviving in pve relies more on ur skills (spells/chants, etc...not 1337 skillz)

and since skills usuallly require u to use energy,
having more energy is a good idea

the fact is, if ur not protted...ur gonna be takin excess of +200dps
thats constant dps...not a 600dmg spike in 3s...

in pvp...u get hit wit a 600dmg spike...then they have cooldown
so +25hp will save u in pvp...

Tyla · Apr 30, 2008, 03:43 PM // 15:43

Ya, Snaek, but Radiants don't change the fact that if your build is running out of energy you need more energy management, or just need to use your build effectively.

snaek · Apr 30, 2008, 03:44 PM // 15:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Ya, Snaek, but Radiants don't change the fact that if your build is running out of energy you need more energy management, or just need to use your build effectively.

perhaps...perhaps not...
but in either case, if u look at teh situation
u'll see that its still more beneficial than survivors

its also due to the fact that ppl want to effieciently complete areas as fast as possible
perhaps radiants dun help u kill things faster....
but survivors surely dun help at all wit this

even if really really did need more survivablity....+al is better...y?

cuz who ai chooses to attack works like this:
1st check = closest proximity
2nd check = lowest al
3rd check = lowest hp

The Meth · Apr 30, 2008, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

i'm going to assume that u dun pve?
surviving in pve relies more on ur skills (spells/chants, etc...not 1337 skillz)
and since skills usuallly require u to use energy,
having more energy is a good idea
the fact is, if ur not protted...ur gonna be takin excess of +200dps
thats constant dps...not a 600dmg spike in 3s...
in pvp...u get hit wit a 600dmg spike...then they have cooldown
so +25hp will save u in pvp...

Having 5 more energy doesn't save you in high level PvE, having passive protection saves you in high level PvE. And 200 DPS? Not against anything less then a boss. You also seem to forget that a simple weapon swap is +30 energy compared to your pitiful radiants.

And dun maek u're postss liek dis.

MirkoTeran · Apr 30, 2008, 03:46 PM // 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

junk

To start with something similar as you, I'm going to assume you don't play PvE very well.

Aside from few farming/gimick builds there is no good reason to use radiant insignias. Ever. Like stated a few times above, high energy pool does not equal energy management. If you that desperately need some energy to cast a spell, switch to high-energy set for a while. If you are still having problems then its time to revisit your build(personal and/or team) or play-style/skill.

Tyla · Apr 30, 2008, 03:46 PM // 15:46

I've gone through PvE long enough to know Survivor's > Radiants.
The key is: If you need Radiants, your build either sucks or needs more energy management.
Things such as Expertise, GoLE and Soul Reaping should be enough for that.
Heck, GoLE is strong enough by itself.

kosh · Apr 30, 2008, 03:53 PM // 15:53

all survivor is nice... but redundant imo. my monk most of the time is at 620 hp. head+hands+feet = hp
chest+legs= armor bonus.

650 hp with sword+shield is nice... but 30 hp vs. 10 armor from bless or 10 vs phy. is prob a better idea.

and im not going to talk about +energy ones' if you use radiant armor in pvp u prob fail. even on my shock i use survivor+ Sentinel's on chest and legs.i rather stay alive and be at 0 energy and exhaustion then being DEAD with 10 energy on my bar. for pve... well its pve, anything can just work cant it?

snaek · Apr 30, 2008, 04:03 PM // 16:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

Having 5 more energy doesn't save you in high level PvE, having passive protection saves you in high level PvE. And 200 DPS? Not against anything less then a boss. You also seem to forget that a simple weapon swap is +30 energy compared to your pitiful radiants.

And dun maek u're postss liek dis.

passive protection? u mean stuff like sy godmode?
or stuff like +30hp from survivor insignias?
sy godmode can be run more efficiently with higher base energy
and +30hp wont save u at all if ur unprotted...

and ummm...go to uw and see how long it takes an aatxe to kill u unprotted

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

The key is: If you need Radiants, your build either sucks or needs more energy management.

the key is: if you need survivors, ur build either sucks or ur backline/midline fail at keeping ppl alive (for pve)

honestly....u really shouldnt be dying in pve...
and u really shouldnt be needing survivors

u dun really need radiants either....
but in most cases, will allow u do things much more efficiently

if ur focus is on staying alive and jus winning at pve...
and not how fast and efficiently can i complete pve...
then ur a casual pve'r and it really doesnt make a diff wut u bring

Tyla · Apr 30, 2008, 04:07 PM // 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

passive protection? u mean stuff like sy godmode?
or stuff like +30hp from survivor insignias?
sy godmode can be run more efficiently with higher base energy
and +30hp wont save u at all if ur unprotted...

and ummm...go to uw and see how long it takes an aatxe to kill u unprotted

Because you're really going to go against Aatxe's unprotted?
Oshi-- Ursanway doesn't use Prots...yet they still clear UW HM!!

Quote:

the key is: if you need survivors, ur build either sucks or ur backline/midline fail at keeping ppl alive (for pve)

honestly....u really shouldnt be dying in pve...
and u really shouldnt be needing survivors

u dun really need radiants either....
but in most cases, will allow u do things much more efficiently

Errr?
What are you going to use in your argument next, health management?
Switching to a high energy set isn't hard, nor is it expensive.

snaek · Apr 30, 2008, 04:17 PM // 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Because you're really going to go against Aatxe's unprotted?
Oshi-- Ursanway doesn't use Prots...yet they still clear UW HM!!

Errr?
What are you going to use in your argument next, health management?
Switching to a high energy set isn't hard, nor is it expensive.

i was proving a point to the person i replied to that monsters r capable of 200dps...

and ursanway relies on:
+20al (30% dmg reduction from all source that dun ignore armour)
weakness (66% dmg reduction from attacks)
constant kd's
and +200hp defeats teh purpose of prot

besides....ursanway really doesnt count

and switchin to a high energy set means u'll need cooldown time to recover
and in pve u want to try to minimize if not eliminate cooldown time

ShadowsRequiem · Apr 30, 2008, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

passive protection? u mean stuff like sy godmode?
or stuff like +30hp from survivor insignias?
sy godmode can be run more efficiently with higher base energy
and +30hp wont save u at all if ur unprotted...

and ummm...go to uw and see how long it takes an aatxe to kill u unprotted

the key is: if you need survivors, ur build either sucks or ur backline/midline fail at keeping ppl alive (for pve)

honestly....u really shouldnt be dying in pve...
and u really shouldnt be needing survivors

u dun really need radiants either....
but in most cases, will allow u do things much more efficiently

if ur focus is on staying alive and jus winning at pve...
and not how fast and efficiently can i complete pve...
then ur a casual pve'r and it really doesnt make a diff wut u bring

Maybe if you stop typing like a complete retard people would be able to make some sense of what you are saying.

oh wait

mayb you stopp typin lik dhis case u r a retad omgz like wai no!

Dunno what kind of pve you do, but oddly enough you have plenty of cooldown time. Since when is pve a constant fight against a mob?

Tyla · Apr 30, 2008, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

i was proving a point to the person i replied to that monsters r capable of 200dps...

and ursanway relies on:
+20al (30% dmg reduction from all source that dun ignore armour)
weakness (66% dmg reduction from attacks)
constant kd's
and +200hp defeats teh purpose of prot

besides....ursanway really doesnt count

and switchin to a high energy set means u'll need cooldown time to recover
and in pve u want to try to minimize if not eliminate cooldown time

I thought this was PvE?
If it's PvE, PvE skills should be counted.

Weakness is always integrated into my builds aswell.

snaek · Apr 30, 2008, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowsRequiem

Maybe if you stop typing like a complete retard people would be able to make some sense of what you are saying.

oh wait

mayb you stopp typin lik dhis case u r a retad omgz like wai no!

Dunno what kind of pve you do, but oddly enough you have plenty of cooldown time. Since when is pve a constant fight against a mob?

oh, im sowrie...
i thought this was teh internet and not english class

but anyways...if u didnt understand it teh first time i said it
i'll say it again, jus for u:

pve = radiants
pvp = survivors

and pve is a constant fight when u want to complete it in 1/2hr instead of 1hr

Apr 30, 2008, 03:22 PM // 15:22	#44
snaek Forge Runner Join Date: Mar 2006 Profession: N/	pve = radiants pvp = survivors i usually wear teh +al equip on my chest, and sometimes legs depending on my class/insignias available spells (non-projectile) always target chest mostly everything else is like... ~45% chance to hit chest? ~30% chance to hit legs? ~8% chance for other pieces? i cant remember teh exact numbers, can someone confirm the exact numbers? Last edited by snaek; Apr 30, 2008 at 03:25 PM // 15:25..

Apr 30, 2008, 03:17 PM // 15:17	#42
Painbringer Furnace Stoker Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Minnesota Guild: Black Widows of Death Profession: W/Mo	Most of the time it all depends what I find on the way adventuring I am cheap

Apr 30, 2008, 03:23 PM // 15:23	#46
Tzalaran Academy Page Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Lincoln, NE Guild: {MERC} Profession: P/	i've always used Radiant on my chest and legs for my P/Me. he needs the extra 5 energy with the builds i've always used. imo, most armor insignias are worthless since they only affect the piece of armor they are on now, and i've never had a situation where a character i play has full survivors and was left with < 40 HP. if you are getting that low, your dead anyway... (my necro with full radiant has come out of battles in UW with 11 HP before though... and without the extra 8 energy i wouldn't have gotten off the killing spell...) to each their own. one school of though isn't correct and the other invalid... its what works best for that individual.

Apr 30, 2008, 03:43 PM // 15:43	#49
Tyla Emo Goth Italics Join Date: Sep 2006	Ya, Snaek, but Radiants don't change the fact that if your build is running out of energy you need more energy management, or just need to use your build effectively.

Apr 30, 2008, 03:46 PM // 15:46	#53
Tyla Emo Goth Italics Join Date: Sep 2006	I've gone through PvE long enough to know Survivor's > Radiants. The key is: If you need Radiants, your build either sucks or needs more energy management. Things such as Expertise, GoLE and Soul Reaping should be enough for that. Heck, GoLE is strong enough by itself.

Apr 30, 2008, 03:53 PM // 15:53	#54
kosh Krytan Explorer Join Date: Dec 2005 Guild: hydrponic agriculture society [Herb] Profession: Mo/	all survivor is nice... but redundant imo. my monk most of the time is at 620 hp. head+hands+feet = hp chest+legs= armor bonus. 650 hp with sword+shield is nice... but 30 hp vs. 10 armor from bless or 10 vs phy. is prob a better idea. and im not going to talk about +energy ones' if you use radiant armor in pvp u prob fail. even on my shock i use survivor+ Sentinel's on chest and legs.i rather stay alive and be at 0 energy and exhaustion then being DEAD with 10 energy on my bar. for pve... well its pve, anything can just work cant it?