I need some advice for my Dervish - Guild Wars Forums

Chabby · Jan 27, 2009, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Greeting,

I'm having a lot of trouble in PVP... Or perhaps it's simply bad luck or whatever... Anyway, I need some advice.

I'm trying to get many Zaishen Keys as possible, the thing is I'm really not good in PVP. And if I play Random Arena, the teams I'm in rarely wins...

And If I play Zaishen Elite, the only Zaishen team I can win (and the game takes forever), is the elementalist one.
I am currently playing a Dervish/Monk. My level is 20 (obviously), I have the Charr Scythe and here is my build :

By the way :
- I have all the avatar elite spells.
- Because I don't have enough Steel Ingots, I only have an armor set of 55 (with lot of rune).

Now, since my point is to get lot of Zaishen Keys and since it's somehow hard to win in Random Arena/Team Arena, the only solution that would allows me to be sure to get a Zaishen Key in one day and not seven like it is the case actually would be to win 5000 Balthazar points in Zaishen Elite.

But with my actual build, it takes forever for me to beat my opposants. Either they just block my hits or they end killing me. And I saw many Dervish in my battles that were like very strong, very fast and I was always missing them, though I have 11 in Scythe Mastery.

So what should I do in order to get Zaishen Keys (without having to buy them) on an easy way?
How can I can beat the Zaishen Elite Teams on a easy way without taking more than then minutes?
Can anybody give me some advices on how to become a good "fighter" with my profession?

Someone also posted this on another topic, but I'm missing most of the skills on that build suggested :

[build prof=dervi/any scythe=12+1+1 mystic=11+2 wind=6+1][Mystic Sweep][Eremite's Attack][Aura of Holy Might][Mystic Vigor][Rending Aura][Heart of Fury][Avatar of Balthazar][Eternal Aura][/build]
So I'm kinda stuck on what should I do since I'm missing these skills...

And, another quick question : If I unlock a skill or a hero with my PVE character in the Temple of Balthazar... Can I use them with my PVE Character in PVP Arena or it's only for my PVP only characters?

If you need more information, such as my available skills or my characters informations (Scythe Mastery level, Earth prater, etc.), my armor set or anything, simply ask.

Thank you

Sun Fired Blank · Jan 27, 2009, 11:46 PM // 23:46

Up your health; a rune of superior vigor, survivor insignias and maybe runes of vitae.

Avatar of Lyssa is an acceptable elite in smaller formats, but the rest of your bar is bad, and a Wounding Strike setup is much stronger, even with the possibility of encountering Foul Feast / Plague Sending. This bar is considered fairly standard:

[Wounding Strike][Chilling Victory][Mystic Sweep][Attacker's Insight][Heart of Fury][Signet of Mystic Speed][Conjure Frost][Resurrection Signet]

The best way to make sure your damage gets through is to avoid things that reduce them. Part of this process involves recognizing certain visual animations and knowing what certain skills do (Guardian, Weapon of Warding, block stances to name a few). When you see a cue that indicates you're going to be blocked, you should generally try and switch to another target, unless distance to another target versus the block skill's uptime is an inhibiting factor.

The second build that you posted is only PvE usable and isn't optimal. I would unlock Aura of Holy Might, Mystic Sweep, Eremite's Attack, Heart of Fury and maybe Eternal Aura. The other skills aren't really that useful or important.

There are character unlocks which are specific to the PvE character for which you buy the skill or reach the appropriate point of a hero quest. There are account unlocks which occur whenever you get character unlocks or find a previously undiscovered weapon upgrade on a character. The unlocks from priests of balthazar are account unlocks, not character unlocks.

I'd read more info in the Dervish subforum, and read some information on PvXwiki.com, right now you're basically flailing in the dark.

Chabby · Jan 27, 2009, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Thank you for your answer. I'll see what I can do in order to unlock skills...

By the way, in order to get Wounding Strike, do I need the Signet of Capture? All the other elite skills I have (the avatars...) I had to capture them from monsters, bosses...

And...

Quote:

(...) right now you're basically flailing in the dark.

LoL, by looking at my situation and now that you tell it, it's pretty obvious :-P

cognophile · Jan 28, 2009, 12:04 AM // 00:04

I don't know too much about dervishes, but for zaishen elite, you could go as D/R and run a trapper build. E.g.

[Serpent's Quickness][Spike Trap][Dust Trap][Flame Trap][Barbed Trap][Viper's Nest][Piercing Trap][Troll Unguent]

You'd probably have trouble getting on a trapping team as a derv primary though, so the derv might need bring a team of heroes to do zaishen. Maybe create a pvp ranger toon if you have an open slot.

obsidian ectoplasm · Jan 28, 2009, 12:10 AM // 00:10

first of all.

in PvP everylittle bit of anything is a BIG difference.

playing in pvp with 55 armor BAD BAD

Playing in pvp without proper runes and equpiment BAD BAD

so Make a PVP only dervish.

get a build from PvX wiki, or the one posted above is fine.

I will tell you some dervish skills that you should and shouldn't use.

Wounding strike, this is the most popular/effecitive skill to used by dervish.

why? deepwound, it is the most important condition in the game, always use it, unless your are a caster ofcourse.

Wounding strike is also very good, because of the cover bleeding

if a heal trys to remove the deep wound from wounding strike, only the bleeding will be removed, unless the skill removes more than 1 conditon.

what avatars to use?

Never use avatar balth in Pvp!

in PvP you wont damage, you dont want to tank, or you dont need self heals, that is what a monk is for. but if you never seem to get a monk, it is ok to maybe take 1, or maybe 2, only if needed.

seeing that you wont dmg in pvp, Lyssa is the best option, but still wounding strike is better.

IAS (increased attacking speed) This is a VERY important thing for mellee/ranged charactors, with our IAS warrios would be shit

you need to always take this, skills such as 'Heart of fury' are great for derv.

but HoF has a down time, so if you like your IAS to be kept up 100% use war and prof and use one of the many IAS from warr profession.

It is also good to bring a IMS increased movement speed, aka a running skill

these are helpful because, most of the time you will be trying to kill a monk, yes?

monks kite! which can be very annoying not being able to attack them to you can run and catch them, making IMS very usfull

this can also be usefull for you to kite, if you are taking dmg and think you are about to die, use your IMS, and take cover so monk can heal you

Always bring a rez sig! no other crappy rez skills, rez sig is what you bring, fullstop.

I could go on for hours of this really bad suggestions, but I can't be bothered haha

hope this helps though.

GL

Lykan · Jan 28, 2009, 12:29 AM // 00:29

Its been almost 4 years and still many people in this game are under the impression they can only play one thing.

There are 10 professions. 10! My advice to everyone who wants to pvp is to learn them all and play them all. Its no good playing zaishen elite when you know that dervs are crap there. Get a ranger and Join a trapper team. if you know your doing crap in RA, then change to something else. Palm Strike is all the rage atm.

Learn about pvp chars and how awesome they are.

Unfortunately the Z keys have really ruined any chance pve'rs have got to really progress in pvp. All they see are Z keys and they dont realise the best way to get them is to improve themselves, but they cant improve until they have all the needed tools and to get the tools you need to be spending your balth faction on unlocks and not Zkeys. With things the way they are people will never progress.

Chabby · Jan 28, 2009, 12:43 AM // 00:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by obsidian ectoplasm

playing in pvp with 55 armor BAD BAD

Playing in pvp without proper runes and equpiment BAD BAD

This problem has just been solved. I spent all my money on one of the last (70) armors.

I just need to buy the proper rune now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lykan

Its been almost 4 years and still many people in this game are under the impression they can only play one thing.

There are 10 professions. 10! My advice to everyone who wants to pvp is to learn them all and play them all. Its no good playing zaishen elite when you know that dervs are crap there. Get a ranger and Join a trapper team. if you know your doing crap in RA, then change to something else. Palm Strike is all the rage atm.

Learn about pvp chars and how awesome they are.

Unfortunately the Z keys have really ruined any chance pve'rs have got to really progress in pvp. All they see are Z keys and they dont realise the best way to get them is to improve themselves, but they cant improve until they have all the needed tools and to get the tools you need to be spending your balth faction on unlocks and not Zkeys. With things the way they are people will never progress.

I played many profession. I played Ranger, Elementalist, Ritualist, Warrior, Assassin...

The thing is I started to play GW too "early". I mean that I was what everybody call a "noob" in any MMORPG (I know GW isn't one). So choosing the right profession/skills was pretty hard for me, so I always ended stucked somewhere in the game because my character was crap. But since my characters had nice items assigned to them I wanted to keep, I never deleted them, ending that I had only two empty slots for PVP-only characters.

And since I've been busy and playing in PVE only, I never really learnt how worked the PVP.

My best character up to date is my Dervish, but in PVE. That's why I'm so bad in PVP, because I just started (yes, even after 4 years) recently to seriously play in PVP.

Now, about unlocking skills and character.

I never really played a PVP-only character, well I did before, but I stopped. Early in Faction, we could start a PVP character with a first/second profession and manipulate his stats BEFORE choosing the character's look (hair, face, etc.).

I stoped playing for a while but when I came back, they changed that: we were allowed (well at least when creating a character) to its primary profession only, and all the other stuffes, we chose them in a menu Ingame, which frustrated me a bit. Seeing that, since I didn't know well the PVP possibilities, I stopped trying to go further in PVP, and so I was still doing before starting last week when I finally understood how worked the Zaishen rewards. This explains why I'm not enjoying the idea of starting a PVP-Only character: I don't like the new interface, the fact that we're allowed to only one profession and all the good stuffes are on my PVE Characters.

To go back to unlocking things, I wasn't really looking forward unlocking skills, spells, heroes, for the single reason that they say that these unlocked things will only apply to PVP-Only characters, but I am actually playing a PVE characters in PVP zone, which means that whatever I unlock, I won't be able to use it on my character (I guess).

That's why in the end I decided to chase Zaishen Keys... Not because I don't know there are other things, but because anyway they won't apply to my main character (which is a PVE one).

I just got a new armor, I'm going to get some money in PVE by doing missions and then I'll try to buy good skills. If in the end I'm still a horrible PVP player, then I'll start looking about creating a PVP character.

majikmajikmajik · Jan 28, 2009, 01:46 AM // 01:46

get a pvp character, or get your armor/runes and a better weapon + CUSTOMIZE IT! 20% extra damage in pvp is standard.
[Resurrect] is bad bad.. use a res that gives almost full health and SOME energy or use [Resurrection Signet].

iVendetta · Jan 28, 2009, 02:17 AM // 02:17

If you're not rich and you are going to PvP (to bring in Balthazar faction points), make a PvP only character. They have maxed out armor and weapons and you can unlock items, skills, or runes with Balthazar faction points.

Now, your build.

You don't need a monk as a secondary unless you want hard resurrection. Dervishes are very capable self-healers. At your presumed skill level, you're better off with a secondary as a Warrior, Assassin, or Elementalist (conjures).

As for your template, [Grenth's Fingers] is unnecessary. It just consumes energy for a very small amount of PBAoE damage and a cripple (if you're really lucky). Your [Crippling Sweep] has its purpose.

For now, try some PvX builds to get an idea of how a basic Dervish template should look like.

I've been playing around with this build for quite some time in RA now and its very effective. It would be even more efficient in other arenas where you have dedicated monks to heal you.
[build prof=D/A name="Emissary of Lyssa" box mysticism=11+3+1 daggermastery=12 shadowarts=6 desc="Weapon: Zealous Daggers of Enchanting{br}Equipment: Full Blessed Insignia with appropriate runes{br}Usage: Cast Avatar of Lyssa{br}Cast Heart of Fury{br}Death's Charge to target foe{br}Attack in sequence: Golden Phoenix Strike > Horns of the Ox > Falling Spider > Blades of Steel{br}Resurrect fallen party member with Resurrection Signet"][Golden Phoenix [email protected]][Horns of the [email protected]][Falling [email protected]][Blades of [email protected]][Death's [email protected]][Heart of [email protected]][Avatar of [email protected]][Resurrection Signet][/build]

That build "someone else" posted is not meant for PvP. It is a PvE build (note the [Eternal Aura]).

Chabby · Jan 28, 2009, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Thank you all for your advice.

I tried a PVP Dervish and yes, it is effective (well, my random team had a monk...).

I'll try your build iVendetta as soon as possible

Jan 27, 2009, 11:11 PM // 23:11	#1
Chabby Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Jan 2009 Profession: D/Mo	I need some advice for my Dervish Greeting, I'm having a lot of trouble in PVP... Or perhaps it's simply bad luck or whatever... Anyway, I need some advice. I'm trying to get many Zaishen Keys as possible, the thing is I'm really not good in PVP. And if I play Random Arena, the teams I'm in rarely wins... And If I play Zaishen Elite, the only Zaishen team I can win (and the game takes forever), is the elementalist one. I am currently playing a Dervish/Monk. My level is 20 (obviously), I have the Charr Scythe and here is my build : By the way : - I have all the avatar elite spells. - Because I don't have enough Steel Ingots, I only have an armor set of 55 (with lot of rune). Now, since my point is to get lot of Zaishen Keys and since it's somehow hard to win in Random Arena/Team Arena, the only solution that would allows me to be sure to get a Zaishen Key in one day and not seven like it is the case actually would be to win 5000 Balthazar points in Zaishen Elite. But with my actual build, it takes forever for me to beat my opposants. Either they just block my hits or they end killing me. And I saw many Dervish in my battles that were like very strong, very fast and I was always missing them, though I have 11 in Scythe Mastery. So what should I do in order to get Zaishen Keys (without having to buy them) on an easy way? How can I can beat the Zaishen Elite Teams on a easy way without taking more than then minutes? Can anybody give me some advices on how to become a good "fighter" with my profession? Someone also posted this on another topic, but I'm missing most of the skills on that build suggested : [build prof=dervi/any scythe=12+1+1 mystic=11+2 wind=6+1][Mystic Sweep][Eremite's Attack][Aura of Holy Might][Mystic Vigor][Rending Aura][Heart of Fury][Avatar of Balthazar][Eternal Aura][/build] So I'm kinda stuck on what should I do since I'm missing these skills... And, another quick question : If I unlock a skill or a hero with my PVE character in the Temple of Balthazar... Can I use them with my PVE Character in PVP Arena or it's only for my PVP only characters? If you need more information, such as my available skills or my characters informations (Scythe Mastery level, Earth prater, etc.), my armor set or anything, simply ask. Thank you Last edited by Chabby; Jan 27, 2009 at 11:34 PM // 23:34..

Jan 27, 2009, 11:46 PM // 23:46	#2
Sun Fired Blank Jungle Guide Join Date: Apr 2007	Up your health; a rune of superior vigor, survivor insignias and maybe runes of vitae. Avatar of Lyssa is an acceptable elite in smaller formats, but the rest of your bar is bad, and a Wounding Strike setup is much stronger, even with the possibility of encountering Foul Feast / Plague Sending. This bar is considered fairly standard: [Wounding Strike][Chilling Victory][Mystic Sweep][Attacker's Insight][Heart of Fury][Signet of Mystic Speed][Conjure Frost][Resurrection Signet] The best way to make sure your damage gets through is to avoid things that reduce them. Part of this process involves recognizing certain visual animations and knowing what certain skills do (Guardian, Weapon of Warding, block stances to name a few). When you see a cue that indicates you're going to be blocked, you should generally try and switch to another target, unless distance to another target versus the block skill's uptime is an inhibiting factor. The second build that you posted is only PvE usable and isn't optimal. I would unlock Aura of Holy Might, Mystic Sweep, Eremite's Attack, Heart of Fury and maybe Eternal Aura. The other skills aren't really that useful or important. There are character unlocks which are specific to the PvE character for which you buy the skill or reach the appropriate point of a hero quest. There are account unlocks which occur whenever you get character unlocks or find a previously undiscovered weapon upgrade on a character. The unlocks from priests of balthazar are account unlocks, not character unlocks. I'd read more info in the Dervish subforum, and read some information on PvXwiki.com, right now you're basically flailing in the dark. Last edited by Sun Fired Blank; Jan 27, 2009 at 11:48 PM // 23:48..

Jan 28, 2009, 12:04 AM // 00:04	#4
cognophile Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: USA	I don't know too much about dervishes, but for zaishen elite, you could go as D/R and run a trapper build. E.g. [Serpent's Quickness][Spike Trap][Dust Trap][Flame Trap][Barbed Trap][Viper's Nest][Piercing Trap][Troll Unguent] You'd probably have trouble getting on a trapping team as a derv primary though, so the derv might need bring a team of heroes to do zaishen. Maybe create a pvp ranger toon if you have an open slot.

Jan 28, 2009, 12:10 AM // 00:10	#5
obsidian ectoplasm Desert Nomad Join Date: Jan 2008	first of all. in PvP everylittle bit of anything is a BIG difference. playing in pvp with 55 armor BAD BAD Playing in pvp without proper runes and equpiment BAD BAD so Make a PVP only dervish. get a build from PvX wiki, or the one posted above is fine. I will tell you some dervish skills that you should and shouldn't use. Wounding strike, this is the most popular/effecitive skill to used by dervish. why? deepwound, it is the most important condition in the game, always use it, unless your are a caster ofcourse. Wounding strike is also very good, because of the cover bleeding if a heal trys to remove the deep wound from wounding strike, only the bleeding will be removed, unless the skill removes more than 1 conditon. what avatars to use? Never use avatar balth in Pvp! in PvP you wont damage, you dont want to tank, or you dont need self heals, that is what a monk is for. but if you never seem to get a monk, it is ok to maybe take 1, or maybe 2, only if needed. seeing that you wont dmg in pvp, Lyssa is the best option, but still wounding strike is better. IAS (increased attacking speed) This is a VERY important thing for mellee/ranged charactors, with our IAS warrios would be shit you need to always take this, skills such as 'Heart of fury' are great for derv. but HoF has a down time, so if you like your IAS to be kept up 100% use war and prof and use one of the many IAS from warr profession. It is also good to bring a IMS increased movement speed, aka a running skill these are helpful because, most of the time you will be trying to kill a monk, yes? monks kite! which can be very annoying not being able to attack them to you can run and catch them, making IMS very usfull this can also be usefull for you to kite, if you are taking dmg and think you are about to die, use your IMS, and take cover so monk can heal you Always bring a rez sig! no other crappy rez skills, rez sig is what you bring, fullstop. I could go on for hours of this really bad suggestions, but I can't be bothered haha hope this helps though. GL

Jan 28, 2009, 12:29 AM // 00:29	#6
Lykan Forge Runner Join Date: May 2005 Guild: StP Profession: R/	Its been almost 4 years and still many people in this game are under the impression they can only play one thing. There are 10 professions. 10! My advice to everyone who wants to pvp is to learn them all and play them all. Its no good playing zaishen elite when you know that dervs are crap there. Get a ranger and Join a trapper team. if you know your doing crap in RA, then change to something else. Palm Strike is all the rage atm. Learn about pvp chars and how awesome they are. Unfortunately the Z keys have really ruined any chance pve'rs have got to really progress in pvp. All they see are Z keys and they dont realise the best way to get them is to improve themselves, but they cant improve until they have all the needed tools and to get the tools you need to be spending your balth faction on unlocks and not Zkeys. With things the way they are people will never progress.

Jan 28, 2009, 01:46 AM // 01:46	#8
majikmajikmajik Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: SATown~Tx Guild: Guild Hopper! Profession: R/	get a pvp character, or get your armor/runes and a better weapon + CUSTOMIZE IT! 20% extra damage in pvp is standard. [Resurrect] is bad bad.. use a res that gives almost full health and SOME energy or use [Resurrection Signet].

Jan 28, 2009, 02:17 AM // 02:17	#9
iVendetta Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Where no man has ever gone before. Guild: Syndicate Nightmare [SyN]	If you're not rich and you are going to PvP (to bring in Balthazar faction points), make a PvP only character. They have maxed out armor and weapons and you can unlock items, skills, or runes with Balthazar faction points. Now, your build. You don't need a monk as a secondary unless you want hard resurrection. Dervishes are very capable self-healers. At your presumed skill level, you're better off with a secondary as a Warrior, Assassin, or Elementalist (conjures). As for your template, [Grenth's Fingers] is unnecessary. It just consumes energy for a very small amount of PBAoE damage and a cripple (if you're really lucky). Your [Crippling Sweep] has its purpose. For now, try some PvX builds to get an idea of how a basic Dervish template should look like. I've been playing around with this build for quite some time in RA now and its very effective. It would be even more efficient in other arenas where you have dedicated monks to heal you. [build prof=D/A name="Emissary of Lyssa" box mysticism=11+3+1 daggermastery=12 shadowarts=6 desc="Weapon: Zealous Daggers of Enchanting{br}Equipment: Full Blessed Insignia with appropriate runes{br}Usage: Cast Avatar of Lyssa{br}Cast Heart of Fury{br}Death's Charge to target foe{br}Attack in sequence: Golden Phoenix Strike > Horns of the Ox > Falling Spider > Blades of Steel{br}Resurrect fallen party member with Resurrection Signet"][Golden Phoenix [email protected]][Horns of the [email protected]][Falling [email protected]][Blades of [email protected]][Death's [email protected]][Heart of [email protected]][Avatar of [email protected]][Resurrection Signet][/build] That build "someone else" posted is not meant for PvP. It is a PvE build (note the [Eternal Aura]).

Jan 28, 2009, 02:20 AM // 02:20	#10
Chabby Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Jan 2009 Profession: D/Mo	Thank you all for your advice. I tried a PVP Dervish and yes, it is effective (well, my random team had a monk...). I'll try your build iVendetta as soon as possible