Is it possible to sue Anet - Page 3 - Guild Wars Forums

killerbot3009 · Apr 29, 2009, 09:23 PM // 21:23

Anet will not bann someone without the account or person breaking the EULA.
even if someone has gotten onto the account and spammed websites, thus banning you, you are still held resposible as you own to some extent the account. so you really have no leg to stand on if you ever want to sue anet, they have everything pretty much covered.

HawkofStorms · Apr 29, 2009, 09:44 PM // 21:44

No.

You purchase a "liscence" to play an MMO on their server space. You do not actually purchase a product. Therefore, many of the provisions that are designed to protect consumers in sales contracts do not apply to online games. Your account can be terminated at any time.

Now, I mean, you "could" sue, but you'd lose.

Killed u man · Apr 29, 2009, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Again, I'm NOT planning on sue'ing Anet, and once I get this issue resolved with support themselves (to see wether or not I can force a unbann under conditions (delete all titles, toons etc)), I'll post on guru a public discussion about this.

Wether or not I deserve to get banned is not up to other people to decide. It's up to Anet. When the community relations, Gaile Gray, said, SPECIFICLY ABOUT THIS ISSUE, it's NOT a bann-able offence, yet it got me banned, then who is in the wrong?

Don't get mistaken about this, I will repeat it once again. It's not a "texmod" or "G15 keyboard" or anything similar, of which maybe Gaile said: "It's UNLIKELY you'll get perm banned for this". It was specificly stated by her other actions would be taken. Mainly due to the fact that no rules were broken in any way, aswell as the fact that this wasnt a "too good to be true"" situation (In which a person gets 5 stacks of armbraces, it is generally accepted to assume he KNOWS here is something fishy), one would find a Perm ban completely out of the way on this one.

This could probably match on the scale with RA syncing being a perm-bann able offence. Even more so, because the acounts are directly abusing an unintended effect (exploit) to gain an advantage (IN PvP) over other players for personal gain. (Title farming)

This, aside from a different coat, is no different from my experience. I got banned for something Anet is SO vague about, Of which THEY THEMSELVES COMPLETELY REFUSE to hand out any information (Is it legal, is it not?).

Darkobra · Apr 30, 2009, 06:42 AM // 06:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Drops Az

Taking them to small claims court (or the equivalent in your country) is the way to go. I am currently preparing a case against them for the banning of my accounts for the "use of 3rd party program or bot programs" when I have not used them and the "evidence" they based their decision on is the length of time I played during a particular period (the farm was h/h farming amatz basin - basically entering, flagging the heros to one side and then waiting for 10-12 minutes until the timer ran out, rinse and repeat).
I am suing for the cost of the programs and for the time required to re obtain items lost of those accounts + costs.
The requirements are much easier on a "normal person" in small claims.

I'm sure they'd have more evidence than that. You'd need to be able to prove them wrong by either picking apart their evidence and providing a VERY convincing argument or it will just be nothing more than your word against theirs.

Dee Cazo · Apr 30, 2009, 10:39 AM // 10:39

butthurt from being banned for doing something stupid.

Etta · Apr 30, 2009, 11:09 AM // 11:09

It'll be a waste of time and money, get over it.

Lycan Nibbler · Apr 30, 2009, 11:22 AM // 11:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkobra

I'm sure they'd have more evidence than that. You'd need to be able to prove them wrong by either picking apart their evidence and providing a VERY convincing argument or it will just be nothing more than your word against theirs.

They have no proof as I have never used a third party program while using GW period. I havent even used texmod as I did the cart on my main the old way before texmod was around.
Yes, thats my aim, once I see the evidence (as they wont wont show it to me) then I can and will break it apart.

Kumu Honua · Apr 30, 2009, 05:27 PM // 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

This, aside from a different coat, is no different from my experience. I got banned for something Anet is SO vague about, Of which THEY THEMSELVES COMPLETELY REFUSE to hand out any information (Is it legal, is it not?).

Read the EULA. They can ban your account at any time for any reason.

Quote:

Originally Posted by EULA

NC Interactive reserves the right, in its sole discretion, to (1) delete or alter any Account ID or (2) terminate any license granted herein, for any reason whatsoever, including, without limitation, any suspected or actual infringement of any trademark or trade name right, copyright, or other proprietary right.

Karate Jesus · Apr 30, 2009, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kumu Honua

IANAL.

To sue, you must have damages. The only thing you could consider damages in your case is the $50 equivalent you paid for the game and any character slot/additional costs. You most certainly do not suffer mental anguish, or any other hardships that you could sue for.

The question is: Are you willing to risk hundreds of dollars to get your $50 back assuming you win your case (You won't)?

Let us know how this goes. BTW: You can't sue for time because you didn't lose any money on the time. If you are in a car accident and you lose time at work, you can sue for that time because it has a value.

In Texas (where the EULA was made), you can sue for pain and suffering. So, there's always a chance you could win something besides $50.

But really, the EULA is pretty clear in saying that they can terminate your account so the judge would probably look at that and throw you out. OR if you had a viable case (which you don't) NCSoft would wrap you up in legal bullshit that you'd never win anything.

And trust me, they don't want you to win. Because if you could win something for being banned, then that would open up a legal precedent for other people who've been banned from NCSoft games to claim damages.

Anyway....all that is to say that you'd have no case. But the idea of suing a game company for virtual rights isn't new and in the future we may see some cases like this that actually have grounding.

Fril Estelin · Apr 30, 2009, 05:53 PM // 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

Is it achievable as a regular person to "win" a legal fight, IF Anet breaks their own EULA, by banning you without a grounded reason?

EULAs are written by lawyers, so it's very unlikely you can win such a "fight". And I'm not enve talking about the cost of such a litigation for you.

The simple fact that you came here and declared that Anet banned you without reason could be a reason for them to sue you (back).

There's been several times on this exact board people claiming stuff, only for Regina (Martin too) to come and uncover the truth. I'm not saying that it did happen, but have you tried a support ticket before coming here?

Phavok · Apr 30, 2009, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fril Estelin

EULAs are written by lawyers

They are written by legal advisors, not lawyers. Lawyers are the ones whom disect the said document to find holes.

Most large companies have legal advisors who guide them on creating legal documentation as well as keeping them from using something that could have them sued (such as if the company was going to use a car that was a Ferarri and did not have permission from the car manufacturer to do so!)

EULA's give the company certain rights, however, some rights cannot be denied from the End User. Terminating an account for NO REASON for example does not fall under any clause by law. It is no different than renting property, you cannot just be evicted because the owner your renting from does not want you there, they need a reason and a valid one.

However, if ANET can prove that the account was used for illegal activity or something that went against the TOS then they have legal ground to ban that account regardless if it was you using it at the time.

REDdelver · Apr 30, 2009, 06:45 PM // 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kumu Honua

Read the EULA. They can ban your account at any time for any reason.

From what i read, thats not true. IF they could ban you for any reason at any time, then the EULA wouldnt list the possible infractions deemed bannable.

From the lines you quoted...that has to do with licensing and trademarks.
I.E. The Pittsburgh Steelers own the rights to their insignia. If someone wants to use that insignia to make a profit off of saleable items, then a trademark/licensing contract is made between the two.(Pittsburgh Steelers and the "item with the Steelers insignia" owner.) That has nothing to do with banning individual accounts....

BulletStopper · Apr 30, 2009, 10:34 PM // 22:34

I LOVE this thread! I'm in the Army and we call these responses "barracks lawyers". Of course in more common terms it's a _ _ _ _house lawyer.

Until someone someone here actually qualifies their response with "I have a Doctorate of Jurisprudence" then it is purely the opinions of unqualified people.

If you truly want to know if you can sue Arena Net, pay the money and consult a lawyer. Nobody here is qualified to render this advise.

cybevenom · Apr 30, 2009, 10:59 PM // 22:59

well here is the kicker. I am from the netherlands and as far as i know here a EULA has absolutely no legal standing. (has been a ruling in court in an earlier trial some time ago if memory serves me correct). So your question depends on the country and laws there.
Starting an lawsuit is always possible. the outcome depends on local laws.

Apr 29, 2009, 09:23 PM // 21:23	#41
killerbot3009 Jungle Guide Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: the beaster Guild: the Gold Fish [GOLD] Profession: W/	Anet will not bann someone without the account or person breaking the EULA. even if someone has gotten onto the account and spammed websites, thus banning you, you are still held resposible as you own to some extent the account. so you really have no leg to stand on if you ever want to sue anet, they have everything pretty much covered.

Apr 29, 2009, 09:44 PM // 21:44	#42
HawkofStorms Hall Hero Join Date: Aug 2005 Profession: E/	No. You purchase a "liscence" to play an MMO on their server space. You do not actually purchase a product. Therefore, many of the provisions that are designed to protect consumers in sales contracts do not apply to online games. Your account can be terminated at any time. Now, I mean, you "could" sue, but you'd lose.

Apr 29, 2009, 11:40 PM // 23:40	#43
Killed u man Forge Runner Join Date: Feb 2006	Again, I'm NOT planning on sue'ing Anet, and once I get this issue resolved with support themselves (to see wether or not I can force a unbann under conditions (delete all titles, toons etc)), I'll post on guru a public discussion about this. Wether or not I deserve to get banned is not up to other people to decide. It's up to Anet. When the community relations, Gaile Gray, said, SPECIFICLY ABOUT THIS ISSUE, it's NOT a bann-able offence, yet it got me banned, then who is in the wrong? Don't get mistaken about this, I will repeat it once again. It's not a "texmod" or "G15 keyboard" or anything similar, of which maybe Gaile said: "It's UNLIKELY you'll get perm banned for this". It was specificly stated by her other actions would be taken. Mainly due to the fact that no rules were broken in any way, aswell as the fact that this wasnt a "too good to be true"" situation (In which a person gets 5 stacks of armbraces, it is generally accepted to assume he KNOWS here is something fishy), one would find a Perm ban completely out of the way on this one. This could probably match on the scale with RA syncing being a perm-bann able offence. Even more so, because the acounts are directly abusing an unintended effect (exploit) to gain an advantage (IN PvP) over other players for personal gain. (Title farming) This, aside from a different coat, is no different from my experience. I got banned for something Anet is SO vague about, Of which THEY THEMSELVES COMPLETELY REFUSE to hand out any information (Is it legal, is it not?).

Apr 30, 2009, 10:39 AM // 10:39	#45
Dee Cazo Academy Page Join Date: Jun 2008 Guild: Cielo Defisa Profession: R/N	butthurt from being banned for doing something stupid.

Apr 30, 2009, 11:09 AM // 11:09	#46
Etta Forge Runner Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Mancland, British Empire	It'll be a waste of time and money, get over it.

Apr 30, 2009, 10:34 PM // 22:34	#53
BulletStopper Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Staring At my computer Guild: Knights an Heroes Profession: Mo/	I LOVE this thread! I'm in the Army and we call these responses "barracks lawyers". Of course in more common terms it's a _ _ _ _house lawyer. Until someone someone here actually qualifies their response with "I have a Doctorate of Jurisprudence" then it is purely the opinions of unqualified people. If you truly want to know if you can sue Arena Net, pay the money and consult a lawyer. Nobody here is qualified to render this advise.

Apr 30, 2009, 10:59 PM // 22:59	#54
cybevenom Academy Page Join Date: Aug 2006 Guild: The last laugh Profession: R/Mo	well here is the kicker. I am from the netherlands and as far as i know here a EULA has absolutely no legal standing. (has been a ruling in court in an earlier trial some time ago if memory serves me correct). So your question depends on the country and laws there. Starting an lawsuit is always possible. the outcome depends on local laws.