Curse

-Loki- · Aug 06, 2007, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Droniac

You're forgetting about Massive Entertainment. If anything their Ground Control games laid the framework for games like Dawn of War - and they were also thoroughly well-executed and well-received games.

For one - Ground Control didn't lay anything for Dawn of War. It was large scale fixed 'resource' games, no bases or building mid game. Dawn of War was a traditional base building style RTS but shook up a lot of the key mechanics, like forcing players out to fight and units that can fight in melee and use guns. Similarly, GC2 didn't do anything for Dawn of War considering they were being developed at roughly the same time (I remember in closed DoW beta having discussions with other testers about what the GC2 beta did different to DoW).

However, I wish Dawn of War followed Ground Controls method. Don't get me wrong, I love the game to death, being a 13+ year 40k vet, but a fixed resource system with no mid game building would have suited the universe so much better. I can't comment on Battle Realms or World in Conflict since I haven't had the time to try either. I guess a better statement would have been "They seem to be the only developer whose games I've played that manage to make a 'different' style RTS and make it work.".

Droniac · Aug 06, 2007, 11:14 AM // 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Loki-

For one - Ground Control didn't lay anything for Dawn of War. It was large scale fixed 'resource' games, no bases or building mid game. Dawn of War was a traditional base building style RTS but shook up a lot of the key mechanics, like forcing players out to fight and units that can fight in melee and use guns. Similarly, GC2 didn't do anything for Dawn of War considering they were being developed at roughly the same time (I remember in closed DoW beta having discussions with other testers about what the GC2 beta did different to DoW).

However, I wish Dawn of War followed Ground Controls method. Don't get me wrong, I love the game to death, being a 13+ year 40k vet, but a fixed resource system with no mid game building would have suited the universe so much better.

The focal point of Dawn of War gameplay being the capturing of control points, exactly like Ground Control, is how it laid the groundwork imo. The games might not be very similar across the board, but in that respect they do play alike. That said - I too would've like for the Dawn of War games to be more like the Ground Control series: no base building or resource management would've been great.

Also: units that could fight in melee AND ranged is something that Battle Realms introduced (although there might have been earlier games, I don't know) even prior to the announcement of Dawn of War, likewise with forcing players to go out and fight: both Battle Realms and Ground Control did that too.

-Loki- · Aug 06, 2007, 11:23 AM // 11:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Droniac

The focal point of Dawn of War gameplay being the capturing of control points, exactly like Ground Control, is how it laid the groundwork imo.

Not really that similar. Control points in the original GC were just new areas you could drop units - but it wasn't all that helpful. DoW's implementation was much different, to the point of not really being the same thing (they were actually more similar to the Steel nodes in Total Annihilation - go out and hold Steel nodes or you get no steel to make your units. But people just bypassed this by playing on Steel worlds.), and worked better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Droniac

Also: units that could fight in melee AND ranged is something that Battle Realms introduced (although there might have been earlier games, I don't know) even prior to the announcement of Dawn of War, likewise with forcing players to go out and fight: both Battle Realms and Ground Control did that too.

As I said in my edit - I never got to play Battle Realms. Ground Control forcing players out to fight was very different as well - you were forced to go out and fight because there were no resources. If neither player went out to fight, it would have been a very dull battle.

Bryant Again · Aug 06, 2007, 04:31 PM // 16:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by kradens

pov??? circumstance??? blimey.

im not talking about the quality of free games vs p2p.

im just saying in ONE aspect, wow loses to gw, and that aspect is that gw is f2p whilst wow is p2p.

come on. u cant twist that. @_@

It's not that I'm twisting it. It really just matters on your perspective.

I'd consider Gw's f2p a win if they had GMs. But they don't, so I say it's 50-50.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Droniac

I take it that was meant to be a joke? Even the most dedicated WoW fans I know (which would be quite a few, I've played the game for a while after all) would readily admit that WoW is unbalanced beyond repair. The method Blizzard utilizes to 'balance' WoW is beyond a shadow of a doubt the worst I (or my WoW-playing/loving friends for that matter) have ever seen.

I think Shamans and Hunters could use a little work. Aside from that, WoW isn't terribly unbalanced. And again, I hope you don't look at the forums. It's full of 99% QQing, with the other 1% rick-rolls.

jesh · Aug 06, 2007, 04:48 PM // 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Deflok

Yeah, while we're on this "WoW ripped off GW" business I'd like to point out some other franchises which have ripped off Guild Wars.
-Lord of the Rings
-The Matrix
-Harry Potter
-Lion King
-Tron

All of the guys behind those franchises need to fess up with some royalties to ANet fast otherwise they're going to facing massive lawsuits.

Oh, and don't even get me started on the Cinderella/Nightfall parallels, god! Makes me sooooo mad!

You win the award for best post ever. I've stayed up all night and couldn't breathe for a couple minutes after reading this. xD

Horseman Of War · Aug 07, 2007, 01:03 AM // 01:03

dont give lich fling so much credit... aside from the B-Budget narrative, that preview wasnt worth my time.

But yeah, why is snow so POP in mmo's right now/???

Tuesg · Aug 07, 2007, 11:11 AM // 11:11

Why on earth does this even deserve an argument?

Fantasy is fantasy, when both games are taking there ideas from the same genre of course there going to be pretty similar.

I'm not going to pretend I like WoW I played it and never did get in to it but the new expansion is bring it to its logical conclusion a fight with the lich king, Arthas who was created at the end of warcraft 3.

GW:EN also seems to be bring guild wars to its logical conclusion, don't quote me on that however due to the fact we still don't no all the story details.

Yes both games are every similar but its the same with most fantasy games. No one is stealing from anybody here they just started out with the same basic base and built upon it.

MrFuzzles · Aug 07, 2007, 11:17 AM // 11:17

fact: Tolkien stole the concept of orcs and magic from WoW. All rpg's are a ripoff of WoW if they have things like xp, levels, and swords.

Lineage 2 did the "inscriptions" thing a while ago btw. A couple of expansions ago, they added the ability to "over-enchant" your skills. You could give your stun attack more damage, more chance of stun, less energy use, and so on. There was no limit on how many times you could enchant it, but there was a certain chance it would fail, and it would get reset back to +0 if it did.

visitor · Aug 07, 2007, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Well the only thing that reminded me of GW was this
"The final darkness falls."
GWNF anyone?

tyche7 · Aug 07, 2007, 07:00 PM // 19:00

Meh....I'm a GW fan true and blue. WoW can fondle my....

blue.rellik · Aug 08, 2007, 11:31 AM // 11:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sujoy

A) The first Death Knight was Arthas Menetil, after having found
the Frostmourne. Not a W/N.

No he wasn't. Deaths Knights were in Warcraft II

Mr.Deflok · Aug 08, 2007, 11:36 AM // 11:36

There was an article which referenced this business here: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10184578

Zexion · Aug 08, 2007, 01:39 PM // 13:39

Not particularly. GWEN will not only focus on the far shiverpeaks, but also the Depths of Tyria. Besides, Northrend is not merely any arctic region. It is more like norway. Temperate forests to the south, cold snowy regions to the north. And also some tundra, but I am not sure if Norway has that.

_Zexion

ibex333 · Aug 08, 2007, 07:05 PM // 19:05

@OP
How do you know that Anet was 1st to think of these things? The burning forest... The hairstyles... You asume that just because Anet released the video 1st? That proves nothing.

They could have hacked into Blizzards systems.. They could have a guy on the inside, it could have been leaked in various ways.

One thing is clear. Whoever it is - Anet or Blizz, it's clear someone stole ideas from someone. That is a disgusting and shameless tactic, and it must stop.

Mr.Deflok · Aug 08, 2007, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Really, it's clear? How? Burning forests aren't a new idea. Were the area with the floating rocks shown in both vids then there'd be a justifiable cause for concern.

Snow Bunny · Aug 08, 2007, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Intellectual property leasing? No! Omg No! That doesn't happen, ever!
It's not like GW or WoW are original. Both are carbon copy manifestations off the collective imagination of nerds and fantasy fans for the past 2000 years.

bamm bamm bamm · Aug 08, 2007, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by ibex333

They could have hacked into Blizzards systems.

That's totally it. Zero Cool Izzy is in their systems haxing their intellectual properties! There's no way more than one large group of people could decide to use the concept of burning wood without some sort of corporate espionage/other unspecified devious shenanigans! I bet ninja were involved. I wouldn't put it past them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ibex333

One thing is clear. Whoever it is - Anet or Blizz, it's clear someone stole ideas from someone. That is a disgusting and shameless tactic, and it must stop.

I'm with you, man. This so-called 'Izzy' must be stopped at all costs. I'm going to write a letter to Batman. He'll know what to do.

ibex333 · Aug 08, 2007, 10:18 PM // 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamm bamm bamm

That's totally it. Zero Cool Izzy is in their systems haxing their intellectual properties! There's no way more than one large group of people could decide to use the concept of burning wood without some sort of corporate espionage/other unspecified devious shenanigans! I bet ninja were involved. I wouldn't put it past them.

I'm with you, man. This so-called 'Izzy' must be stopped at all costs. I'm going to write a letter to Batman. He'll know what to do.

Oh give me a break man.... Do you have nothing better to do than quote my every word?

Even if I didn't say it correctly, you know what I meant. The "hacking" sentence was stupid of me to say, but you know my main idea.

WarKaster · Aug 08, 2007, 11:30 PM // 23:30

why did i just read 5 pages of this....pardon me while i go shove a hot poker in my eyes to ease the bleeding.....I have played both didn't care much for WoW so I played GW it fit my what i was looking for so this is I play..WoW and GW are two completely different games....while they have some similarities so does every single RPG ever made..... Please stop comparing them its getting old...

Lamoidz · Aug 09, 2007, 04:49 AM // 04:49

No seriously guys, Mass effect AND dragon age? Bioware Ftw.