Curse

Riot Narita · Sep 20, 2007, 09:23 AM // 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleeper Service

the issue is when an El comes up against a El Boss in GWEN who uses SF for example and the player cannot cap (or can cap but cant use) that elite because they dont own the corresponding chapter....but that player PAID for GWEN! (and EVERYTHING that comes in it)

The player already has access to everything that came with GW:EN, and then some. For players, SF did not come with GW:EN. It came with Nightfall.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleeper Service

Hissy go troll somewhere else, your input is irrelevant

Unable to counter? So your last resort is to call me a troll, and tell me to go away?

Read Argon Draeth's posts. He is putting things more nicely than me.

Sleeper Service · Sep 20, 2007, 09:26 AM // 09:26

there are 63 Elite skills available in GWEN that is FAR less even Chapter 1 (ninety something if i recall) a person who does not own all chapters will not be able to use the skills that they dont have the professions for (using the new professions was one of the major or THE major incentive for buying those chapters in the first place) so it will be even less.
Its a minuscule amount of material compared to what they would get if they bought the corresponding chapter anyways.

before someone brings it up, yes i know you can use sigs to cap non elite skills as well. Even so its naught but a drop in the ocean.

If anything it would give these people an actual incentive to go buy the other chapters once they try out the skills.

arcanemacabre · Sep 20, 2007, 09:49 AM // 09:49

Wait, so what's the problem? The elite skills for each campaign are content for their respective campaigns. The only exception is the core skills, which are content for owning any campaign. Now, that said, GW:EN is an expansion, not a campaign. It apparently follows different rules, and thus, has no elites of its own. I don't see how anyone is cheated or jipped or anything like that just for not being able to steal content from other campaigns they don't own, just because the monsters can.

I mean really, is that the reasoning, here? The monsters can use 'em, so why can't I? Seriously?

sykoone · Sep 20, 2007, 10:54 AM // 10:54

You're forgetting one thing. Nightfall set a precedent for putting in content that people without Factions couldn't access...capping of sin and rit skills. This is just an extension of that. The campaign specific skills should not be capable by people who don't own the originating campaign. If you allow that, what incentive would they have to go get it if they haven't already? Furthermore, if you remove the campaign specific skills from GWEN, it'll gimp the monster skillbars severely, so removing them is absolutely out of the question. So the only option left is to have them in game, but locked for those who don't own the campaign.

Besides, if they do allow the capping of elites for non-campaign owners, then someone's going to gripe how they can't cap the non-elites. Then you'll have campaign owners mad that the non-campaign owners got these skills for free.

Sleeper Service · Sep 20, 2007, 11:28 AM // 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by sykoone

You're forgetting one thing. Nightfall set a precedent for putting in content that people without Factions couldn't access...capping of sin and rit skills. This is just an extension of that. The campaign specific skills should not be capable by people who don't own the originating campaign. If you allow that, what incentive would they have to go get it if they haven't already? Furthermore, if you remove the campaign specific skills from GWEN, it'll gimp the monster skillbars severely, so removing them is absolutely out of the question. So the only option left is to have them in game, but locked for those who don't own the campaign.

Besides, if they do allow the capping of elites for non-campaign owners, then someone's going to gripe how they can't cap the non-elites. Then you'll have campaign owners mad that the non-campaign owners got these skills for free.

you can only cap Rt or Sin or any class skill if you have the profession in the first place. there is a difference between doing that and not letting any of the CORE professions or any profession you might own cap a skill that is THERE, VISIBLE and being used in game.

Im getting the impression i'm talking to a bunch of people who own all the chapters and simply cant accept the fact that other people gain access to a FEW skills from a campaign they don't own.

GWEN IS NOT FREE http://www.plaync.com/us/games/gwen/. sheesh!

that and the disagreeable feeling that you either are skimming through not paying attention to what is being said or not caring.

Either way i've explained as clearly as i could, since most of you seem hellbent on paying for stuff that should be rightfully already yours i'll leave it at that.

Where the hell are you guys when people are proposing viable pay for content ideas ?

Belicosos Finos · Sep 20, 2007, 11:57 AM // 11:57

This is no different to some of the shiroken bosses that appear in nightfall that have factions skills. If you don't have factions you can't use them.

Star Burst and Auspicious Parry.

Saphatorael · Sep 20, 2007, 12:10 PM // 12:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleeper Service

you go into the restaurant, you order burger X that costs 2£ and get no bun.
some other dude goes and orders that very same burger X that costs 2£ and gets a bun.

can you not see that is just wrong ?

For as much as me and A11Eur0 have our disagreements what you are trying to make him say there is simply not correct.

K, allow me to kill the burger analogy.
Guild Wars is the amalgame of the burger, consistent out of 4 parts.

1. The buns (Prophecies)
2. The meat (Factions)
3. The veggies (Nightfall)
4. The sauce (Eye of the North)

You mentioned paying full price, though actually, you have only paid for the meat and sauce. And that is what you will get, even if the sauce contains little bits of the parts (e.g. bread crumbs, gravy from the meat, a tomato seed)

So, if you want a complete burger, you pay for all the parts.

Long story short, you don't have the entire burger, nor have you paid for it (You only paid half, and you're only getting half). People with all 4 parts can fully enjoy their meal, you can't. Even if you have the little bits of the other parts in your own burger, you'll hardly taste them.
That's just the way GW's marketing strategy works, and you don't hear me complaining, for I have paid for all the parts, and they're letting me enjoy my burger.

EDIT: clarified the text a bit, had a few bad word choices; also, turning the tables ftw.

Kryth · Sep 20, 2007, 01:10 PM // 13:10

I think A.Net should allow the skillscaps, but not allow us to use them. Why? Cuz heroes can use locked skills as well. I had a 10day/14hour trial for nightfall and I unlocked all the necro skills when I was rushing thru, now Livia can summon shambling horrors. I still don't own Nightfall. Lucky me I guess.

Kakumei · Sep 20, 2007, 01:30 PM // 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleeper Service

the issue is when an El comes up against a El Boss in GWEN who uses SF for example and the player cannot cap (or can cap but cant use) that elite because they dont own the corresponding chapter....but that player PAID for GWEN! (and EVERYTHING that comes in it.

This is working under the assumption that these elites came with Eye of the North. These elites did not come with Eye of the North, they are merely used in it--so your conclusion is false.

Bankai · Sep 20, 2007, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saphatorael

Bla bla bla

Thank god someone fixed the horrible burger analogy.

I can make a point without cussing, but you're (the op/guys defending him) so retarded that I thought it was the only way I could get into your mind.

Coraline Jones · Sep 20, 2007, 02:00 PM // 14:00

I don't understand this burger analogy...

All I can say is, this is not some kind of new event. For a very long time, Guild Wars will not let you use any skill from a campaign that you do not own. This is extremely apparent if you use a skill like Inspired Hex and you remove a hex off of a player that has a hex for a campaign you don't own: It will replace Inspired Hex with an icon with a huge lock symbol on it. I.e., you get to have a totally unusable skill for 20 seconds.

In the above example, it's not like there are fleets of mesmers running around waiting for a monster or player to hex them just so they can "sploit" a skill for less than a half a minute. But ANet made it extremely clear that this was working as designed, despite that many people got very upset about it.

As a result, Eye of the North denying players to capture Elites isn't much of a surprise. You can argue endlessly over how fair it is or not, but it will not change no matter how many people petition.

Lopezus · Sep 20, 2007, 02:20 PM // 14:20

Quote:

Following your logic a person who only owns Chapter One (no Rt) and who buys GWEN should result in one of these two things:

1. Has no access to Xandra (no quest triggered, cant get the hero at all)

or

2. Has Access to Xandra but she has a EMPTY skillbar.

in fact if you don't unlock GWEN Rt skills either from Temple of Balthazar or from hero skill trainer in gwen she as well can have empty skillbar b/c all her skills (factions based ) are locked.

I_Eat_Haoles · Sep 21, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dingo Dave

I think some may have misunderstood the burger/bun explanation.

2 years ago I bought a burger and it was whole, I then bought another, another and finally one extra special new burger, (for a total of 4 burgers)

Someone else has just found that they like burgers as well, so they buy 1 intial burger and then pay for the extra special new burger.

Everything seems equal to start with, but eventually - the other person finds that they are not allowed to eat all of there extra special burger - the staff come and clear it away before they have had a chance to eat it all. There reason, they have not bought the other 2 burgers, and so are not allowed to eat there gherkins!!!

Thats exactly how I feel! The staff needs let the customer eat the whole burger. I also recall the staff using the same reskinned burgers too...

Yichi · Sep 21, 2007, 07:05 PM // 19:05

Ok end of this thread discussion.

You're allowed to cap certain skills aka the core skills in every campaign. Prophecies, Factions, and Nightfall all have the same core skills available to all characters. Some elites or skills such as Burning arrow, or Light of Deliverance are campaign only skills that are linked with the Nightfall campaign. If you do not own the Nightfall campaign, then even if you come across the skill, your character will not have access to it, so the cap signet will be grey'd out with the lock button not allowing you to acquire this skill.

While you may have paid for Guild Wars: Eye of the North, these skills were added in from a different campaign, so therefore not specifically linked to EOTN. If these skills were linked to only EOTN, then you would be allowed to cap and use them freely.

pingu666 · Sep 21, 2007, 07:05 PM // 19:05

i thought they would just use the core elite skills on the gwen bosses, but they didnt, so we have this, sigh

thor thunder · Sep 21, 2007, 07:06 PM // 19:06

Ok sleeper
your funny but seriously if you only purchased Factions and proph and eye then you have no entitlement to NF skills.. yes it seems unfair to you but to ppl like me who HAVE invested in the hole series its NOT a bad thing, i would get very pissed if the AI's didnt use them most NF skills are overpowered so if the AI didnt use them they would be to easy to kill = boring
dont complain about a product you havent purchased you say that its like "buying a burgeer but geting no bun but the guy next to you paid same price and gets his bun" that makes NO sence YOU DIDNT buy NF so you DONT get the skills, others DID buy it so they DO get the skills.. you dont think thru your comments very much..
Yes you did pay for Eye GREAT so now you get GW:EN SKILLS not NF skills...
when i buy tokyo drift do i expect to get a car with it HELL NO I didnt pay for the car i payed for the MOVIE... its very simple if they chose to use NF skills in GWen great its THERE choice
but if u want to complain about it so you dont have to pay another 30$ for a expansion! Get the hell out of this guys thread.

Sry but No you cant cap skills from a champagin you dont have. you dont like its simple quit or buy the full game.

HawkofStorms · Sep 21, 2007, 08:39 PM // 20:39

There is already a precident for this.

Both double dragon AND shroud of silence could be capped in NF.

Since they were both Factions only skills however, they were locked if you don't own the game.