Curse

Hanok Odbrook · Sep 28, 2007, 10:37 AM // 10:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

oh so video games=real life?

Apparently, as you can see the myriad of children that seem to have posted in this thread over the last many pages.

But anyway, first things first. Why does anyone feel like they need to come on a thread and defend an aspect of this game. Really, for argument's sake let's say Tabasco is a complete idiot who has never PvPed a second in his life. Who the frig cares one whit about what he believes PvP to be in that case? If he's an idiot, why justify anything he says with any response in these forums at all?

Does his belief affect your gameplay?
No

Will others believe what he says and take the same point of view?
Probably, but as one PvPer said here, less than 25% of the players are really any skilled at it, so I assume they won't be included. Of the others, I again state so friggin' what? Let them believe and say whatever they want - it will never affect how you, I, or anyone else plays this game. In that case, I take the stand of not wasting my time or valuable forum space with inane responses and flames that get us nowhere.

If Tabasco came in with his next post and said the sky was purple and all PvPers suck because of it - how many of you would feel the compulsion to pop on and waste more forum space telling him he's an idiot and he's wrong? Quite frankly, I don't give a darn what color he thinks the sky is or how it relates to PvP skill. It still DOESN'T CHANGE HOW I AM PLAYING THE DARN GAME.

With that being said (sorry Tabasco to use you as the example), why don't we try to actually be contructive here and analyze what the real problem is. A previous poster indicated that the "you suck" flames and such are warrented based on OP's initial post. That's a pretty asinine attitude. Why don't we instead take a look at why he posted, and if it has any value in regards to the game, which I think it does. Clearly this is a rage post (I know I have been guilty of the same on occassion), so let's take that for what it is, but also realize that the OP does indeed have a point.

I'm not going to repeat my previous views here, yall will just have to wade through your myriad of wasted spaced posts to go back and take a look, but let's remember, this game (outside of PvP, Elite areas, and HM) is supposed to be designed for the casual player. As other, more level-headed and useful posts pointed out here, not all areas of Normal Mode seems geared that way. Build Experimentation is not suited to a casual player, so telling someone to find another build to use for his character is not an option. So let's find a suitable solution that Anet can use to bring this game back to its roots. I have posted my suggestions, and one other person diagrees with me. We have since then had an intelligent and flame retardant debate on the matter as a means to hash out a workable idea that Anet can institute in the game.

I still believe my changes to the combat system, and changes to creature AI (posted several months ago in another thread) would solve not only the OP's issue, but several other ongoing issues in GW. So let's actually get back some having a useful debate on this thread - anyone up for the challenge, or should I find a more intelligent arena to enter for this issue?

Hanok Odbrook
Real Millennium Group Guild
Truth * Knowledge * Peace

mahmoud_ahmadinejad · Sep 28, 2007, 10:40 AM // 10:40

did not read

Snow Bunny · Sep 28, 2007, 02:02 PM // 14:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanok Odbrook

Apparently, as you can see the myriad of children that seem to have posted in this thread over the last many pages.

But anyway, first things first. Why does anyone feel like they need to come on a thread and defend an aspect of this game. Really, for argument's sake let's say Tabasco is a complete idiot who has never PvPed a second in his life. Who the frig cares one whit about what he believes PvP to be in that case? If he's an idiot, why justify anything he says with any response in these forums at all?

Does his belief affect your gameplay?
No

Will others believe what he says and take the same point of view?
Probably, but as one PvPer said here, less than 25% of the players are really any skilled at it, so I assume they won't be included. Of the others, I again state so friggin' what? Let them believe and say whatever they want - it will never affect how you, I, or anyone else plays this game. In that case, I take the stand of not wasting my time or valuable forum space with inane responses and flames that get us nowhere.

If Tabasco came in with his next post and said the sky was purple and all PvPers suck because of it - how many of you would feel the compulsion to pop on and waste more forum space telling him he's an idiot and he's wrong? Quite frankly, I don't give a darn what color he thinks the sky is or how it relates to PvP skill. It still DOESN'T CHANGE HOW I AM PLAYING THE DARN GAME.

With that being said (sorry Tabasco to use you as the example), why don't we try to actually be contructive here and analyze what the real problem is. A previous poster indicated that the "you suck" flames and such are warrented based on OP's initial post. That's a pretty asinine attitude. Why don't we instead take a look at why he posted, and if it has any value in regards to the game, which I think it does. Clearly this is a rage post (I know I have been guilty of the same on occassion), so let's take that for what it is, but also realize that the OP does indeed have a point.

I'm not going to repeat my previous views here, yall will just have to wade through your myriad of wasted spaced posts to go back and take a look, but let's remember, this game (outside of PvP, Elite areas, and HM) is supposed to be designed for the casual player. As other, more level-headed and useful posts pointed out here, not all areas of Normal Mode seems geared that way. Build Experimentation is not suited to a casual player, so telling someone to find another build to use for his character is not an option. So let's find a suitable solution that Anet can use to bring this game back to its roots. I have posted my suggestions, and one other person diagrees with me. We have since then had an intelligent and flame retardant debate on the matter as a means to hash out a workable idea that Anet can institute in the game.

I still believe my changes to the combat system, and changes to creature AI (posted several months ago in another thread) would solve not only the OP's issue, but several other ongoing issues in GW. So let's actually get back some having a useful debate on this thread - anyone up for the challenge, or should I find a more intelligent arena to enter for this issue?

Hanok Odbrook
Real Millennium Group Guild
Truth * Knowledge * Peace

These walls of text are really obnoxious to read.
The best writing is the most concise, truth be told.

All that some of us pvpers have been saying is that PvP will teach you better knowledge of the game.

Furthermore, we have all agreed that this game is build wars. This is established fact. Stop debating the nuances of this or attempt to subvert this by introducing some non-existant childish notion of serious desire to role-playing as high importance.

I don't care that your smiting hammer warrior can't kill magni the bison. You should just get a good build, and role-play where it's convenient.

Chicken Ftw · Sep 28, 2007, 02:30 PM // 14:30

I'd argue against pretty much everything Tabasco has said, but lately, he's resorting to pulling things out of his ass and presenting them as fact, so I think I'll just keep watching and laughing. Gassing graduates, haha, that was a good one.

Dr Strangelove · Sep 28, 2007, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanok Odbrook

I'm not going to repeat my previous views here, yall will just have to wade through your myriad of wasted spaced posts to go back and take a look, but let's remember, this game (outside of PvP, Elite areas, and HM) is supposed to be designed for the casual player. As other, more level-headed and useful posts pointed out here, not all areas of Normal Mode seems geared that way. Build Experimentation is not suited to a casual player, so telling someone to find another build to use for his character is not an option. So let's find a suitable solution that Anet can use to bring this game back to its roots. I have posted my suggestions, and one other person diagrees with me. We have since then had an intelligent and flame retardant debate on the matter as a means to hash out a workable idea that Anet can institute in the game.

Or, alternatively, you could stop sucking at the game at get a decent build. NM PvE isn't hard by any stretch of the imagination.

Hanok Odbrook · Sep 28, 2007, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

These walls of text are really obnoxious to read.
The best writing is the most concise, truth be told.

All that some of us pvpers have been saying is that PvP will teach you better knowledge of the game.

Furthermore, we have all agreed that this game is build wars. This is established fact. Stop debating the nuances of this or attempt to subvert this by introducing some non-existant childish notion of serious desire to role-playing as high importance.

I don't care that your smiting hammer warrior can't kill magni the bison. You should just get a good build, and role-play where it's convenient.

Well first, I belive in stating all I have to say at once instead of breaking up into little thoughts across myraids of little posts, but I'll try to keep them shorter so your attention doesn't wander.

Second, I agree that PvP will teach you to become a better player, I don't believe I said otherwise. I consider PvP to be the top competitive portion of this game, but as you rightly point out, skill alone will not make you a top level player, you must be able to play the right build with the right team - that is a distinctly non-casual aspect of this game, and let's all try to remember that GW was advertised as a casual friendly game. On top of that, I and anyone else should have the freedom to play this game in the mode that makes it the most interesting and enjoyable for us. I just happen to like the Role-playing abilities of PvE and will continue to play that way as it makes for a better game IMO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

Or, alternatively, you could stop sucking at the game....

Hmmm, interesting. Exactly how did you come to that conclusion? I don't believe we've ever matched up in PvP or have had the opportunity to party up for PvE. And to be honest with you, I never had any complaints from the players I've explored with or helped in PvE, and have had occassion for some players to ask for my advice for PvP matches. So if someone is spreading vicious rumors about my ability to play GW, please let me know who they are, so I can set the record straight.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

NM PvE isn't hard by any stretch of the imagination.

I haven't said otherwise. In fact I think the combat in PvE has gotten so boringly easy that it is one of the reasons I would like to see some changes to bring the challenge back.

Hanok Odbrook
Real Millennium Group Guild
Truth * Knowledge * Peace

KANE OG · Sep 28, 2007, 08:33 PM // 20:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

Seriously, do you realize how retarded you look right now?

Weee! NOW it's starting to get fun!

KANE

SotiCoto · Sep 28, 2007, 08:46 PM // 20:46

Request /close.

This thread has been beyond a joke for many MANY pages now.

Burst Cancel · Sep 28, 2007, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by TabascoSauce

Your allegations of team sports and bad players being sacked, or corporations and such, is a good comparison for PvP. This is not PvP. Those are occasions where a specific group of people with the right specialties are brought together to achieve a common goal, which does not resemble PvE in the slightest.

You assert that PvE does not comprise bringing a group of people together to achieve a common goal. This assertion is simply not credible, as nearly every mission and quest in the game serves exactly the function you claim is absent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TabascoSauce

PvP, as has been shown, does not sell enough games to support itself, so ANet knows that PvE is their bread and butter. We pay for your convenience, because you cannot support yourself. Without "them", there would be no "you".

Irrelevant to the current issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TabascoSauce

So, Burst Cancel, the process can be broken down to steps. The poster posts, sometimes well, sometimes poorly. A bunch of posters scream "Fail!" at him. He flames back. Other posters offer help. The OP goes on his merry way.

This is not an unusual occurence, as we all can see. The whole "Fail!"/flame cycle could be skipped, because it is irrelevant, and offers no value.

This is a no-brainer. You folks can try and try and try, but there is no good reason, ever, to use "Fail!" or otherwise ridicule any poster asking for help in PvE, be it well or poorly.

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

Again, there is a tremendous difference between asking for help, rather than claiming that there is something wrong with the game. Using "fail" in the second situation constitutes merely statement of fact - the OP has indeed failed, moreso because they have attempted to attribute the failure to some cause other than the actual cause. Whether or not there is "any reason" per se to use "fail", there is not, in fact, anything wrong with doing so.

You could similarly argue that posting on these forums (including this entire thread) is a waste of time, and that there isn't "any reason" to do so. We're still here, aren't we?

Crom The Pale · Sep 29, 2007, 12:09 AM // 00:09

hmm....so the mods have decided this is the 'free for all flame wars thread' huh?

Now what could I possible say to push things over the edge......

How many PvPer's does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

4 - one to plan it, one to do it, one to call him a noob for doing it wrong and one to rage quit.

How many PvEer's does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

4 - one with a plan, 2 to hold the last guy upside down while he attempts to use his bare foot to screw in the lightbulb

byteme! · Sep 29, 2007, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Request /close.

This thread has been beyond a joke for many MANY pages now.

OMG FINALLY!!!! Are you done now? How ironic of you to think this thread has become a joke considering you've been the focal point of all the bullshit.

More Outrage · Sep 29, 2007, 12:27 AM // 00:27

What a waste of time, reading through this thread that is!

Did anyone help the OP? NO!!

25 pages and no builds that I can remember that can take on so many conditions and finally the hexes and such from the necro bastard.
Seems the thread was taken over by a bunch of argumentative no-lifers with nothing more than the old shit to spout. "You suck", "PvP teaches u how to be better", "GW:EN is easy" STFU... If it`s so easy just tell and show seeing as your so skilled.

The dungeon in question sucks and is not on par with the rest of lvl20 content in GW or for that matter the other dungeons.

Don`t know if the mods should shut this thread down but they should delete the useless posts (including mine, sorry I can`t help anyone anymore than wiki can) then it might be easier to read at around 3 pages or less.

Burst Cancel · Sep 29, 2007, 02:18 AM // 02:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crom The Pale

How many PvPer's does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

4 - one to plan it, one to do it, one to call him a noob for doing it wrong and one to rage quit.

How many PvEer's does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

4 - one with a plan, 2 to hold the last guy upside down while he attempts to use his bare foot to screw in the lightbulb

I like the first one ... but I don't really get the second one *scratch*.

I'd say it only takes one PvEer to screw in a lightbulb, because they just command their H/H to do it for them.

Chicken Ftw · Sep 29, 2007, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

I like the first one ... but I don't really get the second one *scratch*.

I'd say it only takes one PvEer to screw in a lightbulb, because they just command their H/H to do it for them.

I think the second one was a reference to all the idiots who spew trash like "PvE isn't a challenge because you're using good builds... Try taking only six people with subpar bars if you want a challenge!"

But your joke was much better and more appropriate.

Avarre · Sep 29, 2007, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

It's Coca-Cola, actually.

Glass of wine, myself.

Snow Bunny · Sep 29, 2007, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Glass of wine, myself.

Barcadi and Coca cola. Faer's half-right.

YunSooJin · Sep 29, 2007, 08:06 PM // 20:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

Barcadi and Coca cola. Faer's half-right.

I drink from a gigantic jug of Kool-Aid.

Squiver · Sep 29, 2007, 08:14 PM // 20:14

I do dungeon runs all the time for farming. It's just important to try and figure out what the norm is for the particular dungeon and then try and come up with an appropriate counter build. For instance, I usually do the Cathedral of Flames dungeon and have a lot of AoE skills for it, plus Light of Deldrimore and other holy damage to burn the zombies and ghosts.

Crom The Pale · Sep 29, 2007, 10:54 PM // 22:54

498

hmmm..........

Crom The Pale · Sep 29, 2007, 10:55 PM // 22:55

499

hmmmm.........