Curse

Kaida the Heartless · Oct 19, 2007, 01:06 AM // 01:06

Okay, it seems to me that most of hardmode in EotN is a bit broken. It doesn't quite seem like everything was tested thoroughly. At first, the only part of it that was even remotely a challenge was the summit dwarves. Understandable. Slaver's Exile is supposed to be hard. That's alright. Now, I just encountered a group of Charr... now this is a load of bs.

Groups can stand through multiple copies of Spiteful Spirit, Reaper's Mark, Spoil Victor, and Craploads of other degeneration pressure. I mean, what the hell? It also wouldn't hurt to give thier monks SOME form of an energy cap. I watched a Summit Priest in Slaver's cast Spirit Bond 9 times in a row, back to back. Honestly, this is weak. If the only way to defeat players now is to break the game's rules, such as energy caps or pips, I'm gonna be sorta pissed. I end up stalemating with both groups because neither of us can kill each other. It sucks to fight against monks with infinite energy.

As a general rule, I think it's safe to say that if War Machine couldn't beat hexpressure face to face, then there's no way in hell any NPC should be able to. :P

Is anyone here on the same page with me, at all?

Disclaimer: Hard mode is hard. Yea. I get it. But when I've vanquished every other continent with NO problem whatsoever, and I hit this, it makes me wonder.

AW Lore · Oct 19, 2007, 02:18 AM // 02:18

casters have slightly more energy than some classes/players, while playing with two mesmers with energy burn/surge, and me using aneurysm, ive found that warrior classes (on NM) have base 20, rangers 30, and casters range from 40-60, facing an avalanche i once gave him a 90 return.

in HM, warriors had 25, rangers 35, and most casters seem to have around 50 or so energy

have in mind that players and classes using insignias and runes can also reach their counterpart in energy quantity, but i do not know if htey have more energy pips.

also remember that in gwen, most classes have some sort of energy management (charr prophets have power drain)

crazybanshee · Oct 19, 2007, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Yeah actually my secret for vanquishing the charr is immediately drop a glyph sac/meteor shower on it and just nuke it with everything I have. The interrupts make it slow down just enough to be able to overwhelm it and kill it.

On the other hand, has anyone tried Ooze pit on hard mode? I got wiped and sent back to town before I was even halfway through it. Which is unusual, since I already did Frostmaw hm and a couple others with less trouble...

ヽ(´ー｀)ﾉ · Oct 19, 2007, 03:00 AM // 03:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazybanshee

Yeah actually my secret for vanquishing the charr is immediately drop a glyph sac/meteor shower on it and just nuke it with everything I have. The interrupts make it slow down just enough to be able to overwhelm it and kill it.

On the other hand, has anyone tried Ooze pit on hard mode? I got wiped and sent back to town before I was even halfway through it. Which is unusual, since I already did Frostmaw hm and a couple others with less trouble...

I have, it was easy as long as you target the Elementalists and Mesmers first before the Warriors. Pain Invertor works nicely against them since they use AoE spells right off the bat most of the time.

My party set up was:

Dragon Slasher [Me]
Sab's updated hero set up
Human Paragon ["Save Yourself!" and "There's Nothing to Fear!"]
Hero Paragon [Defensive Anthem + etc]
Ogden with Healer's Boon

Warskull · Oct 19, 2007, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Charr aren't that bad in hard mode. You just have to understand how to face them. Charr are high physical offense with moderate caster support. Their monks are a bit weak and their elementalists have long casts.

To beat them you need two key items, block based passive defense and interrupts. Use aegis, defensive anthem, wards, shields up and interrupts and they won't be so bad. Also knocking down the monk tends to lead to a rapid demise.

As for the ooze pit, this is a caster heavy area with strong AoE. For the love of god do not ball up! The ooze's weakness, they ball up. Throw AoE right back in their face. Rodgort's Invocation, barrage, splinter weapon, and dervish attacks are prime examples. Earthbound Oozes then shimmering oozes.

Racthoh · Oct 19, 2007, 05:19 AM // 05:19

For the charr after dropping their priest/prophet, make sure to interrupt the Ressurection Chant from the dominator if you haven't already killed it. I find my physical heavy group tends to have issues on occasions with the charr, as a result of the Aegis on the flameshielders and the Faintheartedness from the reapers.

Draccor The Great · Oct 19, 2007, 05:32 AM // 05:32

Well This is HM. I have been out vanquishing Sacnoth Valley Wardowns and everywhere else in Gwen. I have had very little problems killing groups. Go for there monk first and the rest fall easy.

Plus with the ursan blessing you only need one skill on a few ppl and it makes it alot easier.

Ozze Pit yep wiped few times had cc but that is a fun dungeon even if they wipe you quick.

Kaida the Heartless · Oct 19, 2007, 06:13 AM // 06:13

Well, it just seems like Hardmode turned every area into a dungeon, as far as needing a tank goes. Unfortunately, I cannot supply this because I use a Necro (and heroes are stupid). Which reminds me, where is my "do not move" button?! :]

I was facing Duncan today and I had a toucher vamp me 38 times in a row.
Simple math:

38 Touches @ ~ 1.3 seconds each
38 x 1.3 = ~ 50 Seconds Touch Time
50 Seconds x 1.3 Energy Regen = 65 Energy Recharged
38 Touches @ 15 Energy Each = 570 Energy
570 Energy - 65 Energy Recharged = 505 Energy Burned in a Row
Wow.

I would really like to test anuerism on these guys just to see if thier energy pool is really that high.

Hell, even at 10 pips of energy regen, that toucher still burned 405 Energy.

The point being: I enjoy a challenge, but I hate it when the rules are bent in their favor. Honestly, they already have a 50% buff, now they have infinite energy? I'm going to go test some stuff.

blue.rellik · Oct 19, 2007, 06:20 AM // 06:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

Well, it just seems like Hardmode turned every area into a dungeon, as far as needing a tank goes. Unfortunately, I cannot supply this because I use a Necro (and heroes are stupid). Which reminds me, where is my "do not move" button?! :]

I was facing Duncan today and I had a toucher vamp me 38 times in a row.
Simple math:

38 Touches @ ~ 1.3 seconds each
38 x 1.3 = ~ 50 Seconds Touch Time
50 Seconds x 1.3 Energy Regen = 65 Energy Recharged
38 Touches @ 15 Energy Each = 570 Energy
570 Energy - 65 Energy Recharged = 505 Energy Burned in a Row
Wow.

I would really like to test anuerism on these guys just to see if thier energy pool is really that high.

Hell, even at 10 pips of energy regen, that toucher still burned 405 Energy.

The point being: I enjoy a challenge, but I hate it when the rules are bent in their favor. Honestly, they already have a 50% buff, now they have infinite energy? I'm going to go test some stuff.

You never knew that? I was doing Iron Mines HM and bumped into two White Mantle Priests, I attacked them and came back after 15 minutes and they were both still perfectly fine (and these are the Shield of Regen spammers).

Kaida the Heartless · Oct 19, 2007, 06:50 AM // 06:50

Well, I wouldn't have a problem with this, except for the fact that I used to solo farm the Scar Eater with Wither and Malaise. He would use about 5 spells and be drained of energy, making the kill easy.

AW Lore · Oct 19, 2007, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Hey Kaida, on your observation of the touchers in Duncan, dont forget they could probably be R/N with a high ammount of expertise, to have a rough idea of how much expertise they could have, see the touch skill they use on you, check how much damage, check on wiki how much does a player require to do that much damage, now go in HM and see how much damage it does now, compare how much attribute it requires and see how many points it was raised.

also, i noticed that if you can use a skill (like lets say the ebon vanguard assasin support or a spirit) when it dies, you can see that "you give" energy to your own Necros, i "think" you can use this to see if they have Soul reaping (but not really sure), if they do have, then they are cheating because they have Expertise and Soul reaping

crokodil · Oct 19, 2007, 03:56 PM // 15:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by AW Lore

Hey Kaida, on your observation of the touchers in Duncan, dont forget they could probably be R/N with a high ammount of expertise

They also have shadow prison

pakhavit · Oct 19, 2007, 06:45 PM // 18:45

and they also gain 20+?e with soul reaping.....

and dam jotun spam opposive gaze 15e -__-

but even they have infintie energy still easy to kill ^^

<legendary master of north 1,006

1 more dun in exile

Graphik Desine · Oct 19, 2007, 08:24 PM // 20:24

lol kaida, i know what you mean. i play necro with heroes in HM in attempt to vanquish and do quests/dungeons/missions, and it is a nightmare. they ball up on me all day long, allowing all forms of aoe to destroy my team, and don't always go on the targets i ping. i switch targets quickly to shut down others, and they follow those targets too, where they shouldn't be. so my attempts to pressure go totally out the window ._.

therefore, bringing a ward against harm/melee/elements is a must. they love wards a lot. sometimes they even move out of them, because they like kiting so much now, and they get themselves killed. and then when i WANT them to move, they do not, so i try flagging them, but that seems to be of little help. so i started bringing a communing rit with vitals, shelter, shadowsong, etc. this is starting to fix things!

as for the energy crisis:

i read somewhere (or at least came to the conclusion) a while back that most monsters get "endless energy," especially bosses and higher level/elite types of monsters. i believe certain ones do, but others do not (as sympathetic/ancestors visage work against smites and adrenaline types).

even if you e-deny a monk who does not have a tendency to wand you or hit you with melee, for example, it is like they just keep getting to cast, so even spells like e-surge/e-burn/sympathetic/etc seem to be useless. the builds humans are able to come up with are far superior than what the monsters can dish out, (as they always have the same build, whereas humans have the ability to change team builds) so this is probably why they are incredibly overpowered. and then when you come across 2 monks, they heal each other endlessly. unless you sneak attack one somehow. hopefully the one that does not get resurrected.

it is expected that we use all humans, and these monsters become fairly insignificant when you can split the group on 2 different monsters. like pressure one a lot, then switch to the other, and for some reason it seems to break down and die.

and when you are dealing with creatures that heal practically the entire life bar in 1 spell, remember they have significantly higher divine favor, higher life, higher attributes, etc, etc, so they don't really need a lot of energy to back them up. so if it takes you 5 min to get its life bar down to nothing and uses heal area, and fills it up, it will be a very short time for that energy meter to hit full, and a very long time for your party to get it back where it was.

and same for eles. most of the time they use aura of restoration, glyphs of lesser energy, according to spell-type attunements, etc. but as long as they cannot wipe your party in 1 hit, they will keep going down, unlike monks.

it is sort of an endless cycle of aggravation, and it is probably best to use as many forms of shutdown as possible on your team (diversion/PD, enchant removal, interrupts, broad head arrow, pain inverter, anti-melee etc). those things seem really insignificant, but they help in the long run.

depending on the zone, you won't get a perfect build to annihilate everything easily every time, that is why this is supposed to be "a challenge."

though i do not agree with how overpowered some stuff is, it makes me think a lot about the builds i am using, and the fact that i need specific builds for specific zones, not the same build to play thru the entire game.

now---if more people started up/joined HM dungeon/quest/vanquishing groups, this would be less of a problem. hint, hint.
people know how to spread out, and you can tell certain players to pressure 1 thing while another thing is dying, then gang up on something else, etc etc.

[EW]Elendar · Oct 19, 2007, 10:26 PM // 22:26

Hard mode is hard?

How horribly unfair

Konrow · Oct 19, 2007, 11:30 PM // 23:30

I doubt it was tested very thoroughly and i expect 2 or 3 more. I think they only made hard mode so soon because so many people were whining (as usual) that it was not there and therefore they did not test it a whole lot. Of course i could be totally wrong as i'm pretty sure Anet usually tests there things fairly well.

Graphik Desine · Oct 20, 2007, 12:23 AM // 00:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konrow

I doubt it was tested very thoroughly and i expect 2 or 3 more. I think they only made hard mode so soon because so many people were whining (as usual) that it was not there and therefore they did not test it a whole lot. Of course i could be totally wrong as i'm pretty sure Anet usually tests there things fairly well.

im with you on this. some things do need to be looked at, and some are reasonable.

as far as i have gotten with vanquishing, questing, and dungeons (which would be mostly charr homelands to start off with)---THE worst thing i have come up on is the prismatic ooze. i play with h/h a lot, and they don't seem to know when to stop hitting. those things should not heal back to full health for so much hp so quickly ALL THE TIME...make longer recharge on that skill or make casting time longer for gelatinous absorption so we are able to interrupt it easier...something?

and heroes don't like using shelter? micromanage and still get wiped? and after using candy canes and powerstones, etc?

or come up with hundreds of builds just so one can get past the first group? yeesh...

little things like this...totally overlooked, near impossible.

hard is not supposed to be impossible. i guess for a majority of these areas some of us will just have to sit and wait for an update or just not play anymore, as there are really no pugs for this stuff to help others get thru it or be helped getting thru it ._.