Curse

Andruil · Jan 31, 2008, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Ok I have a few questions.

1. does armor actually make a difference?

2. Do inscriptions make a difference? Now obviously things like health and energy won't have any effect but what about things like the stalwart insignia?

3. For the dagger tang what is better an elemental tang or 20% armor penetration (20% chance)?

Just for the record I have tested the brawn over brains (+15% damage/-5 energy) and it does significantly improve damage. On normal mode with an elemental tang and the brawn over brains I could 2 hit them most of the time.

Now if only there existed a dagger handle of dwarfslaying...

MercenaryKnight · Feb 01, 2008, 12:42 AM // 00:42

Armor does make a difference I am pretty sure. Because if I go in there on my warrior compared to my mesmer I notice I take a lot less damage. Armor insignias probably could work I would believe they would.

Andruil · Feb 01, 2008, 07:19 AM // 07:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryKnight

Armor does make a difference I am pretty sure. Because if I go in there on my warrior compared to my mesmer I notice I take a lot less damage. Armor insignias probably could work I would believe they would.

I just equiped my elementalist out with 4 superior runes (fire, water, air, earth) got all skills up to 9, and put on the prismatic insignias. I seem to take alot less damage as well. Hooray for fixed health

.

I think I've also answered a few of my own questions with experimenting tonight. For anyone who cares here is my findings

1. Normal mode seems to be capped at the damage you can do.
2. Hard mode has a similar cap but its harder to reach.
3. Anything non-health and energy related seems to work. I have no definetive proof only the fact that when I did deck myself out with everything I seem to take a lot less damage.
4. Damage inscriptions help. Brawn over brains is a good one as it is permanent and doesn't actually affect your energy in the game.
5. Elemental tongs seem to help. I've slightly tested this one (extra gold brawling dagger only equipped with a fiery tang) and it seems to do more.
6. I haven't found one yet but the dagger handle of defense or shelter should also help.
7. Hard mode with a fully geared character and fully upgraded dagger isn't that much harder than normal mode if you can manipulate the guys in that ring event to moving far enough away for killroy to spawn.

Once I'm finished with survivors I'll write up a bit more on the topic.

I haven't timed myself fully but I'm down to under 10 minutes on hard mode from the time I rush in to attack the first mob. I know this because I can finish with a scroll of the lightbringers still active.

Edit: I forgot #8. remap key 8 to keys 8, 9, i, and o. when you get knocked down mash all the buttons at once. This gives you alot of energy quickly. (Shamelessly stolen from the other thread :P)

greywolf31 · Feb 01, 2008, 03:46 PM // 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andruil

I just equiped my elementalist out with 4 superior runes (fire, water, air, earth)

Isn't this -300 health?

Is Armor bonus that good?

Prismatic Insignia (Elementalist)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Air Magic)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Earth Magic)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Fire Magic)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Water Magic)

so +20 armor to an Ele so that is 80 armor then, yes?

Did you not have to up Dagger Mastery to garner the pluses of the Knuckles?

-Just trying to understand...

LMK and THX

-T

Andruil · Feb 01, 2008, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by greywolf31

Isn't this -300 health?

Is Armor bonus that good?

Prismatic Insignia (Elementalist)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Air Magic)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Earth Magic)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Fire Magic)
Armor +5 (requires 9 Water Magic)

so +20 armor to an Ele so that is 80 armor then, yes?

Did you not have to up Dagger Mastery to garner the pluses of the Knuckles?

-Just trying to understand...

LMK and THX

-T

Dwarven boxing fixes your health and energy. So anything that modifies your health and energy has no effect during the boxing. Thus even though I only have 180 health outside of boxing it has no affect on my health during boxing. Thus I essentially get +20 armor for free.

Due to the 4 superior runes I can achieve 9 in each rank by only putting 6 points into each attribute. This allows me to max out my dagger skills.

So my attributes look like

5 fire (+3 superior rune +1 head bonus)
6 water (+3 superior rune)
6 earth (+3 superior rune)
6 air (+3 superior rune)
12 daggers

the rest of the points don't have any impact.

Edit: the armor bonus seems to make a noticable difference. I also run with a armor of salvation on hard mode and it also seems to help.

lietzaum · Feb 01, 2008, 07:40 PM // 19:40

i hope that was some cheap armor so it did not cost you that much and i hope you do that battling alot to give you some benift for all the runes

bpphantom · Feb 01, 2008, 08:16 PM // 20:16

Aside from fire, thoes sup runes are dirt cheap.

phan · Feb 01, 2008, 08:20 PM // 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andruil

a armor of salvation on hard mode .

fail ..

Just run naked ; with the 5-5 daggers .. invincible ..

Just run next to the lad spike the target he's spikes ; And all is good ; when at the big chamber [ with the cirle of summits ] go to the left corner just behind the door when you enter it and do it 1v1

Andruil · Feb 01, 2008, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by bpphantom

Aside from fire, thoes sup runes are dirt cheap.

Even the fire one was pretty cheap when I bought it. I'm going for survivors so yeah its pretty sweet. I think I paid between 100-200g per rune. The most expensive part is the scoll of the lightbringer and the essence of celerity.

Phan: I don't know if it does make a difference or not but everything together gives me 1 full run in hard mode in under 10 minutes so its worthwhile to me. I could very likely do without the armor of salvation but eh why not. Though I'm not sure why you'd want to use the 5-5 daggers... I do more damage with my customized upgraded daggers to the point I'm doing between 2-8 damage per normal hit on all but the wolves, ogres and bosses. Anything to get my title quicker so I can actually do something else in the game with this guy is a good thing

.

All in all I'm making 50k xp per run and I usually get at least 1 gold item. I've also gotten normal tomes, elite tomes, and all sorts of junk drops. Plus 2 beer at the end and dwarven points

.

Andruil · Feb 01, 2008, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Once I finsh with my title I'll post a full run down on what I find does what

Edit: Only 337k left to go :P

greywolf31 · Feb 08, 2008, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Running my Mesmer as a Me/A (@ 12 Dagger Mastery) and ThunderFist's
I figure I'll buy a set of 1k and use the Crown as an Armor set for this...

Damage Modifiers on Knuckles works right?

Since Health and Energy are pre-set...

What would be a good Rune?

Here's a (Noob) rune question anyway...
You only need one of any condition modifying rune to gain the effect, yes?
I am pretty sure the percentages won't stack on multiples, but will the chance of the percentage of bonus, consecutively run with multiples?
(I am sure someone can phrase that better...)

What about Brawlers on all pieces for armor bonus insig?

Or Would Progidy's or Virtuoso's work Better?
The Boxing skill ARE classified as skills, so they meet the worded requirements.
Or do those only work for Mesmer Skills?

LMK and THX

EDIT: Ok Didn't bother with Prodigy or Virtuoso as they were too conditional... Went with a full set of Brawler's and the same Condition Rune for crippling reduction...
The Knuckles were modded out for extra Damage, not customized, as I may want to loan 'em to my other characters til they get their own... lol

Went Easy as Pie... also reassigning 9 and 0 to 8 helps.

Only thing I would add is to try and pull groups near the end part to keep from being overwhelmed.

-T

Andruil · Feb 11, 2008, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by greywolf31

Running my Mesmer as a Me/A (@ 12 Dagger Mastery) and ThunderFist's
I figure I'll buy a set of 1k and use the Crown as an Armor set for this...

Damage Modifiers on Knuckles works right?

Since Health and Energy are pre-set...

What would be a good Rune?

Here's a (Noob) rune question anyway...
You only need one of any condition modifying rune to gain the effect, yes?
I am pretty sure the percentages won't stack on multiples, but will the chance of the percentage of bonus, consecutively run with multiples?
(I am sure someone can phrase that better...)

What about Brawlers on all pieces for armor bonus insig?

Or Would Progidy's or Virtuoso's work Better?
The Boxing skill ARE classified as skills, so they meet the worded requirements.
Or do those only work for Mesmer Skills?

LMK and THX

EDIT: Ok Didn't bother with Prodigy or Virtuoso as they were too conditional... Went with a full set of Brawler's and the same Condition Rune for crippling reduction...
The Knuckles were modded out for extra Damage, not customized, as I may want to loan 'em to my other characters til they get their own... lol

Went Easy as Pie... also reassigning 9 and 0 to 8 helps.

Only thing I would add is to try and pull groups near the end part to keep from being overwhelmed.

-T

I can't comment on what would be good runes for you as a mesmer. I do know that the more armor the better and I believe there is a +10 armor vs physical so that might be a good idea.

As far as the weapon goes I would recommend customizing it if you are going to do hard mode. For normal mode it doesn't make much of a difference from the couple of times I tried it. Brawns over brains is an excellent inscription. I personally took an elemental handle and from my very limited testing it seems to do more damage.

For normal mode save up your adrenaline when you reach that last hallway before the giant ring event. Then when you go into the center hit 5 to ko the first guy. Then hit 6 + 4 to take out the second guy (only works with upgraded weapons) if needed hit 2 to finish him. Then start killing. You should easily be killing them faster than they come at you. One trick I've found is to charge in before kilroy in order to get them to always attack you first. This way kilroy is a nice addition to your dps. Once you get down to the last couple of dwarves save your adrenaline again. Now quickly take out the first 2 dwarves next to the lieutenant. After the lieutenant and his 2 sidekicks start attacking quickly take out the 2 normal dwarves. This makes taking on the boss alot easier as you can time blocking and knockdowns. Then for the final attack I just let kilroy tank one and I take the other.

For hardmode. IF you are going for a survivors title I highly recommend using an essence of celerity per run. You get +25% run speed, +25% skill recharge, and +25% attack speed. The run speed here is key. For that ring event at the end it helps you revive kilroy by running away far enough for him to respawn without taking a massive number of hits along the way. I also recommend customizing your weapon for the +20% damage. I was actually getting 2-8 damage on alot of the dwarves on my normal attacks. It adds up especially when you are trying to time a block because you are low on health. I have no clue how often crits happen but the armor of salvation might be useful. I used it but wasn't really bothering doing any tests at the time (just finishing survivors). All in all I got down to about an 8 minute run in hard mode. It took quite a bit of practice though.

greywolf31 · Feb 12, 2008, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Hey, thanx for the advice...

I'll look into those runes you mentioned.
Yeah, the extra 20% may be a deciding factor in how much the speed of the run will change...

Didn't know about running ahead of Kilroy... Good Idea.

THX for the input!

-T

Andruil · Feb 12, 2008, 07:18 PM // 19:18

NP. For normal mode I only needed the +15% and a fiery dagger handle to be honest. After that I could kill things 90% of the time by using skill 6 and then skill 4. Some areas are great places to save up addrenaline. For example the 2 wolves do almost no damage and the 2 guys right before the ranger are easy enough to kill without using the addrenaline skills. That then makes the ranger hallway alot easier.

Then for the last 4 rangers experiment to see what works for you to have full addrenaline for the ring event.

Lykan · Feb 14, 2008, 11:21 AM // 11:21

Anyone know why Triple Exp scrolls are bugged in HM, I used a LB scroll and was only getting 700exp per kill on a dwarf, where a HM kill without a scroll gives 300exp, a HM kill with a double exp scroll gives 600exp so why doesn't a HM kill with a triple exp scroll give 900exp??

Bug or intentional?

seut · Feb 14, 2008, 01:31 PM // 13:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lykan

Anyone know why Triple Exp scrolls are bugged in HM, I used a LB scroll and was only getting 700exp per kill on a dwarf, where a HM kill without a scroll gives 300exp, a HM kill with a double exp scroll gives 600exp so why doesn't a HM kill with a triple exp scroll give 900exp??

Bug or intentional?

max xp/kill is capped (can't remember where i read that)

Lykan · Feb 14, 2008, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by seut

max xp/kill is capped (can't remember where i read that)

If that were true then how come the first boss gives 1008exp?

Andruil · Feb 15, 2008, 06:18 AM // 06:18

Bah I noticed that too... Hard mode definately seems to be capped

Andruil · Feb 15, 2008, 09:19 PM // 21:19

lol yeah.... I don't quite get that. Also my whole point was to demonstrate that it had been nerfed. Which... if you noticed in my post I showed why it was nerfed. damage per skill now != damage per skill before with upgrades. Regardless of if you can do it still in 8-9 minutes the fact of the matter is it has been nerfed.

If anything this thread should be closed because armor and upgrades have no effect there now.

Kaleban · Feb 20, 2008, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Why would you pay 1.2 plat for a Lightbringer scroll when xp is capped out at 700, instead of getting the Slayer's Insight Scroll (250% of 300 xp = 750, down to 700) which gives you max xp per kill, with the condition that you kill a boss within 5 minutes, and there are two.

And Slayer's scrolls are 800 gold a piece... save a bit of green.