Curse

Lopezus · Nov 28, 2007, 01:47 PM // 13:47

i did this dungeon with h/h like 2 or 3 weeks ago, well it wasnt easy but i was prepared for it, so i got to boss without no DP and full morale bonus, i played as a AoM Dervish,+ Gwen - full of interputs ( Power block,power spike,power drain,arcan conundrum !), Margrid ( Baragge + interupts ), Sousuke ( Ward againt harm or agaisnt elements ), Mehnlo,Lina,Eve,Herta . I engaged the boss and without throghfully reading wiki i found my party swept by flaming balls -wipe- rez ,another go :i tried to flag h/h to avoid balls and fight Isiluder at the same time- no good : party runing around not doing anythig useful - boss wipe - rez, another go : by pure luck i flag party not one way of flaming balls = your H/H party ready for him, isildur was totally shut down , not casting a single spell, and went down extremmly quick in comparison to other dungeon bosses with massive HP. For me the toughest part were rolling balls , Isildur himself hasn't posed so much threat.

tmr819 · Nov 28, 2007, 01:56 PM // 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

Has anyone tried running a whole party with elemental resistance and mantra of flame up?

That would be a mite tricky with an all-h/h team. You need to read the last page or two in this thread more carefully.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

I haven't tried him yet in this 'buffed' state ...

Come back once you've defeated the "new and improved Ilsunder" in NM with an h/h team and explain how you did it. Then, I'll be interested in what you have to say.

Mangione · Nov 28, 2007, 03:54 PM // 15:54

I did it with Vodka's hero/hench setup in the other page of the thread.
Pyre and Gwen did a good interrupting and Cynn with MS occasionally knocked down that stupid boss.

My char is a wammo, the build i used had Protective Spirit and breath of the great dwarf. Used a normal axe build, with a zealous axe and gladiator armor.
Didn't take Vanguard Sin, my rank is too low for it to be useful, but took Pain Inverter with me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

OMG! They made a boss which requires some kind of shut down or defense. I shed a tear for the 99.9% of players who will fail now.

Lord Knows Fire Nukers Can Never Be Countered.

Has anyone tried running a whole party with elemental resistance and mantra of flame up? If my mental calculations are correct [...]

I haven't tried him yet in this 'buffed' state, but assuming[...]

Talking about players who fail... OMG!!!1 !! N00BZ0R5 C4NT 5HU7D0WN CAZ7ERZ 0MG!!!1!!!ONE!! U N00BZ0R5 F41L !!1!!! N0W 1 T34CH U W4T 1 H4V3N'T 3V3N TR13D... oh wait...

Is caster shutdown something you discovered just now? Thanks for sharing.

I wonder why did you post, since, apart from the arrogant tone, all you do is speculations and assumptions about something you didn't even try.

Instead of stating the obvious, that has already been tried and discussed in this thread (that you didn't care to read), why don't you go and try, and then tell what happened?
(Post screenshots and builds then, please, kthxbye)

Oh, and good luck with mantra of flame and elemental resistance on all party members of a hero/hench team.

Pfff... "know it all" kids...

tmr819 · Nov 28, 2007, 04:18 PM // 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mangione

I did it with Vodka's hero/hench setup in the other page of the thread.
Pyre and Gwen did a good interrupting and Cynn with MS occasionally knocked down that stupid boss.

Thanks for the helpful post, Mangione.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mangione

Instead of stating the obvious, that has already been tried and discussed in this thread (that you didn't care to read), why don't you go and try, and then tell what happened?
(Post screenshots and builds then, please, kthxbye)

Oh, and good luck with mantra of flame and elemental resistance on all party members of a hero/hench team.

Pfff... "know it all" kids...

And the laugh. Well said!

dustbunny · Nov 28, 2007, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

Has anyone tried running a whole party with elemental resistance and mantra of flame up?

Have you tried this? Let me save you some time and tell you that your mental calculation about how much damage this will reduce is irrelevant. Elemental resistance and mantra of flame are both stances. You can't have two stances up simultaneously.

dustbunny · Nov 28, 2007, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmr819

How did you do it (in NM)? I am reluctant to truck all the way back to Ilsunder only to discover that, once again, I did not have the right combination of skills, heroes, and henches. This dungeon is too long and, as you say, too tedious to get to the end and once again be facing an all-but-impossible end boss.

I made some changes to my skills and lineup:

Took a warrior with a sword that had an icy mod on it. Modified my necro (i normally run with a hexing/debuffer necro anyway) and put spinal shiver on his bar. Disabled it until I got to the boss. When I got to the boss, I enabled it and disabled his other skills. Picked up a winter spirit by changing someone's secondary to a ranger. The reason I did that was because I had elementalists.

At 15 hexing, a necro can keep spinal shiver up on the the boss if his energy lasts. Disable all his other skills so he doesn't go wasting energy of spells that won't matter. Keep signet of lost souls. The warrior can do some damage, but the icy mod really is there to interrupt any skill Ilsunder tries to use, including his firebombs. The elementalist spells, now that they are converted to cold, will also help interrupting. Once in a while, he can get a quick spell off since it has half cast time. Most of the time though, he can do squat.

tmr819 · Nov 28, 2007, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Thanks for the information, Dustbunny. It's a very creative combination of skills.

Lady Lozza · Nov 28, 2007, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Dustbunny, presumably your successful run was in the last couple of days? Like a lot of people here I'm loathed to trek all the way back to the dungeon only to be wiped 20+ times before deciding it isn't worth that much trouble.

I had contemplated a Glint like build to take him on and if it works I'm done and dusted.

I thinkk a lot of people here are missing the point. Having completed this dungeon two or three weeks back makes you lucky, rather than making the boss easy. The first run of this dungeon I had more trouble with the parts leading up to the boss, than the boss himself. And yes, right at the moment I do wish I had FRAPsed the thing because I think you would all be very suprised how little damage the boss does take. In theory he should have the health of a lvl29(?) right, well he doesn't. At lvl28 PI does a little under half a bar of dmg to a jotun using giant stomp - assuming all party members are hit and there are no minions. Currently it's doing less than a tenth of a bar per party wipe - that means he has easily regened it by the time you get back to him.

(PI did hit him. It was applied correctly, and at the right time. Yes I could tell because I was the one using it and seven lots of 80 dmg appeared on my screen.)

If the glint build works and he can be continually interrupted, it should be possible to kill him, but I'm guessing it would take around 10mins. The other thing to note is whether or not bosses in GWEN loose their hexes twices as fast as normal, a feature of the bosses in Prophecies I do believe. I think this is the case but to be honest I've not timed it myself. It might be that spinal shivers and it's repeat skill from factions might be needed to keep it up 100% of the time.

NOTE: my obrsavtions apply only to the NM boss, I've not tried in HM and cannot comment as to whether the buff has (or has not) affected the HM boss spawn in the same or a similar manner

Xylia · Nov 28, 2007, 11:26 PM // 23:26

I used a modified version of Sab's build to beat this dungeon in NM this morning:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...&postcount=219

One thing to note is that even though the boss regens health, he really doesn't heal that quickly. You should always rush back as soon as possible after a respawn. Also, he tends to renew enchantments, etc, after battle, so leaving him with SS on will help keep him from regenerating as quickly. Rising bile and putrid bile were useful in this manner, as well. Pain inverter doesn't last very long on a boss, so you really have to time it correctly to get the most out of it.

I did end up doing a couple of kamikazi runs with -60% DP, but it was pretty obvious that he was going to die within a run or two at that point. I didn't use any consumables during the run at all.

LordEzekiel · Nov 29, 2007, 01:34 AM // 01:34

I finally managed to complete this mission tonight, after 2 attempts with h/h and with exactly the same problems as other posters-despite me playing as BH ranger with extra int and pain inverter(R6)GDW(R8).First time I tried I didnt look at wiki at all and had no problem getting to Ilsundur with 10% boost so was naturally confident before the unexplained wipe. Second time I went prepared with the information I obtained from wiki (pain inverter=5 second kill lol) same situation before giving up after 30 mins of being unable to even wear him down to 50% health.The only reason I completed it was because I bit the bullet and went went with a PUG.

My team consisted of:
me(BH ranger,dist shot,pain inverter,GDW, winter,mantra of flame and icy bow),
Gwen(same build as Vodka had in previous post but with mantra of flame),
Zhed(SF build with mantra of flame and maelstrom)-idea being winter would convert the damage
Master of Whispers(SS build with spinal shivers and mantra of flame)
1 ursan tank warrior(with icy weapon for spinal shivers)
1 normal warrior(with icy weapon)
2 healer heroes (dunno skills, but one was LoD)

I will go out on a limb and say that it can't be easily done with h/h unless you accept consistent party wipe and gradually wear Ilsundur down, this is purely because you cannot micro-manage hench to avoid the fireballs or take the bombs way from the group, only heroes. The remaining heroes ('remaining' because after a few seconds the hench are dead)do not do enough damage to take him down much before inturrupts' wear off so it's a slog.
Maybe someone can prove me wrong, and amend wiki with a h/h build that will take this boss down, but for now-the dungeon is Normal it's the boss that's Hard-not impossible-but way too hard for NM.

dustbunny · Nov 29, 2007, 06:35 AM // 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

Dustbunny, presumably your successful run was in the last couple of days? Like a lot of people here I'm loathed to trek all the way back to the dungeon only to be wiped 20+ times before deciding it isn't worth that much trouble.

Well, now it's more than a week ago. It was on the beefed up Ilsunder, I assure you. I did that dungeon 4 times previously to complete 4 different characters through EtoN. I remember how wussified Ilsunder was. That's why I went with just one broadhead arrow ranger this last time in. I got my butt handed to me. So I had to redo it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

It might be that spinal shivers and it's repeat skill from factions might be needed to keep it up 100% of the time.

I only brought one copy. At high enough attribute, spinal shiver lasts at least twice as long as its recharge time. So 50% hex duration reduction from boss isn't the problem. You want to make sure the necro has enough energy so spinal shiver doesn't end from lack of energy. I suppose if you have two necros doing it with 2 energy pools, it will be safer. I got away with just using one though.

Ismoke · Nov 29, 2007, 09:28 PM // 21:28

ok we did it last night, not as hard as i remeber.. Went down quick... Definelty a dom mesmer and interupt ranger was the major change from my last attempt. Oh and ward againist harm helped alot not only with the boss but getting there also.

Thanks for all the insight guys.

Lady Lozza · Nov 29, 2007, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Thanks dustbunny, will give it a go when I get home from work.
I will probably sig of illusions on my mesmer and take spinal shivers myself - and maybe have it on the necro as well. I also plan on taking degen rather than anti-caster - I'll take Gwen as dom if I need/want to.

The Meth · Nov 30, 2007, 01:53 AM // 01:53

Just did him NM on my ranger, BHA build with 2 warrior hero running a D-slash build with flail and 1 paragon hero using burning refrain and keeping they're on fire up. Used lo sha, talon, and both monk henchmen. He got off no spells at all, the fire bomb got annoying though since it wasn't a spell, but hey you gotta work those hench monks. Getting to him through those damn traps was worse. The whole dungeon took about 40 mins, 13 for first lvl, 12 for 2nd, 15 for 3rd.

BTW i take back what I said about mantra of fire and elemental resistance (duh 2 stances lol)

tmr819 · Nov 30, 2007, 12:17 PM // 12:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

Just did him NM on my ranger, BHA build with 2 warrior hero running a D-slash build with flail and 1 paragon hero using burning refrain and keeping they're on fire up. Used lo sha, talon, and both monk henchmen.

Thanks for the post, Meth. I think I am working up the nerve for another try...

It seems like they adjusted the boss to require the kind of hero/hench build that doesn't help that much with the rest of the dungeon. No more "breezing" through Catacombs, I guess.

Alex Dimitri · Nov 30, 2007, 01:36 PM // 13:36

So it`s fixed ???
Gonna try again, last time i lost to many nerves on that guy, hope it`s not gonna be same song all over again !!!

The Meth · Nov 30, 2007, 03:43 PM // 15:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmr819

Thanks for the post, Meth. I think I am working up the nerve for another try...

It seems like they adjusted the boss to require the kind of hero/hench build that doesn't help that much with the rest of the dungeon. No more "breezing" through Catacombs, I guess.

The rest of the dungeon is just fine, the max number of eles/mesmers you can run into I've seen is 3. What I would do is shoot off a BHA on one enemy, call that enemy so the henchies would attack and interrupt it, while at the same time locking both my warrior heroes on another ele (the wars had savage slash). And then I would use my normal interrupts on the third. Shutdowns all 3 well enough, sometimes the hero's with savage slash let a spell or two get through but generally the group is pretty well spread out because of all my ordering things around.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Dimitri

So it`s fixed ???
Gonna try again, last time i lost to many nerves on that guy, hope it`s not gonna be same song all over again !!!

Depends on what you call fixed... He still has the higher health but I think it was broken before when he had almost no health and its fixed now. Just make sure to take proper counters, watch out for the moving balls of fire and making your heroes drop the fire bomb. If using a BHA ranger like I did, make absolutely sure you have 16 marksman and a +dazed bow. Since most bosses have 1/2 condition time without it you wont have nearly enough coverage. (AFAIK henchies are usually limited by not having any runes and no special equipment, so the interrupt hench is out)

Tried another really nice build this morning. My para + 3 Dslash heroes with me buffing them with great dwarf weapon. With pve skills in play it was a joke NM, the final boss was knocked down the whole time, and another +20 damage per hit ontop of a flailing d-slash build is insane.

tmr819 · Nov 30, 2007, 05:00 PM // 17:00

Meth--

By "D-slash" do you mean [skill]Dragon Slash[/skill]?

And what skills were your warriors using for knockdowns? I think I like that approach.

I haven't had great success with knockdowns and end-bosses, but maybe it's the skills I've been using...

The Meth · Nov 30, 2007, 05:35 PM // 17:35

Knockdown was provided by Great Dwarf Weapon. Essentially all 3 or 4 of my warriors had a 40% chance to knock down every hit while getting a +20 damage boost and with Flail they attacked once every .825 seconds. Just tested in isle of the nameless, Jora alone with a 15% enchanted Cold weapon along with conjure and Great Dwarf Weapon averaged about 100-110 damage per second.

My warriors were using this:
Dragon Slash, Standing Slash, Sun and Moon Slash, Savage Slash, Flail, Enraging Charge, "For Great Justice!", Resurrection Signet

If you can get an elemental weapon feel free to swap out the res signet for a conjure, make sure to keep enough strength to meet the 3 adren breakpoint for enraging

For my paragon I was using this:
"Go For The Eyes!", "Save Yourself!", Great Dwarf Weapon, Focused Anger, Burning Refrain, "They're on Fire!", "There's Nothing to Fear!", Signet of Return

Make sure to max Leadership, its a very energy intensive build to keep putting up great dwarf weapon on recharge along with the other energy shouts.

This is all benefiting from maxed title ranks, if you don't at least a high dwarf rank I would recommend taking a BHA ranger instead and making one warrior into a paragon. High allegiance or sunspear rank isn't needed but obviously helps.

Assuming you don't have high/max ranks my BHA build without any PvE skills would be this:
Broad Head Arrow, Distracting Shot, Savage Shot, Point Blank Shot, Needling Shot, Read The Wind, Throw Dirt, Resurrection Signet.

Like I said before, make sure to have 16 marksmanship and a +33% dazed bow. Make sure to use throw dirt on any melee's that start pummeling your back line. I would use 2 of the above warrior hero builds and then 1 of this paragon build:

"Go For The Eyes!", "Watch Yourself!", Song of Restoration, Ballad of Restoration, "They're on Fire!", Burning Refrain, Aggressive Refrain, Signet of Return

Which will provide ample party wide protection and healing vs the boss while adding some damage to the party. Feel free to toss in anthem of envy in place of signet of return if you feel like it.

migu · Dec 04, 2007, 02:18 AM // 02:18

ok, either they tuned down Ilsundur or i've become a pro on Catacombs of Kathandrax ^^
before tonight, i had tried this dungeon like 2 or 3 times, sometimes with 1 more human player, but unfortunately the outcome was always the same.. party wipe every single try...
as i've read The Meth's report, i decided to try it once more, and this time i went alone.
took a similar team, although my pace was a bit slower.. like 25 minutes per level, but managed to get to Ilsundur without much trouble.
when i got to him, just stayed out of the balls' way and with my Spinal Shivers and Broad Head Arrow from a hero, i managed to interrupt almost everything.
and i could swear tonight the H/H getting the bomb, actually stepped away so they would hurt anyone else.. maybe it was just a dream :P
so, after 3 hard tries with similar builds, this time it actually worked. sure, Ilsundur has a lot of HP, but my team just stood there for 2 or 3 minutes hitting the guy until he was dead, even having just the 2 henchmen monks, there was no deaths on my team.. so migu's team 1; Ilsundur 0 ^^