Curse

CBLProgrammer · Aug 29, 2009, 05:00 PM // 17:00

Hey everyone. I recently started playing GW again after a few years, and I am having a blast vanquishing Tyria. However, I am quite stuck on Ice Floe and wonder if anyone might have any suggestions.

I am a SS N/Me, and I am vanquishing using H/H only. This is the last Southern Shiverpeaks area I need to do (didn't have too much trouble with the rest, Lornar's being the only moderately difficult). I have been bringing Koss, Tahlkora, and Dunkoro as my heroes (monks are LoD, Koss is swordsmanship). The rest of my group is Devona, Little Thom, Cynn, Dunham, and Eve. I can blow through most of the Mursaat groups but those large groups of ice imps wipe me pretty quickly.

I have tried various tactics and always take Mantra of Frost. No matter what I do though, my healers get killed real fast if I don't interrupt a Maelstrom (even if I flag them back, the imps rush up to us while Koss acts like his head is cut off).

I have access to all of the Prophecy skills and have only done the first few missions in Factions and Nightfall (I have EotN but have not done any missions there yet).

Sorry for the long post but this area is killing me. I am willing to try any strategy that I can if it helps.

payne · Aug 29, 2009, 06:08 PM // 18:08

if you want to keep your same h/h setup < i'll try to accommodate it

best advice is use koss as a tank - he isn't effected by that pesky maelstrom! - just prot him up from either tahl or dunky (prot spirit / spirit bond / shield of absoption) < 2 of those or even all 3 depending how many you already have / how much your willing to alter your team setup

let koss tank the aggro - and wait for some of the imps to cluster up then rip into them with hexes...alternatively use koss as fodder and pick off individual imps...

alternatively - spell breaker monk hero? ^_^ kinda outside the box - but should own those imps and do a nice job of tanking caster mursaat groups haha...

trying to remember over a year ago when I did this....
me as BHA
has koss as quivering blade (pre nerf)
monk - WoH hybrid
nec - may have been MM - although SS is probable - with support skills either /mo with prot or /rt with channeling (splinter or warmongers) <<< regardless carrying hard rez when tanking failed or maelstrom hit and the AI was too spacky to get out of it haha

hench - not so important...2 monks + mes + whatever - some caster shiz will do - just MAKE SURE YOU FLAG THEM lol - useless sods :P

mantra of frost is a waste IMO - use koss as fodder tank = he has:
A) higher armor levels - 80 compared to squishies 60
B) not effected by maelstrom
C) can give him whatever bar you want as he can hold aggro regardless
D) leaves your secondary profession open < more build options!

hope something here helps (SB monk was a shot in the dark - but could be good for LOL's haha)

hope I've helped - and goodluck with it

AND PLEASE FOR MY SANITY DO NOT RUN ANY COOKIE-CUTTER BUILDS - YOU ARE IMO DOING VANQUISHES THE CORRECT WAY - NOT THE LAME WAY

- good luck my anti-cookie-cutter friend

REDdelver · Aug 29, 2009, 06:14 PM // 18:14

There are several different builds you can use, but i ran my own quick hero build i threw together.

My heros were 2 mesmers and a rit......then ele/necro/2 monks

1st mesmer with sharded burden/ sig of clumsiness/ conjure phantasm/ images of remorse / drain enchant/leech or pwr drain /mantra of lightning/ res sig
2nd mesmer tease/ power spike/ cry/ empathy/ shame/ guilt/ mantra of lightning/ death pact sig.

Rit SoS/ agony/ destruction/ ancestors rage/ prot was kaoli/ life/ mantra of lightning/ death pact sig

On the Tease mesmer I only run 7+1 on her in inspiration. Then 14/15 domination.

Now I'm sure whether you have all these skills or not. Maybe see if you can get close. No need to take mantra of frost, due to all the interrupts on the 2 mesmers. I felt mantra of lightning was a little more suitable for the mursaat ele's. Just disable mantra if you arent fighting the Mursaat....saves on a little energy.

To be honest I've been wanting to post these base bars as my hero/hench team. I've found these bars to work well together. The mantra is easily exchangeable.

payne · Aug 29, 2009, 06:14 PM // 18:14

new thoughts....

play through GW:EN and get pain inverter - will make short work of individual imps - stay /me and arcane echo it for 2 imps to be pwnt every time they use mind freeze ({e} there?)

turn the monks to WoH IMO - LoD has had the nerfstick on it and heal for 60 aen't brilliant if you are taking heavy damage - +200hp does when triggering WoH bonus heal

koss himself...just an idea for a build - but perhaps try....
w/rt

flail (str)
power attack (str)
dragon slash (sword)
"for great justice" (unlinked)
distracting strike (unlinked)
swordsmanship skill of choice
swordsmanship skill of choice (i like a combo of bleeding and deep wound personally for a bit of a faster kill - sever artery? + gash springs to mind)
death pact signet (resto)

DPS is for a hard-rez if something goes tits up and you need a rez
DON'T PUT REZS ON YOUR MONKS - WASTES SPACE

also 5 hench + 3 heroes + you = hax (check your original post

haha) - as this is a "hard" area - I wouldn't recommend war hench - they leeroy badly - cannot set them to guard - seem to be set to attack >.<)

2 monk + mes + ele / nec should be a better combo IMO!

superraptors · Aug 29, 2009, 06:16 PM // 18:16

livia n/rt weapon of remedy, vengeful weapon, pwk, life, soothing memories, signet of lost souls, flesh of my flesh or dps, mend body and soul or rip ench

olias n/rt xinraes weapon, vengeful weapon, pwk, rejuvenation, soothing memories, signet of lost souls, flesh, or dps or rez sig, mend body and soul or rip ench

me/rt vengeful weapon, soothing memories, tease, pwk, flesh or dps or rez sig, leech sig , power drain, some other random rupt to get those nasty maelstroms

that what i use to vanquish southern shivers\

or

multiple copies of me/rt with vengeful, xnrae, soothing, pwk, p drain, leech , mantra of frost, rez should rape shit with cynn , herta, alesia and the other dude

IronSheik · Aug 29, 2009, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Two rit heroes and spirit spam, beat NF and eotn and get them.

Monks+Eles are biggest problems in here, and they are piss hard to shutdown.

payne · Aug 29, 2009, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronSheik

Two rit heroes and spirit spam, beat NF and eotn and get them.

Monks+Eles are biggest problems in here, and they are piss hard to shutdown.

as of the original post - (s)he said that it was the imps that were the problem and that (s)he could deal with the mursaat enemies

spirit spammer might not work against the imps (hunch - not proven) due to maelstrom / mind freeze spamming - might iradicate the spirits too quickly for them to be totally effective - just a thought

although - yes...if the imps AoE doesn't kill the spirits this would make life easier - but how do spirit spammers fair against chain lightning? spamming ele mursaats though? - same thought as imps AoE - might cripple them before they do major damage....

i think it is best however to allow the OP to keep a fairly similar team-setup to the one they posted as it only requires some tactical changes to deal with the imps as it can already deal with the mursaat enemies....

but they said they are open to all ideas - so if their original setup doesn't work then spirit spam way or the dual nec / mes build could be worth investigating

regardless - if it gets done then thats all that matters...
just wish this was being asked in a weeks time when my war will have got to the stage of vanquishing S.Shiverpeaks - currently in Ascalon and progressing as I do the storyline (vanq as I go)

good luck - and remember - just enjoy the vanquish - don't find it a stress, otherwise playing the game is pointless haha - a game is fun; its not supposed to stress you out lol

CBLProgrammer · Aug 29, 2009, 06:53 PM // 18:53

Wow, thanks for all of the ideas.

I have been thinking I may need to go further into one of the expansions/EotN in order to do this. I have come close to completing it a couple of times, and I am pretty stubborn.

Haha, Payne, guess I did list 9

.

One of my main issues has been with the flagging I think. I try to flag them (one to each side) but 1 of 2 things has happened:

1. Koss runs out of range, and Dunkoro ignores my flag and runs up to heal him (should this happen?).
2. A few of the imps run right past Koss and hits someone with Maelstrom. If it happens to be a healer (Dunkoro especially for some reason), they pretty much let themselves die.

Occasionally, sending in Koss alone works, and he goes up there and slowly kills each one while everyone else hangs back.

I am not married to the idea of using Koss but I found I had much better luck on the Mursaat groups with 3 melee (Barbs ftw).

payne · Aug 29, 2009, 07:30 PM // 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBLProgrammer

Wow, thanks for all of the ideas.

I have been thinking I may need to go further into one of the expansions/EotN in order to do this. I have come close to completing it a couple of times, and I am pretty stubborn.

Haha, Payne, guess I did list 9

.

One of my main issues has been with the flagging I think. I try to flag them (one to each side) but 1 of 2 things has happened:

1. Koss runs out of range, and Dunkoro ignores my flag and runs up to heal him (should this happen?).
2. A few of the imps run right past Koss and hits someone with Maelstrom. If it happens to be a healer (Dunkoro especially for some reason), they pretty much let themselves die.

Occasionally, sending in Koss alone works, and he goes up there and slowly kills each one while everyone else hangs back.

I am not married to the idea of using Koss but I found I had much better luck on the Mursaat groups with 3 melee (Barbs ftw).

hero AI is broken - always has been - heroes leeroy from their flags...
you do not need to go into GW:EN to be able to do it....I did it before GW:EN was even released! so it is easily possible!

just practice...and if your monk heroes or h/h are in the maelstrom...just reflag them out of it - just requires minimal battlefield awareness

MagmaRed · Aug 29, 2009, 07:50 PM // 19:50

The hench, especially in Tyria are not the good at dealing damage. Alesia is a horrible Monk, but Lina isn't too bad, so I'd suggest dropping a Prot Monk hero and taking a Heal Monk hero and Lina. That will open up another hero slot for damage. With Devonna and Little Thom, I don't really see a need for another Warrior hero. Instead, I'd take an interrupt hero like Norgu, Gwen, Acolyte Jin, Margrid, or Pyre.

If melee hero/hench AI was better, I'd recommend changes to their bars, but even with changes they will have problems. If using Barbs and/or Mark of Pain for damage, minions do a wonderful job of filling that need for physical damage. When I use hero+hench to vanquish, I never use melee classes of any kind, and rarely have problems. My typical set up is me as damage (I smite if playing Monk), Healer Monk hero, MM hero, interrupt Mez hero, Prot Monk hench, Necro hench, Earth/Mez hench (depends on where you are), and Ranger hench.

The biggest problem isn't Maelstrom, as the damage from it won't kill your team. But Mind Freeze prevents anything inside a Maelstrom from getting out of it, and casting in a Maelstrom is nearly impossible. Either provide adequate hex removal so Mind Freeze can be removed fast and OFTEN, or provide the healers with several signets and micro them well.

CBLProgrammer · Aug 30, 2009, 07:11 PM // 19:11

UPDATE: After much grief and cursing, I finally vanquished this bad boy today. Thanks again for all of the suggestions.

I didn't do anything particularly fancy, and I did get rid of all melee as suggested (I normally don't take any but had been trying in this area). The difference maker appeared to be taking Zhed and a third healer. I set him up as fire and took Dunkoro, Tahlkora, and Lina. I also brought along Eve, Cynn, and Dunham. I don't even have an elite skill for Zhed as I have never used a fire mage before so I just set him up with some basic spells (any suggestions on a good fire elite in Propechies or early Nightfall?).

What was frustrating to me was the variability of this area. Sometimes that Mursaat Ele/Monk patrol was huge (12-18 or so). I couldn't handle that. Sometimes each group patrolled separately which really helped. In addition, I had times where the Mursaat groups in the big open area always would link (12+) but occasionally each group was separate. I happened to get a decent spawn on my last run although I had some huge imp groups to deal with.

In short, I am so relieved and am going to take a break this week before starting my last 2 areas, Crystal Desert and Maguuma (sitting at 40/54).

Yay!

REDdelver · Aug 30, 2009, 08:03 PM // 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBLProgrammer

UPDATE:
What was frustrating to me was the variability of this area. Sometimes that Mursaat Ele/Monk patrol was huge (12-18 or so). I couldn't handle that. Sometimes each group patrolled separately which really helped. In addition, I had times where the Mursaat groups in the big open area always would link (12+) but occasionally each group was separate. I happened to get a decent spawn on my last run although I had some huge imp groups to deal with.

Meh I forgot to give you a tip. My bad. But I'll post if it helps others.

If you leave Grotto to vanquish Ice Floe, head left and attack the first group of Mursaat. After killing, slowly(creep) your way towards where the large Mursaat patrol comes from. Hold control down....as soon as you see a group of Mursaat (that is tightly grouped and approaching you) appear as targets in the distance...turn and run the other direction a good distance. Wait for that group to come to you, then attack. Do this again, and you'll be able to break the large patrol up in 2-3 groups. Makes it a lot easier.

I did this 3 or 4 different times, and it always worked for me. Whether it works 100%, I cant say.

curiousanger · Sep 01, 2009, 12:05 PM // 12:05

It's cheap... but go get Technobabble... aoe daze > imps... If you don't want PVE skills try using 2x BHA R/Me with epidemic... either way, daze is the only way to VQ southern shiverpeaks imo.

payne · Sep 01, 2009, 03:49 PM // 15:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by curiousanger

It's cheap... but go get Technobabble... aoe daze > imps... If you don't want PVE skills try using 2x BHA R/Me with epidemic... either way, daze is the only way to VQ southern shiverpeaks imo.

ONE BHA ranger is enough for ALL southern shiverpeak areas....even lornars - easy zone with 6 people >.<

regardless you don't need PvE skills to vanquish any zone - they just speed it up!

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but well dont on completing the zone