Curse

Laraja · Oct 19, 2010, 04:51 PM // 16:51

Let me start out by saying that vanquishing normally isn't an issue for me.

I completed almost all of Cantha (have vanq title there) with heros and henchmen, and the only reason I had help in some areas is because guild/alliance mates wanted to join. I used my discord heros with me as SoS Rit and the entire continent was c+spacebar, control+spacebar. Pretty damned easy.

I've done about 15 areas in Tyria from Mineral Springs to Crystal Desert etc... with h+h and those have been fine, too.

However, NF is kicking my ass. I've never gone through so much DP removal in the 3 years I've been playing. I've never EVER had 60% dp... EVER. The areas that are giving me the most issues are those with elementals and roaring ethers. These are: Hidden City of Ahdashim, Garden of Seborhin and Mirror of Lyss.

If I take on a small group, I'm okay, but those largers groups in the Garden and Hidden city are sure party wipes. So Mesmers Norgu and Gwen with maybe an air or water ele? Knockdown hammer hero with mesmers? I can put Dissonance on my bar, energy management isn't an issue with me. Or....??

Any suggestions would be wonderful.

Milennin · Oct 19, 2010, 04:57 PM // 16:57

It's been ages ago since I did those, but can't remember them being much of a problem. I think I used something like Winter + Mantra of Frost on my Heroes to deal with the Elementals. Then Margrid as a Barrage+Volley Ranger with me equipping Great Dwarf Weapon on her for AoE knockdowns. I used a Dragon Slash + "Save Yourselves!" build.
Pre-prot (Protective Spirit) on some helped too. I also put some basic interrupts on my Heroes, like Leech Signet, which is also ok for Energy Management.

Lord Mip · Oct 19, 2010, 05:17 PM // 17:17

What I did against those Ether/Djinn Groups. I brought Pain Inverter to kill them off easily, and microd one of my heroes to use prot spirit on me. I then walk in first, so they expend their Energy Surges on me and don't damage the whole party (which is flagged back). Then the heroes/henchies come in and kill them.

I gotta agree though, they're kinda tough

rkubik · Oct 19, 2010, 05:27 PM // 17:27

When I did it my char was a warrior and I used a modified Sabway/Discord for almost all of Nightfall. In the areas with the undead I went for more of a triple holy damage with my monk heroes. The key is proper pulling and that goes for all campaigns. If you can't pull or watch the patrols you will get overwhelmed.

I recommend PI and some of the other Norn Shouts if you can as well as what was mentioned with the protective spirits. The Djinns are tough if you are not prepared. NF was easily the toughest campaign to Vanquish in my opinion. With being an SoS you shouldn't have as much problems with the areas you are talking about though. I would say more careful pulling. Once you start to VQ the desolation areas some of the above zones will seem easy

Good luck

AndrewSX · Oct 19, 2010, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Another skill you should bring against Ether is Frozen Soil, cause they usually rez the djinns that you manage to kill...very annoying.
Maybe (cause you'r rit) with Gaze of Gury to cancel it (in case you need rez) and Summon Spirits to place where need it.

P.S: VQed Mirror just a couple of days ago using it

BrettM · Oct 19, 2010, 05:51 PM // 17:51

If you're an ele, drop a Maelstrom bomb on them. That can help a lot. Don't take on the bigger groups until you have plenty of minions up, and position yourself so the minions get in there first. Throw in an EVAS, too, if you use that on your caller bar, since you can throw that in from outside of aggro range and it will get their attention long enough for minions to get in. Minions usually distract them enough so that you can mow them down with discord and never get touched. (Like taking on big windrider groups in EotN. Without minions = instant wipe. With minions = all fall down.)

Laraja · Oct 19, 2010, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Thanks for all the suggestions and based on these I'm going to try Margrid using barrage/volley + great dwarf weapon and equip her with winter and frozen soil. Maybe Vekk with a mesmer secondary, and use maelstrom and some interrupts, and Jora with Earthshaker. I could perhaps do Gwen with Panic. I'll experiment. Perhaps I'll go back and do Garden of Seborhin over again. I was pretty tired when I tried it and maybe feeling more awake and up for a challenge I'll do better. I was coming off a really bad vanquish of Forum Highlands with guildies with sub-optimal builds. =\ Should have just done it with my discord team.

Oddly, these areas are harder than the desolation in terms of really needing to plan your build. With the Desolation, it's just a long slog. You're in a wurm most of the time and that's just pure damage and little planning. Those cavaliers are driving me nuts. But technically, I'm finding the areas I mentioned more challenging.

Oh, and thanks for the Gaze of Fury idea with frozen soil. Dont' know why I didn't think of that.

tichi · Oct 19, 2010, 06:37 PM // 18:37

as leg vanquisher and leg master of the north i might be qualified to give you some advice there. i've done these areas a while ago as 600 ele and smiter atleast hidden city and mirror of lyss i don't recall garden being a very difficult area.
so my advice would be: as ritualist you can play either 600hp or 330 hp just remember to bring spell breaker on a hero. then flag heroes enchant urself grab a group and call heroes for nukes or w/e you are bringing. that should work for mirror and hidden city. only advice i can give you off the top of my head for garden is: bring a longbow, make urself space at start and pull small groups. maybe avoid MMs here if you are pulling since they can mess up aggro really badly

hope this helps

AndrewSX · Oct 19, 2010, 07:52 PM // 19:52

Quote:

Oh, and thanks for the Gaze of Fury idea with frozen soil. Dont' know why I didn't think of that.

Remember that when vanquishing the desolation....i used it and it's simply the best way to kill undead groups(plenty of ress..)....joko's domain and sulfurous wastes were quite simple with it

Warvic · Oct 19, 2010, 09:51 PM // 21:51

I completed all NF VQ'es without problems. Also the only campain i vanquished.

I mostly ran Dcord or Sabway. Henchies were mostly Herta, Devona, Healer and either Sogolon or Gehraz.

The last 14 areas i did (including Desolation) were done with Sabway coz i was tired of calling targets. (it's boring). So i decided to load a SY bar myself (wich is also boring!) for some variation in playstyle. And it was alot easyer. SY is pretty imba ya know ^^

Good luck!

I'm not sure how i can help you. you are not new to Vq'ing so...

I think there are like 2 hard areas in NF (in desolation). And you can use cons, frozen soil and summon stones to make that easyer.

Also don't forget to kill roaring eithers first, and make sure that the one that get's ressed will be killed right away. That way they have less resses left. Also use a longbow to pull smaller groups out of the big groups. But like i said, you alrdy Vq'ed Cantha, so i assume you aldy know basic things like this.

Luminarus · Oct 19, 2010, 11:43 PM // 23:43

Bring a psychic instability mesmer, and get them nicely balled up. If you do that they will all get knocked down and you can destroy em easily.

I did it myself ages ago, and flagged my heroes out so the aoe wasnt as devastating, PI'd one of the djinns and then pounded the ethers. The derv and para djinns arent that devastating and can be cleared after the rest are dead.

Jeydra · Oct 21, 2010, 01:11 AM // 01:11

Flag your heroes and henchmen apart before you aggro them. However much I hate Discordway, I must say there's no chance a well-managed Discordway team wipes to Djinn.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/p...t10447337.html, technique 4.

mage767 · Oct 21, 2010, 06:40 AM // 06:40

My suggestion: Stop using the dumb discordway build in areas of nightfall where there are little or no corpses. Areas in sulphurous waste, hidden city etc come to mind.

Use the ST rit, SoS Rit, offensive comm rit, and mesmer panic based builds. I don't know your profession, but if you are melee, bring splinter weapon on heroes. Don't be a pussy and flag heroes back. With the proper spirits up, you and your heroes can aggro entire ruthless mobs and annihilate them in seconds. You just gotta be aggressive. If you are a caster, bring dazed/condition based builds to decrease enemy effectiveness and wipe them out, albeit slower than melee based.

NF is the easiest of the three continents to vanquish, I know b/c I vqed everything thrice!

aspi · Oct 21, 2010, 08:26 AM // 08:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by mage767

My suggestion: Stop using the dumb discordway build in areas of nightfall where there are little or no corpses. Areas in sulphurous waste, hidden city etc come to mind.

Use the ST rit, SoS Rit, offensive comm rit, and mesmer panic based builds. I don't know your profession, but if you are melee, bring splinter weapon on heroes. Don't be a pussy and flag heroes back. With the proper spirits up, you and your heroes can aggro entire ruthless mobs and annihilate them in seconds. You just gotta be aggressive. If you are a caster, bring dazed/condition based builds to decrease enemy effectiveness and wipe them out, albeit slower than melee based.

NF is the easiest of the three continents to vanquish, I know b/c I vqed everything thrice!

Thanks for the tip, I vq-ed eotn and cantha and are finishing up on nightfall. The only left there are the 7? areas of the desolation. I'll make sure my discord stays home and bring some rits and gwen with me. Still not looking forward to the desolation because I hate being in those wurms.

Wielder Of Magic · Oct 21, 2010, 09:08 AM // 09:08

completed mirror of lyss and the garden with the usual sabway build ( keep in mind that I almost always play SY! scythe so perhaps that made the difference)

In adashim I threw sabway out all together, and went for 3 ER heroes, 1 healing, 2 prot.
Perhaps not the most effective or fastest way to do it, but it worked out for me.
and pain inverter REALLY helps in that area.
even when the eles prot everyone its usually an instant-kill.

BrettM · Oct 21, 2010, 11:24 AM // 11:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by mage767

My suggestion: Stop using the dumb discordway build in areas of nightfall where there are little or no corpses. Areas in sulphurous waste, hidden city etc come to mind.

You are aware that Discord is not a corpse exploitation skill and does the same amount of damage whether minions are present or not, right? And that Soul Reaping gains energy from the deaths of foes that do not leave exploitable corpses?

Jeydra · Oct 21, 2010, 11:30 AM // 11:30

Because Discordway does not rely on minions somehow (read: minion bomber, Soul Reaping's energy gain from minions dying) ...

Laraja · Oct 22, 2010, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Okay, I did complete Mirror of Lyss with discord. The only mob that gave me a real problem was the one with the roaring ether mesmer boss. They patrol in a circle through a narrow canyon area where, in a even narrower pinchpoint, I set up my spirits, flagged back my heros and henchmen and spread them out. It's hard to choose between the ethers and the ruby/immolated djinns since one burns the hell out of everyone and the other is interrupting.

I am not one of those people who must use discord everywhere. I use them where they are most efficient. Wiki is my friend and I read first about the area, look at the enemies I'll encounter and build accordingly. I vanqed most of the Crystal Desert with Jora as a knockdown/earth shaker hammer warrior, and Gwen and Norgu as Dom and Insp mesmers, me as a SoS rit with dissonance, rounding out were the two healer henchmen. It was a breeze. And factions (where I have a vanquisher title) was so easy, it was like NM as is many area of EotN and those I've done in Prophs are almost braindead. It is fun to have Wanted quests up. The white mantel and the peace keepers add a bit of difficulty that's nice.

I'm going to try Garden of Seborhin again this morning. Going to log in now. I think I see what I"m doing wrong... and no... I am not using discord there. I may see if a guildie would be willing to lend me three heros though and then I'll pop a Gaki summon stone. It's going to be nice when we can have a 7 hero team. In general, I prefer to play with other people, but in situations where I can't get a group, heroes are the next best thing.