Curse

ShadowKayoto · Nov 02, 2010, 05:25 PM // 17:25

Hello,
I made this thread to discuss the best possible build combination for my specific group (composed of me, my fiancée, and a friend) to clear Fissure of Woe. This thread will be pretty similar to this one that I made for Urgoz's Warren!. We're shooting for completing FoW tomorrow, if possible (since we're doing Urgoz's tonight!), and so I wanted to get this thread up as early as possible to start collecting feedback.

Background:

We've never done Fissure of Woe before.
We're all fairly skilled and coordinated players. We cleared The Deep on our first go, with no consumables, but we did use a walkthrough and a specific Heroway build on PvX wiki to do so.
I play an Elementalist, my fiancée plays a Necro, and our friend plays a Warrior.
We have a pretty wide selection of hero builds available, and don't mind picking up new skills (within reason - hours of hunting for elite skills isn't preferable). We have standard Spiritway, Sabway, Discordway, etc. heroes, and some other nice things like Panic/PI Mesmers and standard UA/Prot heroes available.
We're okay with using a full conset in FoW, since it's the last difficult area we need to clear for our 30 HoM points that we've planned out. However, we don't really want to try rushing through the whole thing in < 30 minutes or anything, either!

Me
E/A - I'll probably take an AP calling build of some sort (AP, YMLAD, Finish Him, EVAS, GoLE). Probably going to run Air (chain lightning/lightning orb/air attunement) for the last three skills, unless there's massive AoE needed in FoW (doesn't sound like it).

Hero 1: SoS Rit Channeling/Resto healer with Splinter Weapon
Hero 2: Panic Mesmer

My fiancée
N/any - SS with MoP/other necro debuffs/Necrosis/etc

Hero 1: N/Rt SoLS Healer with Icy Veins
Hero 2: SoGM Spiritway hero
Hero 3: AotL Prot Minion Bomber

The meat shield -- err.. my Warrior friend
W/any - Typical Hundred Blades setup (100b/S&M Slash/FGJ!/Flail/Enraging Charge/etc)

Unlike the other areas we've done, I haven't been able to really find any sort of recommended skills for FoW... I have no idea what sort of situations we'll run into, or what skills are useful to take! All I know thus far is that 100b Warrior, with the utilities of MoP, Splinter Weapon, and Ancestor's Rage, is a potent combination in there.

So then, my main issues for concern are:

Is a UA Monk hero a good choice for one of the healers? Should this be a standard UA+Prot build? Do they need to have condition AND hex removal on the bar?
Are minion masters useful at all in FoW? I'd like to run a typical prot-carrying minion bomber if so.
Is it worth it to bring a Signet of Ghostly Might hero (with Pain, Shadowsong, Disenchantment, Dissonance, Anguish)?
What about a Soul Twisting Communing hero with Displacement, Shelter, and Union?
I'm assuming you only need 2 bar pushers, tops, in a normal FoW run. What should the second healer be?
Are Panic (or Psychic Instability, or Ineptitude) Mesmers useful? I have all of those options available to me, and they prove pretty damn useful in other areas.
Is Edge of Extinction super useful in here? It sure sounds like it, from reading the tactics on the FoW Manlyspike page, but maybe that only pertains to speed clears?
Since consumables only last 30 minutes, and we'd prefer to only use one full set without rushing through, what part of the whole run would you recommend popping the conset at? I have no idea which quests in there are the hardest.
Just for my own personal curiosity, how hard is FoW these days? I know it used to be considered very difficult, but it seems opinions I've read vary greatly these days. From what I read, it sounds like in order of difficulty (very rough estimates, including full clears [so, including Mallyx, Dhuum, etc]): DoA > UW > FoW > The Deep = Urgoz's Warren. Is that a fair statement?

There's probably a few other things I'm forgetting, but that's the general list for now.

As always, I (and the rest of my team) greatly appreciate any assistance/advice at all!

trickfred · Nov 02, 2010, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Don't be in awe of the FoW. I did it for the first time a few weeks ago with my wife, and though it took us 5 hours (she needed a few breaks to get up and stretch, beverages, etc), it was relatively easy with careful pulling.

Read over the entries for the area and quests in both wikis so you know what you're getting in to, and just be careful not to aggro too many groups at once (as there are a lot, a LOT of patrols). If time is not an issue, I'd suggest clearing out whole areas before taking quests in/near them to be on the safe side, but this is unnecessary for a good group, even for the first time. A bonder might be good for the griffon ghosts, and flag any MM heroes way away from the Wailing Lord. Have everyone bring res scrolls, just in case.

That's about it.

Divine Ashes · Nov 02, 2010, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Well, see the thing about FoW is....it's not very difficult...especially on NM. I've easily cleared it a couple times with no consets and discordway (I had a friend take his heroes in and then leave at the start, so I even only had 7 players). If you have your warrior friend go MoP Hundred Blades with whirlwind attack thrown in there, you remain E/A AP caller and bring discordway heroes, and then have your fiance bring an SoS Rit and maybe an HB monk hero, you shouldn't have any problems. You could even remove a discordway hero in favor of a Jagged Bones MM. The only thing you really have to worry about in FoW is careful aggroing, and making sure the methods in which you do the quests are correct. For example, you don't want to attack the wailing lord in the forest, and you want to make sure the path between the wailing lord and the tower of courage is cleared before taking his quest. Rebirth on somebody can help just in case of a wipe.

Lukyboy · Nov 02, 2010, 06:46 PM // 18:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divine Ashes

Well, see the thing about FoW is....it's not very difficult...especially on NM. I've easily cleared it a couple times with no consets and discordway (I had a friend take his heroes in and then leave at the start, so I even only had 7 players). If you have your warrior friend go MoP Hundred Blades with whirlwind attack thrown in there, you remain E/A AP caller and bring discordway heroes, and then have your fiance bring an SoS Rit and maybe an HB monk hero, you shouldn't have any problems. You could even remove a discordway hero in favor of a Jagged Bones MM. The only thing you really have to worry about in FoW is careful aggroing, and making sure the methods in which you do the quests are correct. For example, you don't want to attack the wailing lord in the forest, and you want to make sure the path between the wailing lord and the tower of courage is cleared before taking his quest. Rebirth on somebody can help just in case of a wipe.

This.

Also. You may want to read up on all the quests down there. Especially Gift of Griffons.

If an NPC in FoW dies, you'll fail. That's where it usually goes wrong. Careful pulling, no rushing and you'll be fine

EDIT: Since the walkthrough on the wiki isn't very good imo, I thought I should warn you about Gift of Griffons.

A Gift of griffons is the quest given by the wailing lord. As soon as you take, 3 NPC's spawn nearby. They will follow anyone who moves, which is annoying. If 1 of them dies, your party gets booted out of FoW. The objective of the quest is to bring them to Rastigan (the first NPC you encountered in FoW). When you take the quest several groups of enemies will spawn on the way to Rastigan.
The easiest and safest way to do (imo) is to split up. 1 of you (without heroes) stays next to the wailing lord. do not take the quest yet. The rest of you move out of the forest. Once you're all out of radar range (greyed out names) the one who stayed behind takes the quest and just sits there with the griffons. The rest of you clear the entire route to rastigan. Once it's clear, the "babysitter" can start walking to rastigan.

All the other quests are pretty straight forward. You may have to backtrack a bit sometimes.

DeanBB · Nov 02, 2010, 06:52 PM // 18:52

My advice is the same: take it slow. Since you're unfamiliar, clear before you take quests. I think the trickiest quest is the griffon one, so read up on it, clear ahead, and do it first so if it fails you haven't wasted 4 hours and no chest. If even 1 griffon dies, game over. There's a trick to getting it to stay with 1 person while the rest go clear out the newly spawned mobs, so read up and do it that way. For that reason, I'd suggest that one of you goes without heroes (warrior?) and let the other 2 take them.

ShadowKayoto · Nov 02, 2010, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Thanks for all the advice, guys!

It sounds like it doesn't really matter what team build we take (as long as it's fairly balanced), but all the difficulty comes from careful pulling and knowing what the quests entail.

For the Gift of Griffons quest, can you clear out every single enemy between the Wailing Lord and Rastigan before taking the quest? Or do extra enemies spawn as soon as you take the quest?

If it's the latter, then we'll do the 'babysitting' trick. We'll definitely do that quest first, at any rate!

Any other sections we should be particularly wary of?

Eragon Zarroc · Nov 02, 2010, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowKayoto

For the Gift of Griffons quest, can you clear out every single enemy between the Wailing Lord and Rastigan before taking the quest? Or do extra enemies spawn as soon as you take the quest?

If it's the latter, then we'll do the 'babysitting' trick. We'll definitely do that quest first, at any rate!

When you take the quest, it will spawn mobs of 5-6 enemies spaced out from the forest entrance all the way to the tower where you need to take them. Some of them can be walked around because they are pretty static, but some you must kill. Best way to do this quest is to leave one person behind at the wailing lord (whoever didn't bring heroes), have everyone else run to the entrance of the forest out of range, and then take the quest. The group of 7 can kill all of the mobs between the forest and the tower while the person who took the quest just stands there keeping the griffons safe. after you have killed all the mobs on ur way to the tower, the person with the griffs can just take em to the tower enemy free.

Also be sure not to let the forgemaster die when defending the forge ;-)

Kronk_Shaan · Nov 02, 2010, 07:50 PM // 19:50

You can clear the way, but once you take the quest a few more groups spawn. Just don't get in the griffons aggro bubble and you can re-clear the path and then have one person go back and get them.

Not really a hard run, my wife and I did it recently and it went pretty smooth. I would suggest reading the wiki, it can help answer some questions as well.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Fow

Most groups in the past I had been in (pre-factions) had trouble in the beginning. Just clear everything away from the ghostly hero up to the first tower, and don't fight near him (he dies - you leave).

I still like taking an MM (golem or jagged bones), Panic mes (or even power block) can't hurt, or even a rit hero (which is my wife's favorite). My wife played an ele (random skills with Savannah Heat) and I was monk (brought Life Barrier, mostly as a flashback to the old times, although never had it up much). Pain inverter is hilarious against some targets (skeletons - cyclone axe - poof). Skele's are the only things that can get annoying, although there are a lot of hydra in the one section. Just have fun and take your time. And the HoM statue looks ok as well.

Good hunting.

Bloss · Nov 02, 2010, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowKayoto

So then, my main issues for concern are:

Is a UA Monk hero a good choice for one of the healers? Should this be a standard UA+Prot build? Do they need to have condition AND hex removal on the bar?
if you don't take hexremoval your war will be really sad. Emphaty and spitefull spirit, please do take hexremoval
Are minion masters useful at all in FoW? I'd like to run a typical prot-carrying minion bomber if so.
They work quite well
Is it worth it to bring a Signet of Ghostly Might hero (with Pain, Shadowsong, Disenchantment, Dissonance, Anguish)?
from my exprience mobs die extremely fast, and since it's a hero they aren't very mobile, I wouldn't take it (did take it on my rt but with soul twisting and spirit spam, and me as SoS
What about a Soul Twisting Communing hero with Displacement, Shelter, and Union?
nm 2 healers and your minion master (if you take it) should be enough defense
I'm assuming you only need 2 bar pushers, tops, in a normal FoW run. What should the second healer be?
anything really, but as before, your war will love hexremoval
Are Panic (or Psychic Instability, or Ineptitude) Mesmers useful? I have all of those options available to me, and they prove pretty damn useful in other areas.
never used it on other chars than my own mesmer, with my mesmer I'm not sure if I love it, but alot of melee and WoH monks, mesmer should have a place depending on your DPS. Note that panic can counter Spitefull Spirit (rupts attacks too) to some degree
Is Edge of Extinction super useful in here? It sure sounds like it, from reading the tactics on the FoW Manlyspike page, but maybe that only pertains to speed clears?
the balling a FoWSC does is likely not something you will simply achieve with a normal group, wouldn't dedicate a bar to it, but might have it usefulness
Since consumables only last 30 minutes, and we'd prefer to only use one full set without rushing through, what part of the whole run would you recommend popping the conset at? I have no idea which quests in there are the hardest.
in NM nowhere for sure, in hardmode I still find it overrated, but I guess the burning forest (will still last when you get to the wailing lord)
Just for my own personal curiosity, how hard is FoW these days? I know it used to be considered very difficult, but it seems opinions I've read vary greatly these days. From what I read, it sounds like in order of difficulty (very rough estimates, including full clears [so, including Mallyx, Dhuum, etc]): DoA > UW > FoW > The Deep = Urgoz's Warren. Is that a fair statement?
FoW is quite easy, not sure if deep or urgoz are easier.

Maybe you want to read in which order someone does it, so wrote that down too. If you're not bothered, goodluck and have alot of fun.

likely a bit late. But as alot of people said, FoW is really easy, especially on nm, I've done it too much (easy xp for survivor) so might be able to help a bit.
I always do the quests in this order:

1. tower of courage, simply kill stuff and keep the quest-dude alive (take the wailing lord quest after)
2. Army of Darkness, kill Menzies, be carefull to not pull to many, return the item
3. the eternal forge master (just clear the tower?)
4. defend the temple of war, we usually wait for them to come up, but you can lure, split 4/4 or rush and be fast
Then we take every quest we find, tower of strenght, restore the temple and kohbay the betrayer.
our order:
5. restore the temple (don't forget the shard wolf quest, the hunter is outside the entrance of the cave, 1 shard wolf is on the beach at the other side of the cave, other places just wiki them, do them along your run.) Once again just kill everything
6. kohbay the betrayer (just kill everything)
7. Then we usually move on to the burning forest, (north-east) take the quest slaves of menzie from miko the unchained (clearing a big part of the forest before is saver, in nm I don't even bother doing that with survivors.) Spreading out helps for hydras if you don't have rupts or bit of prot.
8. Tower of strenght, in 3+ man groups we usually send 1 back to get the one who opens the door in the Forge, while the others clear the place, if you preffer just kill everything together and then go to the forge, get the dude etc.
9. we move to the wailing lord (finally) kill everything but him. used 2 tactieks here, either leave one back (since you have 3 people one could if he/she has no heroes) or walk back afterwards, it takes longer, but it's one of your last quests, really wanna risk getting kicked out, no. But someone was clear about this a few posts above.

Usually we have all wolfs dead already, otherwise hunt and kill them, get your reward and your statue. Btw this order is not perfect, but I found it nice.

Ps: imo about every build can work, just use what heroes use well and w/e you like. I liked fall back since sometimes you have to walk loads.

if you care: with war I went with another war, we simply used RoJ smites (judge insight/SoH) and WoH healers (not the best, we were lazy to change builds) Rt I went along with a mes, only heroes we always took were Soul twisting commoning spirit spamming hero, me SoS and spirit healers (necro or rt with tease) Others I don't remember sorry, but they aren't the most thought-off groups anyways.

raoule · Nov 08, 2010, 03:44 AM // 03:44

The foes encountered in the FOW (wich is not an elite area) offer what can appear to be some pressure and spike/snares builds to the new comers. The devs did put an emphasis on positioning in this particular instance where 90% of the phys damages can be nulified just by using lines of sight and terrain control.

Exemples of things that work there (we are talking about completing all the quests):

For more informations you can catch me here:
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/User:Serge_Yseron

LifeInfusion · Nov 08, 2010, 04:16 AM // 04:16

FoW is not that hard in Normal Mode, or even Hard Mode (with proper builds). That's why you have solo builds for it. The only difficult part is making sure you don't aggro too much and don't take the Gift of Griffons quest til you cleared the path.

1. You want hex removal for spiteful spirit. If you aren't using physicals this isn't a big deal.
2. MMs work, but things like Shadow beasts don't have bodies. I remember having a MM down there with about 50 minions before they capped the minions at 10.
3. SoGM hero would work
4. ST rit would work also, in place of an imbagon/ protter
5. bring one party healer with a spot heal (i.e. UA), you don't need a 2nd monk if you slap Mend Body & Soul and Spirit Light on your SoS rit. There's Fireball, Maelstrom, Spiteful Spirit, Lightning Touch and other AoEs.
6. Panic is useful because there are many large mobs
7. Edge of Extinction works well
8. don't really need cons
9. FoW has always been easier than DoA since you can run balanced builds

raoule · Nov 08, 2010, 04:45 AM // 04:45

Solo end chest for the win. Yseron

ShadowKayoto · Nov 09, 2010, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Just an update:

We cleared FoW pretty easily, in about 2 hours or so! It was pretty fun, not too difficult, and the area looked awesome.

Too bad we didn't get anything good out of the end chest. Oh well!

Our group also managed to almost do a full clear of Underworld with the exact same hero set-up that I have posted at the beginning of this thread, which was exciting!

It's too bad Dhuum wiped the floor with us, hard. Haha.

But no matter! My friends and I all have our 30 HoM points, and I just wanted to give a big thanks to everyone who contributed advice, both in this thread and the one for Urgoz's Warren!

You guys rock!