Curse

TheOneMephisto · Jul 01, 2006, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

Heh I've talked to the creator of that DW build, and he said he was ashamed later

Lol, well, it's not that bad for a premade...

swordfisher · Jul 01, 2006, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Two sentences that can really help your chances of winning a few in a row:

Call Targets. Stay Together.

The really embarrassing losses are the ones where your entire team is scattered around the map, each chasing a different target. There's nothing more irritating than having teammates die on your watch simply because they were too far away for you to help them. Which leads me to the next point:

Even a fully offensive character can play defensively.

You can use a warrior to take down the enemy monk, but sometimes you've got to use him to save your own- spike that mesmer, bulls the Warrior that's chasing your teammate, interrupt the next Spiteful Spirit. It's more than just a game of 'target the monk,' so give some thought to who you really need to put down (and who you have the ability to kill- if you're swinging an axe, let someone else handle the bonetti's monk).

kvndoom · Jul 03, 2006, 04:48 AM // 04:48

I've got 22 gladiator points so far, and so close to my first PVP title I can taste it, so here's a little advice:

1) There's a certain guild that sends its farming bots (always Mo/W, always 55 health, they always leave after a minute or 2) into RA to keep off Anet's "repetitive botlike behavior" radar. You'll know who it is soon enough if you keep playing. When you have one on your team, tell the other guys why you're going to leave, then leave. Unless your opponents really really suck, or your team looks really strong and you have a good chance of winning 3 vs 4, you're just wasting your time going any further.

2) Learn to prioritize targets. Sadly, too many people focus on "kill the monk" and get obliterated because the OTHER 3 people on the team kick their asses while they're chasing the monk around. Yes, the monk heals, but the monk seldom kills you. Against a weak team, sure kill the monk, but know for sure that you can focus all your hate on one person without getting slaughtered. Sometimes you have to go after the person on the other team who is doing you the most damage, and not the healer. Here are 2 good examples from my experiences yesterday:

- I was on a 3 melee, 1 monk team. We get to fighting, I'm imediately blinded and weakened. Crap, blindbot! I think, and switch targets to the elementalist. I keep pinging, but the other warrior and the assassin keep stupidly chasing the monk while getting pummeled, even though they're both blind. We have ZERO offense at this point (unless our monk was going to wand the other team to death). Finally I stop what I'm doing, open the chat window and type "KILL THE [GOREDENGINEGO] BLINDBOT" to get them out of their mindless stupor. The ele can't survive being triple teamed, and the monk can't outheal our damage, so the ele goes down and we eventually win.

- A later team I was on was myself, a Monk, a Mesmer, and a Necro (I was the only melee, thank the fates). The other team had a Ritualist using Wanderlust along with a lot of defensive spirits. So instead of chasing their monk, I stayed on the Rit, applying knockdowns as fast as I could to keep him from putting down spirits. Eventually the mesmer and necro wore down their monk, and we finished them off quickly after that.

3) When facing 2 monk teams, split the pressure on the monks. I've beaten 2 monks before without even having a monk on my own team. Generally if you get 2 monks on a team in RA, the odds of them both being good is slim. Sooner or later one of them will break under pressure, which is why you have to pressure them both simultaneously. This involves typing in team chat, but the few seconds you take to type "split pressure on monks" can sometimes save your ass.

4) PATIENCE WINS GAMES. I can't count how many times I've lost because some fool Warrior or Assassin or touch Ranger can't keep the ants in his pants and just HAS to run off to kill something. Time after time, they will charge right into traps and spirits and hexes and die in less than 5 seconds after entering enemy aggro range. Literally, less than 5 seconds from full health to dead. Sometimes telling them to stop works, sometimes it doesn't. You have to be able to evaluate the other team in those first crucial seconds of the match and determine if you can afford to rush in and attack. If you're facing a trapper AND a Rit, odds are good that rushing is suicide. When you get really lucky and face 3 or 4 melee guys, just stand your ground, no matter how long it takes. One of them will break; it never fails. One of them will get antsy and run right into the middle of your team, and sacrifice his life pointlessly.

5) If you're a melee toon, Wild Blow owns all. Screw touch rangers. I killed one yesterday that literally had Lightning Reflexes, Dodge, Whirling Defense AND Escape on his skillbar (bet he didn't have rez, but we'll never know). Killed his ass dead, like Raid on roaches. Bring Wild Blow, but only use it when necessary. You lose all adrenaline, so what? Your enemy loses his evasive stance, which means your teamates can kill him instead of missing 75% of the time. You tell me which is more important. I love it when a warrior throws up Gladiator's Defense. Right before I strike him down I think to myself "you just wasted 30 seconds of your life, buddy."

6) Don't be scared to step up and take the lead. If you're playing to win, and most people are except for the bots, don't hesitate to bark orders and get your guys in line. But only if you're 100% sure of yourself. If you know that killing the necro is more important strategically than killing the monk, say so. Yell at that stupid assassin to keep his ass with the team! Ask the warrior why he has a healing ankh instead of a shield! Sometimes a little leadership can make a mediocre team into a dominating one. Don't be scared to voice the truth.

7) Turn off local chat. Nothing is more distracting in PVP than the egotistical idiot. Sometimes after I'm done playing I'll turn it on and read what people said during matches, and just roll my eyes or laugh. But keep it off.

There you have it. Good luck, and welcome to the cesspool of PVP.

around · Jul 03, 2006, 12:02 PM // 12:02

Another tip: warriors are the easiest profession to play, and the ones you will get the most kills on. They will generally be the ones who are easier to play, since all you have to do is run around and hit stuff, and you are stuck into the action right away.

LightningHell · Jul 03, 2006, 01:14 PM // 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by spawnofebil

Another tip: warriors are the easiest profession to play, and the ones you will get the most kills on. They will generally be the ones who are easier to play, since all you have to do is run around and hit stuff, and you are stuck into the action right away.

Playing a crap Warrior is hell easy. Playing a good one is far harder.

Aug · Jul 03, 2006, 02:36 PM // 14:36

Definitely play a character that can heal others if you want to string wins together. Boon/Prots work well. I've also had a lot of success with a E/Mo Blind/Healer. Whatever you do, don't bring Mending, Vigorous Spirit, Gladiator's Defense, etc into RA as a Warrior. At the very least, if you bring Mending, give it to the squishies and not yourself.

TheOneMephisto · Jul 03, 2006, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Playing a crap Warrior is hell easy. Playing a good one is far harder.

QFT

In RA everyone and their grandmother either play antiwar or war basically, which makes it kind of harder on you when you are the only melee coming up against 4 antiwar mesmers/necros/blindbots/cripshots.

around · Jul 03, 2006, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Playing a crap Warrior is hell easy. Playing a good one is far harder.

Isn't that true for all professions though? I suggested warrior because all you need to do is get 16 weapon, swing around to build up adren and then unleash hell on an unsuspecting monk/caster/anyone while under frenzy. Hell, even I could play a warrior and get decent rounds with it, even though I've never played one before.

TheOneMephisto · Jul 03, 2006, 08:27 PM // 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by spawnofebil

Isn't that true for all professions though? I suggested warrior because all you need to do is get 16 weapon, swing around to build up adren and then unleash hell on an unsuspecting monk/caster/anyone while under frenzy. Hell, even I could play a warrior and get decent rounds with it, even though I've never played one before.

One problem is that most new warriors don't know about target switching and the like. They just think that their job is to bash the monks head in. Also, when playing warrior you have to be able to tell when certain enchantments and such are on your target, so you know when to switch. To tell all of this, you have to know all the enchantment animations and stuff, which takes a fair amount of experience. You also have to know which targets to spike.

Then you also have to learn how to recognize and deal with the multitudes of hexes and conditions that hate warriors. Especially in RA, warrior hate is everywhere, and without good removal you can have some problems.

Winstar · Jul 03, 2006, 10:55 PM // 22:55

Dear God, there is nothing more depressing in RA as a warrior then seeing the other teams consists of nec/mes's mes/nec's and so on. I kind of sigh, and sheepishly head into battle knowing in that in mere moments I will be attacking 50% slower, taking damage everytime i do so, missing with most of them, moving slower, and degening for a bajillion.

wsmcasey · Jul 10, 2006, 04:07 PM // 16:07

I do okay with Boon/Prot monk in RA. I sucked at first because I wasn't use to getting so much pressure all at once, but you get use it after a while. RA is actually pretty easy as a boon/prot once you've moved on to TA and HOH. However, The easiest for me in RA is my ranger (not a touch ranger). I find that my ranger is usually not top priority for the other team and they leave me alone most of the time, thats usually because of the "kill the monk" mentality of most players in RA. If I have a monk on my team in RA then its almost guaranteed that I will not be the first one targeted.

Nadine · Jul 12, 2006, 10:07 AM // 10:07

One thing, if u really are good warriors, why dont u play in top 20 guilds? To be a REALLY GOOD warrior is hard, harder than be good monk.

But something which rocks in RA is e-denail mesmer. Just take enchant removals, spirit of failure, distortion. And then surge+burn+mind wrack
u can kill frenzying warrior in less then 3 seconds. Infinity energy becouse none/very rare team have hex removals (cover spirit with mind wrack). Then burn their monk if they have, if they dont, burn their mesmers/necros. Then your warriors may do the job. And Shatter Enchant is my favorite for frenzying paladin

I play pretty often as monk in RA, it gives good practice to face chaotic situations in gvg (err7 on another monk, some sick splits that we are playing like 2v6 or smthg else.) But as in RA and these situations in gvg's, u will be target nro1, so just kite kite kite kite kite kite kite kite kite and maybe heal yourself if u are having massive degen.

Degen is pretty good weapon in ra. Opponent most propably doesnt have monk, so enemy warriors get busy with healing signet if u give them -10 degen. (more degen is better like -16 if they will use mending etc).

If u really wanna play as warrior in RA use hammer or shock+axe. U really need KD's becouse u need to kill one monk yourself (dont rely on your party members ever xD )

Celab · Jul 12, 2006, 03:14 PM // 15:14

whats great fun is making a healing ball monk in RA and end up facing 4 warriors with monk hate.

In RA its usually good to be a support caster (monk/rt) as that way you know you can assist your team and let them do their stupid things.

Earlier i was on the earthbind Rit premade, no alterations, apart form sup vigour, and people just go after the spirits, only to be killed by people on our team.

Van Goghs Ear · Jul 12, 2006, 04:05 PM // 16:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by spawnofebil

Another tip: warriors are the easiest profession to play, and the ones you will get the most kills on. They will generally be the ones who are easier to play, since all you have to do is run around and hit stuff, and you are stuck into the action right away.

you must play with a lot of scrub warriors, or have never experienced high level competition. Perhaps it's time to move beyond the confines of RA, because the difference between good and bad warriors is no different from good and bad monks, and being a cunning warrior requires a major use of tactics and awareness of the state of the other team as well as yours, as well as your positioning, etc.

Thom · Jul 12, 2006, 08:20 PM // 20:20

I normally play RA when I'm rather bored. The last few times I wen in with a monk I normally doubled up with a second monk, which seems like an incredible waste of time. Entered 5 or 6 times and I was the only monk once.

Blood Orgy, you may be Random Area king, but telling us how good your advise is without actually providing us with some of your insight is kind of silly. If you've been playing a N/Me enough to win at least 1120 matches playing a single build, you are a title farmer not a pvp player in my book. Anyone with enough time can find a good build and farm it.

Blood Orgy · Jul 12, 2006, 09:04 PM // 21:04

Actually I tally my record and I win about 80% of the time in the random arenas. It's not a matter of time it's a matter of skill. Anyway I deleted my previous post because I was busy working and couldn't finish it so here it is.

I have won 112 glad points and 625k faction in the randoms playing a N/Me. Excluding monk builds, I think mine is probably the best for the random arenas. Too bad I'm not going to share it with you.

I would agree with most of the previous posters on what works in the randoms and would lay special emphasis on 4 points. I think random arenas players are most variable in skill level across these four. Master them and you will have a gigantic edge over your opponents.

Number one is bring a res signet and almost always res as soon as someone dies. THis is the number one thing that people in the random arenas can improve upon. It's one reason why the w'mo players suck so bad since most of them don't bring res. It's simple, but people often overlook it in the midst of fighting.

number two is focus fire. I usually call targets but I find that the majority of the time my team simply ignores me. If that happens then i just figure out who they're attacking and assist.

Number three is to know what order you should kill your enemy. Some builds need to die first, others you can ignore till the end. Monks should virtually always come first, mesmers next usually. w'mos come at the end, as do blood necros and some other warrior and ranger builds. This is another major area groups could improve on. Too often I see my group's warrior just charge and fight the first guy he meets on the other team, even though that team has a monk.

Number four is to learn when and how to run when you need to. Learning how to position yourself in the geography of the fight is a crucial area I see lacking in random arenas groups. Unfortunately it takes a degree of intelligence to learn all of these things that most poeple in the random arenas lack. Each build will have different tactics to win. For example, I can beat most classes one v one. If i can get someone to chase me so we are both separated from our respective groups, I will be able to kill that person in such a way that their group will have to travel a long way to res them. With my build, if a ritualist is just starting to cast his spirits and I'm within range I can usually kill him before he has cast his second or maybe just after. So, I will spike the ritualist and directmy group to focus on him as well early on if he's made the mistake of waiting too late to cast spirits. This is just one example of tactics in the random arenas. As I said before, how well you do is often dependent on how smart you are, how well you can improvise and maximize your chances with what your team has and what the other team has. And learn what works for next time. That's why I prefer randoms over tighter, more structured pvp.

Thom · Jul 13, 2006, 02:06 AM // 02:06

Well Blood, I guess your advice goes to show that you can't ignore the basics. Rezing, focus fire, target choice and position are pretty much the basics of pvp tactics.

Of course there are exceptions, focus fire can backfire against a good monk. Target choice is a bit more nuanced than killing the monk, but class generalizations can be helpful. A good self-preservation monk who knows proper hex-removal/kiting sould be by-passed. An over extended warrior casting cheesy-hands should be quickly killed if you have proper removal. I've run builds where I intentially engage the warrior because I know I can drop him faster than a kiting monk; no not a touch ranger.

If you have a really great build and some basic tactical knowledge random arenas can be an adventure. Good GvG or TA allows you to use much of the same skill against stronger competition. While TA and GvG don't let you overcome weak links the way RA does, it still rewards a solo player with exceptional ability. The vast desert of individual talent is HA, IMO. The best PvP teams come to know each others tendencies to the point where you know what the man next to you is thinking. Having that assurance allows individuals more freedom, not less, and this is totally lacking in RA.

Ole Man Bourbon · Jul 13, 2006, 03:50 PM // 15:50

I think if everyone brings a utility skill or two, your team will be much better. Weakness/Blind, Enchant Removal, Hex Removal, Snares, an extra team heal like Heal Other or Well of Blood, Wards, etc, really help a lot when it comes to trying to put together streaks. Often times teams do well in the arenas because of a basic skill chain they run. If you can screw it up for them, they will flop, typically. Also, being able to help your monk a little can save you from losing that one game when he's shut down by the odd mez-ranger dominant team.

JiggyFly · Jul 13, 2006, 08:19 PM // 20:19

I know its' been said, but just really note that there is a signifigant degree of "luck" no matter what your build. I mean I've run a anti-melee Mesmer for good knows how long, which is perfectly capable of locking down those types of characters. And to-date I've had dozens of matches where not a single melee character was present on the opposing team, did my build flop in most of those matches? yep.

No matter what your build, you just have to cross your fingers that if you have enchantment removal someone else brought a snare, if you brought degen, someone else brought straight damage, and so on...

Boofhead · Jul 13, 2006, 09:21 PM // 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Van Goghs Ear

you must play with a lot of scrub warriors, or have never experienced high level competition. Perhaps it's time to move beyond the confines of RA, because the difference between good and bad warriors is no different from good and bad monks, and being a cunning warrior requires a major use of tactics and awareness of the state of the other team as well as yours, as well as your positioning, etc.

If you're a bad monk, people die. If you're a bad warrior, nobody gets killed (unless you like to frenzy heal sig).