Curse

sir lockt · Sep 15, 2006, 07:11 AM // 07:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

From what I hear from my guildie, solo Assassins are going to have a bit of a tough time getting through the Knights. I don't have Factions myself so I don't know about how hard is it.

Our solo sin sliced through them 2 minutes faster then he did when dealing with 2 bodyguards and the rangers. Just take an interupt for the heal sig and the knights are quite worthless

VoD is quite quick indeed... although you dont like it at first glance, it prevents the difference between rank farmers and VoD teams a lot. so it might prove a positive change for the ladder... but we will have to see first...

JR · Sep 15, 2006, 08:12 AM // 08:12

I have yet to see a negative impact from the change, aside from it seeming a little rushed. However, whether this is just a matter of getting used to it or not, I don't know.

As for solo ganking Knights; easy on an Assassin. Shock the first Healing Signet, D-Stab the second. Harder on a Warrior because of their Healing Signet spam and Sever; If you had D-Chop it would be made a lot easier. Apparently it's very easy with a Cripshot, which I can understand.

Dragannia · Sep 15, 2006, 08:18 AM // 08:18

Knights are obscenely weak. Assassins will cleave through them, and hell, even Shock Warriors can do well.

LightningHell · Sep 15, 2006, 09:06 AM // 09:06

Ah, thanks, I'll go tell my Sin friend. I can understand it's extremely easy with a Cripshot.

I'm not too sure about the 20-min VoD, I guess I'll have to wait till a GvG to see. How has everybody else fared with it?

Patrograd · Sep 15, 2006, 09:32 AM // 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

I'm not too sure about the 20-min VoD, I guess I'll have to wait till a GvG to see. How has everybody else fared with it?

Based upon rather limited experience, the first thing you notice is that it comes around really, really fast. VOd builds seem to have a huge advantage, especially those with rits at the flagstand.

its like heroes ascent. Holding builds ftw. Rits plus fertile. Boring as hell.

I guess if i wanted to spend all night trying to break holding builds I'd be playing HA, but it seems as if Anet want everyone to run rits. *shrug*

Mighti · Sep 15, 2006, 12:03 PM // 12:03

I cant imagine anyone still seriously running the old spiritspammer rits, with the nerfed boon of creation plus the extreme amounts of energy needed to drop the important spirits like shelter that build was rather nerfed dead imo.
(which i think is a good thing)

As for VoD at 20 mins, I dont see it impacting GvG negatively but since we didn't gvg yesterday due too massive lags and errors I have yet to make the experience myself.

twicky_kid · Sep 15, 2006, 12:07 PM // 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mighti

I cant imagine anyone still seriously running the old spiritspammer rits, with the nerfed boon of creation plus the extreme amounts of energy needed to drop the important spirits like shelter that build was rather nerfed dead imo.
(which i think is a good thing)

As for VoD at 20 mins, I dont see it impacting GvG negatively but since we didn't gvg yesterday due too massive lags and errors I have yet to make the experience myself.

Energizing winds basicly resets the energy cost back to what it used to be. Rit lords will just have to drop one of their old spirits and put in EW. You don't need to spec much into wild to make it affective and it'll recharge quickly with rit lord.

I was hoping spirit spam would be dead but its not. With VoD at 20 minutes you might be seeing it even more than before.

Mighti · Sep 15, 2006, 12:27 PM // 12:27

Ok, I didn't think about EW (always thought it only affects spells *dough*), so Ritspammers probably aint dead...but still; I don't see many guilds wanting to rely on one easily interruptable spirit for their defense to work.
I still think the nerf was pretty good.

edit: plus you cant have ritlord up all the time when affected by EW

Mr Urthadar · Sep 15, 2006, 12:40 PM // 12:40

We GvG'd three times yesterday, and went 1-2. :/.

We lost our first one because the flag runner got stuck. Once he was killed, the !@#$ flag was stuck and we couldn't grab it. GG anet.

Second match we lost because we didn't split immediately against spike.

I have to admit that positioning yourself for VoD at 15 minutes feels very odd. In our first and third matches we faced split teams. Did split teams seem more prevalent last night?

Because of what seems to be more splits, we'll be swapping Bull's Charge for Charge! on our sword warrior. Like it or not, at least GvG is a bit different. I'm curious what people will think about the changes by the end of the ladder season.

ju

latbec · Sep 15, 2006, 03:08 PM // 15:08

I'm still undecided if VoD at 20 is a good thing or a bad thing. I think it's forcing people to include at least 1 character with ganking abilities that can go in the base and clean NPCs. Defensive builds that split poorly and takes 15-20 min to methodically do the job at the flag stand are certainly going to be hurt by that new VoD. I'm however afraid that we will soon see a new series of builds arise, the VoDists that will just try to exploit that.

In my opinion, it's the same story as with all the other previous change to GvG: Evolve or Die.

moriz · Sep 15, 2006, 03:18 PM // 15:18

i think a 25 minutes VoD is a much better alternative. it doesn't heavily favour super-fast ganking, and still make super-turtle builds go down faster.

Arcador · Sep 15, 2006, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Those Knighty dudes are even more easy to "lure" than the regular footmen. They chase you almost threw the gates, and of course they use healing signet no matter the situation thus dieing on the spot. If they make them to stick aroundn the guard, they will be very good for pressure.

Greedy Gus · Sep 15, 2006, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by latbec

Defensive builds that split poorly and takes 15-20 min to methodically do the job at the flag stand are certainly going to be hurt by that new VoD.

You mean shitty teams that camp in 4 wards with heal area, possibly with spirits, and play caster/mixed spike with no pressure? Good riddance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcador

Those Knighty dudes are even more easy to "lure" than the regular footmen. They chase you almost threw the gates, and of course they use healing signet no matter the situation thus dieing on the spot. If they make them to stick aroundn the guard, they will be very good for pressure.

..and easy to run around? I'd say the whole point of the knight implementation was to make it easier to crack a lord area when someone turtles, they're supposed to be pullable and easily killed.

Thumbs up from my end on the GvG changes.

Mighti · Sep 15, 2006, 09:03 PM // 21:03

I think I like the 20-min-VoD, I remember many matches basically being over at around 4 minutes but being camped out till 30 (which never changed anything).

I played 10 GvGs today and only once it was till VoD though (when guesting), all our other matches were over in less than 10 minutes.

I guess we'll just have to wait how the metagame develops due to this change over a longer period of time than just these few days now.

Patrograd · Sep 15, 2006, 11:00 PM // 23:00

having played and won 4 VOD matches tonight I've decided its maybe not so bad after all ;-). All 4 went to VOD though, although we dont play a VOD build, everyone else seems to be.

Red Locust · Sep 16, 2006, 12:53 AM // 00:53

I'm not a fan of the 20 minute VoD. Every game goes to VoD, which somewhat negates the weaker lord room by making it easier to hold out until VoD. On maps that do not have trebuchets, you're at a pretty serious disadvantage if you don't have at least some AoE, because VoD is almost guaranteed to occur between two teams of similar skill level.

Somehow, the game is more about setting yourself up for VoD and tanking AI NPC's than actually fighting the other team.

Shiggidyshwa · Sep 16, 2006, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Locust

I'm not a fan of the 20 minute VoD. Every game goes to VoD, which somewhat negates the weaker lord room by making it easier to hold out until VoD. On maps that do not have trebuchets, you're at a pretty serious disadvantage if you don't have at least some AoE, because VoD is almost guaranteed to occur between two teams of similar skill level.

Somehow, the game is more about setting yourself up for VoD and tanking AI NPC's than actually fighting the other team.

Splitting tactics to destroy the enemy NPC advantage before VOD.

Avarre · Sep 16, 2006, 06:59 AM // 06:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Locust

Somehow, the game is more about setting yourself up for VoD and tanking AI NPC's than actually fighting the other team.

Have you considered the fact that all your games go to VoD because your're playing to set up for VoD, rather than actually fighting the other team?

Played 8 matches today, 2 went to VoD. Like the changes so far, faster games are nicer.

Red Locust · Sep 16, 2006, 07:43 AM // 07:43

Quote:

Splitting tactics to destroy the enemy NPC advantage before VOD.

That would qualify under "setting yourself up for VoD"

Quote:

Have you considered the fact that all your games go to VoD because your're playing to set up for VoD, rather than actually fighting the other team?

Played 8 matches today, 2 went to VoD. Like the changes so far, faster games are nicer.

Fighting the other team only goes so far, then one team realizes they won't be able to take out the other in a straight fight and begin to split and play for VoD. If one team decides that 8v8 isn't gonna cut it and starts playing for VoD, there's really not much you can do other than play for VoD yourself. Unless of course you're so superior to the other team that you straight up roll them, which shouldn't happen on a regular basis unless you're at the beginning of the ladder where most guilds aren't at their true rank.

audioaxes · Sep 16, 2006, 07:58 AM // 07:58

seems like they are making it even easier for solo ganks on guild war