Curse

testbot · Oct 04, 2007, 08:37 PM // 20:37

Can't believe there is an arguement about this subject. If you have any sort of understanding and experience with this game, you would understand how poorly designed the new system is:

I can honestly say that I'm rarely in the mood the waste 2+ min in matches with mending warriors, necromancers with orison, or whatever other dumb concoctions that you pve scrubs (that actually support these recent changes) come up with. Not to mention the fact that I don't enjoy it when I end up in a 8 minute match because people refuse to resign when they have 3-4 monks and/or hybrid healers (i.e d/mo signet of pious light spammer). If I want to leave these incredibly pointless matches, it should be well within my rights. Does Anet really believe that giving "timeouts" is a good way to deal with something that only a small portion of gw believes is actually an issue?

To the people who say who cares? who cares about RA because RA is for noobs... well you are narrow minded considering just about all the good players in this game left anyways and you definitely weren't one of them. RA is convenient and still competitive, which is why I like it and why the narrow minded designers at Anet should NOT be ruining it.

On another note, we all have to realize the huge hole Anet dug for themselves when they actually implemented these changes. RA and TA regulars alike both despise these changes, some of these players have even quit the game because of them. Even if Anet reverts RA/TA back to the way they were, they have still lost people. Anet is most likely inquiring whether they will now lose more players by reverting or maintaining the current system.

DutchSmurf · Oct 04, 2007, 09:14 PM // 21:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by testbot

I can honestly say that I'm rarely in the mood the waste 2+ min in matches with mending warriors, necromancers with orison, or whatever other dumb concoctions that you pve scrubs (that actually support these recent changes) come up with.

Then you should rarely play RA, simple as that. If you don't want mending warriors, necromancers with orison or other dumb builds, then what are you doing in RA to begin with?

Only thing that needs changing is lowering the time limit. 3 minutes is more then enough in my opinion.

martialis · Oct 05, 2007, 12:44 AM // 00:44

Melody Cross is too modest.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Floski

It's this simple kiddies. When you finally understand that GvG is the end game for Guild Wars, you'll understand why people have a problem with the dishonorable hex in GvG. If you keep thinking that AB is PvP and not "FF" or that RA means anything worth a shit, or that Tombs is where the action is, you'll never get it.

I shouldn't do this...I really shouldn't...oh well, here goes...

The dishonorable hex is not supposed to be a prevention, or a restitution, or a rehabilitation. It's supposed to be a punishment. It's supposed to hurt. A lot. It's clearly working as intended.

Critisize Arena.net all you want, but the system enforces the rules. You broke the rules in RA, and now you have to pay. If you don't like the rules, don't play in RA. Or cry about the people who make the rules, not the system that enforces them.

SeraCombi · Oct 05, 2007, 02:36 AM // 02:36

^
woot you go martialis. totally agree.

you or your friend ruin other people's game for giggles while you're waiting to GvG...and big Hexy comes down to play with you. *THWACK*

Div · Oct 05, 2007, 05:06 AM // 05:06

RA is closer to PvE than to GvG. So if the dishonorable hex affects GvG, then it should affect PvE too. Just lock people out of the game for 10 min then...

Plus, I love to see someone leaving RA to go GvG but finding out that they just got the dishonorable hex and that their team has to wait 10 min for it to wear off. (sarcasm at works here)

Floski · Oct 05, 2007, 05:11 AM // 05:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeraCombi

^

you or your friend ruin other people's game for giggles while you're waiting to GvG...and big Hexy comes down to play with you. *THWACK*

Yeah, people who leave RA once a week for GvG are out to ruin your game for giggles. You really hit the nail on the head there. You're not PUNISHING YOUR PROBLEM. Your REAL problem are people who farm RA and leave until they get a perfect team. NOT PEOPLE KILLING TIME BEFORE THEIR GUILD GETS ON FOR GVG. Jesus Christ you people are dense.

Quote:

Whatever point trying to be made here fails... If youre an asshat no GvG for you... leaving once a week to go GvG wont ban you, if 11 mins kills your guild to wait cause you (on the miniscule chance) that you left one game and 3 people reported you so you got 11 dishonor and "OMG ENDZ TEH WORDLZ!!!111" dont RA... If youre starting an AT dont go RA 15 mins before it starts... Now back under your bridge troll.

And it won't kill you that you have to rejoin after losing because there's a bunch of leavers. I played a ton of RA before this system, it was never /that/ bad, yet you whined and got what you wanted. Now I'm going to do the same. bitch bitch bitch whine whine whine.

Despozblehero · Oct 05, 2007, 06:09 AM // 06:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Floski

And it won't kill you that you have to rejoin after losing because there's a bunch of leavers. I played a ton of RA before this system, it was never /that/ bad, yet you whined and got what you wanted. Now I'm going to do the same. bitch bitch bitch whine whine whine.

Actually if 3-4 out of every 5 matches have a leaver it is /that/bad and it got so /that/bad that anet, who never took RA seriously EVER, actually did something about it... lol. You can bitchbitchbitch all you want but you have no point other than you want what you want and 2% of people in the game are jackasses, and the reason for the feature in the first place, are going to try abusing the report feature...
Your argument fails and you only make yourself look worse by acting childish lol. To the community as a whole the /report system is a good thing, you cant dispute that intelligently. QQ less.

Riotgear · Oct 05, 2007, 06:27 AM // 06:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Floski

You're not PUNISHING YOUR PROBLEM. Your REAL problem are people who farm RA and leave until they get a perfect team. NOT PEOPLE KILLING TIME BEFORE THEIR GUILD GETS ON FOR GVG. Jesus Christ you people are dense.

Leaving one game before your GvG match gives you 6 points, you need 10 to get the debuff, so all you have to do is not get those first 4 points and you can leave whenever you want. And all you have to do to not get those first 4 points is limit the number of people that think you're a moron to 1.

bungusmaximus · Oct 05, 2007, 07:11 AM // 07:11

Wow that floski guy loves GvG no doubt and he keeps bitching about 'GvG being the end game'. There's lots of different people on this servers. I for example am pretty decent at this game and I didn't play one GvG match EVER lol, what if my guild isn't into that? getting 8 people together to play can be quite of a lot of hassle, and I have a normal job and there's so GOREDENGINE much to do in this game already, and it's all fun imo.

=HT=Ingram · Oct 05, 2007, 07:39 AM // 07:39

Though I personally trust Anets system of checks and balances on the reports, IF it gets out of hand I'm sure it will be either removed or revamped so that it can not be overtly abused to punish those NOT guilty...

However as to the hex itself... I'm sorry but if they were not doing something wrong to the public, the public would not be backlashing against them for their actions. And as such If they become a civil and respectable player then they will be allowed to continue to play. If not, expect the "HEX" to continue for their attitude. This is a community game. and treating the community poorly is going to have an adverse effect. the new punishment system is NOT unfair... indeed its very forgiving. all you need to is take a break for a while from the bad activities and it basically resets itself. Thus rewarding those that are respectful players and punishing those that are not.

Note the Revamp will likly be based on the report function in that at times it is being used for people that are not guilty of anything except not knowing how to play. What its suppose to be used for is leachers, Leavers, abusive players with regard to language or attitude to others, and cheaters like gold buyers and sellers. Thats about it...

Anet in turn used the /Report flag system to search logs and find the activity in question easily... Basicaly the /report system does a few things...

Log time date stamp, Server, and other players present.

They can in turn use that data to QUICKLY find that log and review what was goin on in game. That information is then used to punish those that are in need of punishment...

Also False /reports are rewarded with Penalties of their own, for wasting Anets time with such abuse.

I think thats fair... Over time it will balance itself out. This is a social stear int eh right direction. its just going to be a bumpy road in the learning curve of what is reportable and what is not.

Div · Oct 05, 2007, 07:43 AM // 07:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

Leaving one game before your GvG match gives you 6 points, you need 10 to get the debuff, so all you have to do is not get those first 4 points and you can leave whenever you want. And all you have to do to not get those first 4 points is limit the number of people that think you're a moron to 1.

I dunno man, I've gotten reported once because I let an overextended wammo die to save my other two team members. And he reported me (or so he claims). Half an hour later, same thing happens (cept I think it was one of those 75% block sins that started raging why he got killed 3 screens away). Pretty epic how many retards you'll find in RA report you. At least Anet figured out their report system was retarded and took it away. Now they just need to change how the dishonor works.

And to whoever says "waiting 11 minutes won't kill your guild". Sure it won't, but if you've tried to set up GvG before if you're not in a top guild with consistent playtimes, it's already pretty annoying getting 8 people. Sometimes, we've had to wait 30-60 minutes just setting up. Waiting another 10 minutes is just to add on to that annoyance. If anything, it hurts mid-tier guilds trying to set up GvG with whoever they had online than the "elitist" top guilds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Wow that floski guy loves GvG no doubt and he keeps bitching about 'GvG being the end game'. There's lots of different people on this servers. I for example am pretty decent at this game and I didn't play one GvG match EVER lol, what if my guild isn't into that? getting 8 people together to play can be quite of a lot of hassle, and I have a normal job and there's so GOREDENGINE much to do in this game already, and it's all fun imo.

You pretty much prove my point of how much of a hassle it is for a "casual" guild to set up GvG in the first place. Waiting for another 10 minutes is just retarded.

There are also many times where you have like 5-10 minutes until your AT match, and someone just dropped, meaning you need a replacement immediately. For the entire guild to be DQ'ed from the AT because someone left RA for that tourney but got the hex is just retarded.

bungusmaximus · Oct 05, 2007, 07:55 AM // 07:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

There are also many times where you have like 5-10 minutes until your AT match, and someone just dropped, meaning you need a replacement immediately. For the entire guild to be DQ'ed from the AT because someone left RA for that tourney but got the hex is just retarded.

Hmm I don't have an easy answer to that one tbh, apart from tweaking the time you have to stay in RA, 8 minutes is retardedly long. People should also be able to SEE their amount of dishonour points like you stated elsewhere, people are allowed an asshole-margin if you ask me. Maybe widen the margin a bit? I do stick with my point though that something had to be done about it.

Maybe aNet should not allow people to leave their guild hall when they have the hex. No big deal with GvG, but the other 99% would be excluded from the game totally, which would be pretty grave punishment.

A punishment just isn't a punishment when people don't actually feel the consequences, that's the whole problem in here.

I just had to reply to that floski dude because he sounds like an #1 elitist airhead, but I certainly don't want GvG to suffer.

RhanoctJocosa · Oct 05, 2007, 07:56 AM // 07:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by DutchSmurf

Then you should rarely play RA, simple as that. If you don't want mending warriors, necromancers with orison or other dumb builds, then what are you doing in RA to begin with?

Only thing that needs changing is lowering the time limit. 3 minutes is more then enough in my opinion.

3 minutes is ridiculous, get a clue.

Despozblehero · Oct 05, 2007, 08:12 AM // 08:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

And to whoever says "waiting 11 minutes won't kill your guild". Sure it won't, but if you've tried to set up GvG before if you're not in a top guild with consistent playtimes, it's already pretty annoying getting 8 people. Sometimes, we've had to wait 30-60 minutes just setting up. Waiting another 10 minutes is just to add on to that annoyance. If anything, it hurts mid-tier guilds trying to set up GvG with whoever they had online than the "elitist" top guilds.

Agreed, but really, how often is this particular instance going to be an issue? Especially if the person who just left RA to GvG was halfway considerate and said "hey team, my guilds calling I got to go GvG, sorry to have to leave like this." I mean its not impossible the situation you describe, but youd have to piss off all 3 other people on your team, and if you just apologized for having to leave youd think at least 1 person would be halfway decent and not report you... not always but most the time. I do know very well how much set up times can suck though lol.

Div · Oct 05, 2007, 08:31 AM // 08:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Despozblehero

Agreed, but really, how often is this particular instance going to be an issue? Especially if the person who just left RA to GvG was halfway considerate and said "hey team, my guilds calling I got to go GvG, sorry to have to leave like this." I mean its not impossible the situation you describe, but youd have to piss off all 3 other people on your team, and if you just apologized for having to leave youd think at least 1 person would be halfway decent and not report you... not always but most the time. I do know very well how much set up times can suck though lol.

I was referring to being reported in the previous hour by idiots >.<

Div · Oct 05, 2007, 08:35 AM // 08:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Hmm I don't have an easy answer to that one tbh, apart from tweaking the time you have to stay in RA, 8 minutes is retardedly long. People should also be able to SEE their amount of dishonour points like you stated elsewhere, people are allowed an asshole-margin if you ask me. Maybe widen the margin a bit? I do stick with my point though that something had to be done about it.

Maybe aNet should not allow people to leave their guild hall when they have the hex. No big deal with GvG, but the other 99% would be excluded from the game totally, which would be pretty grave punishment.

A punishment just isn't a punishment when people don't actually feel the consequences, that's the whole problem in here.

I just had to reply to that floski dude because he sounds like an #1 elitist airhead, but I certainly don't want GvG to suffer.

Obviously the system isn't perfect.

Solutions:
1) lower the 8 minute timer (to ~4-5 maximum)
2) lets you see dishonor points (I've suggested this before in another thread)
3) allow some kind of buffer (hard to implement?)

The punishment was meant mostly to prevent people from ragequitting teams until they get their "perfect team" and it's certainly done that. The biggest problem is that there are many side effects and other things being punished (like legitimate leaving or report abuse).

Traveller · Oct 05, 2007, 09:09 AM // 09:09

I fail to see why this is an issue. Tell your guildies not to leech or ragequit RA. Problem solved.

Div · Oct 05, 2007, 09:21 AM // 09:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Traveller

I fail to see why this is an issue. Tell your guildies not to leech or ragequit RA. Problem solved.

You fail to read through the numerous posts stating the issues. Either that or basic logic.

Emma Whatevergoat · Oct 05, 2007, 09:45 AM // 09:45

All the issues stated are valid, but they all get beaten by this: there are practically no more leavers in RA.

DreamRunner · Oct 05, 2007, 10:26 AM // 10:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Wow that floski guy loves GvG no doubt and he keeps bitching about 'GvG being the end game'. There's lots of different people on this servers. I for example am pretty decent at this game and I didn't play one GvG match EVER lol, what if my guild isn't into that? getting 8 people together to play can be quite of a lot of hassle, and I have a normal job and there's so GOREDENGINE much to do in this game already, and it's all fun imo.

I find it hard to believe that you're decent at the game but never played in a GvG before. Its just GvG is a different type of pvp experience and that you've never experienced it. Meh, it puts a bad taste in my mouth.

I do agree that the dishonour shouldn't effect GvG at all. I mean, its gvg and for some damn reason I don't know why pve players are even commenting. If dishonour didn't effect gvg, why would pve players even care?