Curse

the_deSKtructor · Dec 14, 2007, 02:51 PM // 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Magebane, being Elite, should replaces your usual Elite, be it Burning Arrow, Cripshot or otherwise. Typically, the rest of the bar stays the same.

I can't understand all those rangers that replaced savage with magebane and the old elite with sloth hunters/screaming shot/debilitating shot then <.<

moko · Dec 14, 2007, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Magebane, being Elite, should replaces your usual Elite, be it Burning Arrow, Cripshot or otherwise. Typically, the rest of the bar stays the same.

wrong. savage -> magebane, and your elite -> what the poster above listed.

Byron · Dec 14, 2007, 03:27 PM // 15:27

Making it scale with expertise seems okay. Much like they did when moving GoLE to e storage.

bungusmaximus · Dec 14, 2007, 03:38 PM // 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron

Making it scale with expertise seems okay. Much like they did when moving GoLE to e storage.

They moved GoLe to e-storage because other classes then eles abused it. In the case of magebane we have rangers abusing it, who already run at high expertise. I wonder if it will really make a difference that way.

I'd go with makosi's solution, or with upping the energy cost.

pygar · Dec 14, 2007, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

People would ask themselves, since when do they balance skills around 4vs4? It isn't too much trouble to fix imho. 4vs4 isn't terribly imba, most stuff you can get around with a little thought. It's just that matches get won/lost by the team that has the better/lesser ranger atm. If you give no support at all to something like TA you might as well delete the arena as a whole. I think TA deserves better. Please don't expect me to hang around in HA/GvG all day because that's the only PvP that doesn't suck, might as well live and sleep behind my PC then

.

I understand what you are trying to say....but why is it acceptable for good monks to dominate the meta, and not good rangers? If you werent worried about rangers having this kind of mage-busting power- what would you be worried about?

It was mentioned above that 90% or more of rangers are monk splits.....its the same reason you see such a high percentage of monk split classes across the board- because MONK is broken, why do anything else when you can get so much benefit for so little effort? I'm a learning level PVP player trying to get good with interrupting, and I find that no matter how much people say this skill rocks....I try to use it against monks and block one cheap qwik heal just to watch another qwik cheap heal flash into action.

I think Magebane is perfect....it is not as spammable as some say, and if I can just get a little better with it maybe I can actually do something against some of the "Wall-o-Defense and Healing" strats out there. (invinci-tanks)

making the skill scale with expertise wont really help, as you say high expertise is almost a given on rangers...I think the big thing that makes magebane ok the way it is is that being an elite you have to give up some pretty tried and true ranger elites to use magebane instead.(me personally right now, am trying real hard to figure out how to get better effect from magebane or if I need to go back to burning arrow instead which i was having better luck with in combo with savage shot and d-shot for interupts)

audioaxes · Dec 14, 2007, 06:22 PM // 18:22

increase recharge to 7 seconds
put into marksmanship and have a scaling disabling duration

d shot should be put into marksmenship also with scaling disabling duration also

Sun Fired Blank · Dec 14, 2007, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Quote:

How about this then:

Seconded. makosi wins the thread.

Jaen · Dec 14, 2007, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Magebane, being Elite, should replaces your usual Elite, be it Burning Arrow, Cripshot or otherwise. Typically, the rest of the bar stays the same.

This single comment pretty much just removed any chance of your opinions being taken seriously.

Magebane is balanced for GvG, I'm assuming most people even here agree with that. Magebane is in a good place right now in 8v8 format, any weaker and it wouldn't see play.

As for as TA goes, many skills balanced for 8v8 are far too strong in a 4v4 format. The fact is with just 32 skill slots it's very hard to make a balanced build that is capable of dealing with everything you might encounter in TA. TA is rather build-wars-centric for this reason and I don't see anyway to fix it. The thing is, if magebane is truly as prolific in TA as people in this thread claim, it should be worth it to run one of the numerous counters. In addition, the magebane ranger for the most part is dedicated interrupter, if you bring any sort of counter, it will likely be in the form of bsurge or hexes which also work on opposing frontliners which makes you more versatile. And yes, it's VERY possible to get casts off against a magebane ranger. Especially rangers who spam it on recharge.

And I honestly I don't want to hear, "bsurge doesn't work against rangers because they have mend touch." If you say this, your opinion on this topic really doesn't matter.

bungusmaximus · Dec 14, 2007, 08:15 PM // 20:15

Hmm makosi's nerf ins't huge, you can still rape the crap out of casters when you play well imho.

Jaen · Dec 14, 2007, 08:20 PM // 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Hmm makosi's nerf ins't huge, you can still rape the crap out of casters when you play well imho.

A skilled ranger does not merely twitch interrupts, a skilled ranger anticipates them. If you add a penalty to anticipating interrupts,keeping in mind even top tier rangers have a fairly high failure rate, this skill will be completely dropped for savage and cripshot.

Ranger interrupts are by design supposed to be fairly disposable. A +10second disable, most of the time, is nothing compared to say a power leak.

Sniffy · Dec 14, 2007, 08:37 PM // 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by yum

Magebane is overpowered in TA, that's the fact. I'm not safe even when I activate my life-saving stance.

Monks are dying out there right now people. That's totally unfair. Bring out the nerf-bat.

Originally Posted by makosi
How about this then:

Magebane Shot

Campaign: Nightfall

Profession: Ranger
Attribute: Unlinked
Type: Elite Bow Attack

5 ½ 5

If this attack hits, it interrupts target foe's action. If that action was a Spell, it is disabled for additional 10 seconds. This attack cannot be blocked. If this attack fails to interrupt a spell, Magebane Shot is disabled for 12 seconds.

It's a tad long-winded but it promotes care and attention instead of mindless lucky spamming. It also rewards the caster on the recieving end for taking care to cancel spells when necessary. For the love of god, give spell casters some breathing space.

Even when Magebane is down for 12 seconds, Savage and Distracting will still be available so it won't 'make Rangers useless.'

/signed
Keeps it a useful skill while preventing the mindless spamming that makes it op.

yum · Dec 14, 2007, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

How about this then:

Magebane Shot

Campaign: Nightfall

Profession: Ranger
Attribute: Unlinked
Type: Elite Bow Attack

5 ½ 5

If this attack hits, it interrupts target foe's action. If that action was a Spell, it is disabled for additional 10 seconds. This attack cannot be blocked. If this attack fails to interrupt a spell, Magebane Shot is disabled for 12 seconds.

It's a tad long-winded but it promotes care and attention instead of mindless lucky spamming. It also rewards the caster on the recieving end for taking care to cancel spells when necessary. For the love of god, give spell casters some breathing space.

Even when Magebane is down for 12 seconds, Savage and Distracting will still be available so it won't 'make Rangers useless.'

No. If you know the play style of the other team's ranger, you pretty much screw him.

/notsigned

pygar · Dec 14, 2007, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Hmm makosi's nerf ins't huge, you can still rape the crap out of casters when you play well imho.

Firstly, nobody likes nerfs...and secondly they buffed magebane shot to be like this so they could spare monk players from massive nerfs (State of the game articles say it is the Monks turn).Thirdly, even toning this ability down a little will put it right back into not ever being used -with any of the suggestions in this thread over what it is now, it just doesn't live up to the other elites you could have instead.

Also needs to be mentioned....while the ability helps against mages and monks, it isnt very stellar against melee oriented builds that dont use spells.... also while it cannot be blocked, it can be dodged.

moko · Dec 14, 2007, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by pygar

it can be dodged.

and if you dodge, you aren't casting spells.

just a hint -- refrain from posting crap like that.

right; a final edit before i get mad. stop posting in here; you lack experience, state of the game articles are usually CRAP. i'm kinda sick of cleaning your trash over and over with your "MONKS ARE SO IMBA STUFF NEEDS TO STOP THEM". seriously..

ensoriki · Dec 14, 2007, 09:15 PM // 21:15

I still like 10 energy on magebane.

pygar · Dec 14, 2007, 09:33 PM // 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by ensoriki

I still like 10 energy on magebane.

Maybe that is do-able...high enough expertise and 10 cost becomes 5 or 4. I understand that monks need to be able to heal, but there has to be some way around that too. I think the skill as it stands has counters, even before talking about changing skills and builds.

Jaen · Dec 14, 2007, 09:43 PM // 21:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Magebane is not useless versus non-casters because it still interrupts their skills. You just don't (or shouldn't) get the disabling time.

Wow...

Two players stand there spamming skills. Player A devotes almost half their bar and their elite (realistically the elite defines the ranger bar so really it's more than half their bar) to shutdown. In doing this, player A shuts down player B. Are we seriously complaining about this? The current ranger template, which was pretty much designed from the ground up as a strong skirmisher, is strong in 4v4; this is worth complaining over?

If this skill is changed because people refuse to learn how to play against it and improve then what is the point of having skill-based PvP?

Sorry, with people making such ridiculous comments like the one quoted above, I'm not even going to bother anymore.

makosi · Dec 14, 2007, 09:52 PM // 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaen

Wow...

Two players stand there spamming skills. Player A devotes almost half their bar and their elite (realistically the elite defines the ranger bar so really it's more than half their bar) to shutdown. In doing this, player A shuts down player B. Are we seriously complaining about this? The current ranger template, which was pretty much designed from the ground up as a strong skirmisher, is strong in 4v4; this is worth complaining over?

If this skill is changed because people refuse to learn how to play against it and improve then what is the point of having skill-based PvP?

Sorry, with people making such ridiculous comments like the one quoted above, I'm not even going to bother anymore.

Then how do you propose that people counteract the Magebane? Since you are being so self-assured tell me how to avoid being interrupted when there's a bunny thumper or a Shattering Assault assassin in your face. You've made enough arrogant remarks and threw around skills but haven't contributed anything worthwhile. I can't pick out anything that helps me. Maybe you don't agree with what I say but I do try to justify my comments.

Can I assume you abuse Magebane yourself and are afraid of it being changed to your dismay?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Me

Magebane is not useless versus non-casters because it still interrupts their skills. You just don't (or shouldn't) get the disabling time.

I think you've misunderstood me. While I don't condone shooting Magebane arrows at a warrior, I'm saying it's not 100% useless. If you're in the know about the Shadow Walk -> Shove -> Crushing Blow warrior + monk spike Magebane will interrupt Shove or Crushing because it's predictable. That's just an example.

ensoriki · Dec 14, 2007, 11:00 PM // 23:00

If theres someone removing your enchants.
Then the team is just prepared to deal with you anyways.

Seraphim of Chaos · Dec 14, 2007, 11:42 PM // 23:42

I can only think of upping the recharge. Everything else would just put this out of the game...Or thinking of anything else is just too hard. :P