Curse

wuzzman · Mar 07, 2008, 11:15 PM // 23:15

wail of doom does nothing for idiots so "good" overpowered might be the word for it. though it will eventually be nerfed, the game is given more midline options which means you can't prepare yourself against everything a team might throw at you which means, builds become more offensive in nature and you might actually have to do more then go through the motions.

Almighty Zi · Mar 07, 2008, 11:56 PM // 23:56

I like the changes to Wail Of Doom in one sense but in it's current form it is prone to misuse. You just know that folk are considering ways to abuse it.

Firstly, I'd like to see it changed to a skill (non-spell) so that it can't be arcane echoed. Secondly, increase the recharge to at least 12 seconds (if not 15). Finally, there's no real penalty attached to the skill for such a powerful effect. It is basically free to cast and 10% health loss is easily mopped up. I'd suggest either removing the health sacrifice and actually making it cost energy or increasing the health sacrifice to 17% and making it so that both the necro and target's attributes are set to 0 for the duration.

Boogz · Mar 08, 2008, 12:05 AM // 00:05

if both of the necro and the target get 0 atribute it would be inferior to the old wail of doom.
the only nerfs that i'd accept on this skill would be change into a skill , so it wont be used with arcane echo and 12-15sec recharge , no more than this , the skill is excellent right now

Boogz · Mar 08, 2008, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuzzman

bloodspiking isn't the problem with blood magic. It's the fact that it serves very few purposes outside of the caster spike and it really is a RA/AB/PVE line. You could buff the support aspects of it, but I don't see how you can say buff order of pain and not get ranger spikes and so forth. You can move more skills away from blood into soul reaping and change what they do like with foul fest, but you run into the question of do people really want to run up against a gvg ready midline necro. In which case that answer is most likely no.

blood magic has no use on pve rather than 55necro/orders/bip , even on RA and AB they don't have much use , only for gimmick spikes at HA and hardly ever on GvG

erk · Mar 08, 2008, 01:55 AM // 01:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boogz

blood magic has no use on pve rather than 55necro/orders/bip , even on RA and AB they don't have much use , only for gimmick spikes at HA and hardly ever on GvG

Rubbish, I have done hundreds of glad points with Blood Magic builds over the years. My big gripe is a lot of the skills are still 2 sec cast, so with 35 energy pool and Pleak Mesmers all over the place it's not much fun.

Life Transfer could do with a shorter recharge too.

Phe Belladona · Mar 08, 2008, 02:11 AM // 02:11

exciting update, pretty good stuff changed lots of shake up.

nice attempt to make necros usable, make useless mesmer elites almost usable (but i'd still run surge), making mesmer super easy with no cancelled aegis and edenial a breeze, massive attack on passive block ward/shields/aegis all passively or directly raped.

should be interesting BUT paragons still hated, but whats made me smile the most is the prospect of getting a frog sceptre ooo so excited

twicky_kid · Mar 08, 2008, 02:45 AM // 02:45

Um....ok.

Why is Anet such a tease? WoD is going to get hit with the nerf bat so fast.

WoD
Arcane
Diversion
Foul Feast
Plague Sending
Power Lock
Power Leak
Res Sig

That's just something off the top of my head but its nuts. You can lock down a monk forever. Interrupt their midline, frontline, backline, and at the same time keep your party condition free. Its the ultimate bitch bar (support bar). The real danger with WoD is with 2 copies and that .25 casting you can easily throw it on both monks before a spike leaving the opposing team with 0 healing abilities. There isn't enough time to remove the hexes AND prot + heal the spiked target. Oh, and 1cc wtf is that?

Why does a necro need a draw condition that returns energy?

With all the changes to reduction energy cost and 1cc spells why do we even need any energy management elites in the necro lines. I'd rework them if these are going to be permanent changes. For instance OoB move it to soul reaping and chance "you and up to 3 allies nearby gains 5....10 energy."

moriz · Mar 08, 2008, 02:51 AM // 02:51

WoD needs to cause exhausion if it's effect is gonna be this powerful. that should force people to use it intelligently, instead of slapping it on someone every time it recharges.

erk · Mar 08, 2008, 03:35 AM // 03:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

Um....ok.

Why is Anet such a tease? WoD is going to get hit with the nerf bat so fast.

WoD
Arcane
Diversion
Foul Feast
Plague Sending
Power Lock
Power Leak
Res Sig

That's just something off the top of my head but its nuts. You can lock down a monk forever. Interrupt their midline, frontline, backline, and at the same time keep your party condition free. Its the ultimate bitch bar (support bar). The real danger with WoD is with 2 copies and that .25 casting you can easily throw it on both monks before a spike leaving the opposing team with 0 healing abilities. There isn't enough time to remove the hexes AND prot + heal the spiked target. Oh, and 1cc wtf is that?

Why does a necro need a draw condition that returns energy?

With all the changes to reduction energy cost and 1cc spells why do we even need any energy management elites in the necro lines. I'd rework them if these are going to be permanent changes. For instance OoB move it to soul reaping and chance "you and up to 3 allies nearby gains 5....10 energy."

You will probably find that Izzy is just trying to kick start the Necro back into a utility role, and like you say it will get a nerf if it works. There is a lot of inertia to change, so I guess he like to make things painfully obvious or they just seem to get missed.

weis · Mar 08, 2008, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

Um....ok.

Why is Anet such a tease? WoD is going to get hit with the nerf bat so fast.

WoD
Arcane
Diversion
Foul Feast
Plague Sending
Power Lock
Power Leak
Res Sig

That's just something off the top of my head but its nuts. You can lock down a monk forever. Interrupt their midline, frontline, backline, and at the same time keep your party condition free. Its the ultimate bitch bar (support bar). The real danger with WoD is with 2 copies and that .25 casting you can easily throw it on both monks before a spike leaving the opposing team with 0 healing abilities. There isn't enough time to remove the hexes AND prot + heal the spiked target. Oh, and 1cc wtf is that?

Why does a necro need a draw condition that returns energy?

With all the changes to reduction energy cost and 1cc spells why do we even need any energy management elites in the necro lines. I'd rework them if these are going to be permanent changes. For instance OoB move it to soul reaping and chance "you and up to 3 allies nearby gains 5....10 energy."

Oh 3 second diversion ok. if wail was usable on me/n then it might be good on some dom mes builds but atleast for now I haven't seen any good builds with wail in gvg.

Overall nice updates imo. Was still kinda expecting lod buff because now only reasonable party heal is HB heal party and the backline with HB still forces mo/e which is boring and forces builds with more static defence for non mo/a/w monks.

twicky_kid · Mar 08, 2008, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by erk

You will probably find that Izzy is just trying to kick start the Necro back into a utility role, and like you say it will get a nerf if it works. There is a lot of inertia to change, so I guess he like to make things painfully obvious or they just seem to get missed.

That has been an issue with necros since the expansions. Either they are OP or not used at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by weis

Oh 3 second diversion ok. if wail was usable on me/n then it might be good on some dom mes builds but atleast for now I haven't seen any good builds with wail in gvg.

Diversion is still over a 2 sec cast on a mes but its been a staple skill since beta.

JR · Mar 08, 2008, 05:28 AM // 05:28

Infuse does not require a spec to save a spike. Throwing that out there.

DarkNecrid · Mar 08, 2008, 05:38 AM // 05:38

Had an idea for WoD

Set the recharge time to 20s, and keep the duration.

Functionality changed to the following:
For 1...3 seconds, all of target foe's attributes are set to 0. If, when this Hex ends, the target used a Skill while under the effects of this Hex, it recharges in 10s instead.

Promotes active play + good timing.

twicky_kid · Mar 08, 2008, 06:12 AM // 06:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR

Infuse does not require a spec to save a spike. Throwing that out there.

Very true but we all know infuse alone is not enough to save you vs spike.

DutchSmurf · Mar 08, 2008, 11:23 AM // 11:23

It is Saturday now and I still didn't see a working WoD bar in high-end GvG. It would be a lot easier to make one if Draw Conditions was still an important skill on your midline I think. But that one hasn't been used for some time now. Guess those new runes have a lot to do with that. But except for maybe Hexer's Vigor (if you want to split with it), there just aren't any strong non-elite skills in Soul Reaping. Since WoD really needs that 13 points, the rest of your bar is always going to be bad I think.

I Angra I · Mar 08, 2008, 11:43 AM // 11:43

When I was guesting tonight on warrior we played against a team that had a necro with WoD, faintheartedness, parabond, and enfeeble.. and he just spammed all of them on me the whole game, and it was pretty annoying. Other than that it didn't really do much though.

I think WoD should probably get a slight nerf though.

Burton2000 · Mar 08, 2008, 01:42 PM // 13:42

Dunno doubt it warrants any nerf in it current form now. Unless someone comes up with some uber strong build using it.

C2K · Mar 08, 2008, 02:22 PM // 14:22

I think WoD is fine. You really have to attr. alot into Soul Reaping in order to make it work at all, and its made so you really can't splash it into another primary unless you do something completely nutz. (Signet of Illusions + Arcane Mimicry Mesmer >.< lol)

suiraCLAW · Mar 08, 2008, 02:40 PM // 14:40

Just a question: how is wail of boom better then glyph of renewal + shame for shutting down monks on a spike? Especially if you consider that a mesmer can aid in a spike very easily and has a lot more interesting spells...

twicky_kid · Mar 08, 2008, 04:37 PM // 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by suiraCLAW

Just a question: how is wail of boom better then glyph of renewal + shame for shutting down monks on a spike? Especially if you consider that a mesmer can aid in a spike very easily and has a lot more interesting spells...

1cc, 10 recharge, .25 casting