Curse

Sun Fired Blank · Aug 26, 2008, 07:28 PM // 19:28

As charming as your tongue in cheek humor is, your monk bar isn't any more honorable / strong / brave / adjective than any of the other monk bars played in the format. There is exactly one prot on your bar: Pensive Guardian. Shield of Force is more akin to Shield Bash than prot.

So if you take the second bar you posted:

[Spotless Mind] -> [Purge Signet]
[Shield Bash] -> [Shield of Force]

There is exactly one conceptual difference between your bar and the other bar: Pensive Guardian for a stance.

In terms of the bar itself: Pensive Guardian is okay because of Vigorous Spirit and Strength of Honor on frontliners. Purge Signet is hardly bad either, as the cost is often zero when you Purge on 0 of 25, you don't always use it anyways if you have strong veil use and an okay ranger with a hex removal, and you can usually fake a resolution. Shield of Force is the more interesting choice, as the recharge is very strong and you can have roughly 100% uptime on your enchanting set if your spec is high enough. It's hardly as laughable as you make it out.

Orange Milk · Aug 26, 2008, 07:39 PM // 19:39

LOL, I really loled back there.

Sun is right Jace, your running basically the same bar, just differently named skills to do it.

But alas, as I type he beats me to it.

I think you think your on a very high horse, but I think it's the same height as everyone elses. And since this is all arguing over the internet, I'm gonna say that horse is most likly a Shetlin Pony.

Teh Jace · Aug 26, 2008, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Lol guys I totally don't get u.

Quote me when I'm saying my bar > everything. Also "my" bar is actually a tweaked bar Karla runs.

All I wanted to say (between the lines) was that TA bars always had 1 prot (guardian). A guy called sun fired blank was whinning cuz of lame TA bars. But totally SIMILAR bars are run since TA exists.
ZB bar has usually 1 prot (guardian) and cond removal as a backup heal so there is no difference between today's WoH hybrid and old ZB.

Basically u are crying over a monk template which has never been changed.

I posted that youtube to say fck u to foe who has no clue (nice rhymes).

Sun Fired Blank · Aug 26, 2008, 08:19 PM // 20:19

Um, are you serious?

Every bit of condition removal is relegated to the necromancer which lets you run these stupid omega bars like the ones you and karla run. EXPLAIN how that isn't gay.

Teh Jace · Aug 26, 2008, 08:56 PM // 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sun Fired Blank

Um, are you serious?

Every bit of condition removal is relegated to the necromancer which lets you run these stupid omega bars like the ones you and karla run. EXPLAIN how that isn't gay.

First of all read ur own posts (omg monks have no prots they suck).
And then answer these questions:

Do u remember the meta with E/Mo draw conditions?
If so do u think it was gay?
What's the difference between hex and condi removal in terms of player's skill?
Do u think ZB monks had some kind of problem with recognizing which of their mates suffered from some condition?
Do u think WoH bar (FC healing, FC prot for guard) is easier for weap swapping than the ZB one (FC prot for everything)?

Also.. a nec sucking up all poison will soon run out of energy. That's why when u face a balanced team and the game lasts longer than 2 minutes poison actually sticks.

Imo (Pensive) guardian is always a must. If u don't have one ur necro will get trained 24/7 with absolutely no effort of the opposing team. Ofc prots can be avoided but what does it mean? 5s spent by running to the next foe? Then it does its job well.

Sun Fired Blank · Aug 26, 2008, 09:45 PM // 21:45

Quote:

Do u remember the meta with E/Mo draw conditions? If so do u think it was gay?

If you think [Draw Conditions] <-> E/Mo is remotely comparable to [Foul Feast] <-> N/X, you have seriously lost every marble in your head. Talk to me again when you run DRAW CONDITIONS on your necromancer.

Quote:

What's the difference between hex and condi removal in terms of player's skill? Do u think ZB monks had some kind of problem with recognizing which of their mates suffered from some condition?

Why don't you ask if dolphins and sharks are the same in terms of being aquatic life? Your point is frankly lost on me. Are you saying that responsibility for condition removal has moved from the monk to the necro, and that condition removal is easy versus hex removal? Okay. And your point?

This argument clearly evades the fact your imba shit necro bar enables retarded monk bars and that conditions are gone from TA outside of spam that can outpace Foul Feast: R/P, D/E, A/D, R/Mo, etc.

Quote:

Also.. a nec sucking up all poison will soon run out of energy. That's why when u face a balanced team and the game lasts longer than 2 minutes poison actually sticks.

You savage the preparation on recharge, you have Vigorous Spirit and Signet of Rejuvenation on top of Word of Healing and Patient Spirit, you even have Empathic Removal (to a very limited extent) helping to control poison before that point. You and I both know that poison should be under control before that point. But frankly it's retarded that Foul Feast gives you the option of controlling poison, even for short periods, by sucking it up on recharge.

Teh Jace · Aug 26, 2008, 10:10 PM // 22:10

Dude u rly have no idea what u are talking about.
Foul feast is a retarded skill which needs to have 6+ s recharge soo badly but this discussion is about monk bars being lame or not?

If u fail at seeing how ZB "prot" (nice joke) bar is similar to that Mo/D bar then I can't rly help u.
Basically condi removals have been replaced with hex removals and u are saying it is gay. But since when is a good monk recognized by a proper using of condi removal?
U were repeating ur "monk with no cond removal sucks" over and over so I asked u if a proper using of condi removal is any harder than spamming patient spirit or cure hex. And ur answer is "cond spam is gone".
At least stick with ur own topic or go to the gvg section and post "omg RC monks are gay they remove condis and prot only but they don't heal its lame..."
TA monks had to prot, heal, remove conds, remove hexes, keep ppl veiled. Now they have to prot, heal, remove hexes and keep ppl veiled. Hmm.

It's
Necro sucks up poison, monk casts patient or sig to prevent the hp loss
vs
Monk casts mend condition

urania · Aug 26, 2008, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foe

that bar is amazing and i hope to see EVERYONE running it immediately!
2 sec cast that costs u 10en per removal vs 1/4 sec cast that costs you 2.5 en per removed hex O BABY! Pensive and Shield of Force gtfo

u, my friend, have no idea what you're on about.

*points Foe at the Riverside Inn*

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sun Fired Blank

Um, are you serious?

Every bit of condition removal is relegated to the necromancer which lets you run these stupid omega bars like the ones you and karla run. EXPLAIN how that isn't gay.

and do the honorable likes of YOU still play at all or are you too busy flaming everyone that adapts their bars to ff?

point ur smartass finger at the person who made ff what it is today.

i didnt like it, but i accepted it and at least i can run one of my favourite skills aka purge sig again (which ive always ran on my zb bar in combination with veil

). bite me (=.

but hey, u can run draw+mend touch on the monk, no one is preventing u from doing so =o

last, but not least...purge>spotless mind for 4, very vital reasons. try guessing what they are.

Sun Fired Blank · Aug 26, 2008, 10:46 PM // 22:46

Quote:

Dude u rly have no idea what u are talking about.
Foul feast is a retarded skill which needs to have 6+ s recharge soo badly but this discussion is about monk bars being lame or not?

Foul Feast is the only reason that you can run these ridiculous monk bars, and you conveniently and repeatedly ignore this fact. Why do you think monk bars can even run this amount of hex removal? Do you think everyone decided overnight you can simply put hex removal into those condition removal slots?

Put everything into perspective and staple this inside your eyelids:

[Foul Feast]: FOUL FEAST

You're right in that versus other traits like veil use, expedient hex removal, weapon swaps and pre-kiting, condition removal is not as important. But I think quick and proper condition management used to be a very notable trait of superior monks, especially if you used Draw Conditions.

On the RC / GvG point: are you serious? REALLY? REALLY? The delegation of work among higher format backlines doesn't compare to sticking foul feast on your goddamn necromancer and playing your fortressway TA monk.

urania · Aug 26, 2008, 11:03 PM // 23:03

personally, i like fortressway monk in gvg (with cond removal). guess what, its a lot more self sufficient than a mo/e or a mo/me=o. mo/a is another good choice.

also, dont forget to read post #28.

moreover, cond removal mattered most when there was still blindness around. but it was ridicuously retarded with 2 som and without ff u wouldnt have standed the slightest chance. even with it, it was incredibly hard and vs good teams abusing it downright impossible.
if u're crazy enough to say that it would be a less gay and a more "honorable" choice to run cond removal on the monk, then be my guest.
the current state of ta is not ideal, but it is better than it was, in case u didnt notice that.

Seraphim of Chaos · Aug 27, 2008, 01:12 AM // 01:12

hey guise why don't one of you make an FF topic and GTFO MAH TOPIC

Barkeep · Aug 27, 2008, 07:42 AM // 07:42

Well there's an idea...

I've said this several times, and I will say it again. Nobody will agree with me, but nobody actually knows what they are talking about because u all used FF from the very first minute.

Dual SoM is EASIER without FF and with the pre-FF condition management from balanced.

Now someone go make an FF thread, I tried it but could not find the right words. Sometimes it sucks when english isnt your first language

Teh Jace · Aug 27, 2008, 08:00 AM // 08:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sun Fired Blank

On the RC / GvG point: are you serious? REALLY? REALLY? The delegation of work among higher format backlines doesn't compare to sticking foul feast on your goddamn necromancer and playing your fortressway TA monk.

I played all pvp formats at the top level long enough to say all differences between TA, HA and GvG monking. And I wouldn't rly compare these different playstyles. But how the heck is this related to this topic?
If u think that stanceless Mo/D monk is a fortressway then I don't know what to say.

Talking to u is like talking to my exguildie mesmer :

Omg look at vE they are rank 20 LOL LOL LOL. When we were active we were pwning them soo hard. GvG is rly dead they suck.
- Lol what if they just got better?
Omg they are HA scrubs. Once HA scrub forever HA scrub.
- jeez...
GvG is dead and noobs we were owning within few minutes are top guilds too omg lol.

But whatever... U have ur truth be happy with it.

Foe · Aug 27, 2008, 08:09 AM // 08:09

I play roughly between 10pm-2am est. I run 2 wars a nec and monk. Recently its been with Absum and Sleepy but i could get some less experienced players to make it fair. pm me ig so we can try and set up a match, run what ever u want with whom ever. current ign is true wuv

urania · Aug 27, 2008, 08:59 AM // 08:59

i care this [] much who you play with and what kind of team setup u play in.

u dont have a single clue what you're on about.

im still waiting for a brave soul to list the 4 reasons i mentioned as to why purge is better than spotless mind.

@squall, no. i hated ff at the start since it gave a big advantage to team using it in comparison to the one that did not use it. but yeah, everyone, including you, run it now, so i dont think you have much saying there.
also, please enlighten me as to how dual som was easier without FF. 1 som can be the case, but 2 of them being easier is a completely retarded statement imho. please explain =p.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

hey guise why don't one of you make an FF topic and GTFO MAH TOPIC

how about turning on your brain before making smartass comments? the reason for your QQing about monk bars lies in that very skill, so I think it has quite some relevance to this topic.

if you believe thats not the case and that all posts regarding ff are completely irrelevant to the monk bars and should be wiped from this thread (moko will gladly add a few more points to her r12 forum nazi :P) than BY ALL MEANS DO SO

Krill · Aug 27, 2008, 09:39 AM // 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep

Dual SoM is EASIER without FF and with the pre-FF condition management from balanced.

Please explain...

FF is gay, most agree it has staled the variety of builds you can run. But on the other hand, FF discourages a lot of spam shit from spear chuckers and dervs. I'd only be happy to see FF get nerfed into oblivion if wounding strike goes with it and apply poison is made into a bow preparation. Barbed spear should also be increased to 4 adrenaline, always wondered why sever artery is 4 and barbed is 2, please explain o sages of skill balancing.

Master Ketsu · Aug 27, 2008, 09:58 AM // 09:58

I'm seriously starting to consider testing more builds with rit healers considering how fail the monk meta is right now.

the_deSKtructor · Aug 27, 2008, 10:03 AM // 10:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by arienrhode

Please explain...

FF is gay, most agree it has staled the variety of builds you can run. But on the other hand, FF discourages a lot of spam shit from spear chuckers and dervs. I'd only be happy to see FF get nerfed into oblivion if wounding strike goes with it and apply poison is made into a bow preparation. Barbed spear should also be increased to 4 adrenaline, always wondered why sever artery is 4 and barbed is 2, please explain o sages of skill balancing.

Dual SoM just diversion camped your necromancer, basically shutting down your only condition removal. Warrior and ranger automatically became useless (blind 24/7) and with no damage there's no way you can win the match. Instaed, if you use self condition removal on ranger and maybe on the war then you could still remove the blinds and deal some damage/shutting down the hexers. Same goes (to a lesser extend) with hex removal. Spreading it on different party members helped against dual SoM.

Teh Jace · Aug 27, 2008, 10:05 AM // 10:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

I'm seriously starting to consider testing more builds with rit healers considering how fail the monk meta is right now.

Aren't u his multinick? TA Monk meta has actually never been changed (ignoring boon prot and total gayness called HC which is fortunately gone).

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_deSKtructor

Dual SoM just diversion camped your necromancer, basically shutting down your only condition removal. Warrior and ranger automatically became useless (blind 24/7) and with no damage there's no way you can win the match. Instaed, if you use self condition removal on ranger and maybe on the war then you could still remove the blinds and deal some damage/shutting down the hexers. Same goes (to a lesser extend) with hex removal. Spreading it on different party members helped against dual SoM.

U are wrong and so is sqall. During the boom of dual SoM MoI was untouched. The ridiculous spammability and AoE effect + multiple cover of long lasting blindness made all these cond removals unplayable. Monk couldn't afford to keep ppl veiled AND spam cond removal (only draw would work cuz blind was buried under tons of shit) and ranger was basically fcked up cuz blinding had actually recharge of 3-4s (SoM AND plague sending).
U can't even be srs about that.

the_deSKtructor · Aug 27, 2008, 10:16 AM // 10:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teh Jace

U are wrong and so is sqall. During the boom of dual SoM MoI was untouched. The ridiculous spammability and AoE effect + multiple cover of long lasting blindness made all these cond removals unplayable. Monk couldn't afford to keep ppl veiled AND spam cond removal (only draw would work cuz blind was buried under tons of shit) and ranger was basically fcked up cuz blinding had actually recharge of 3-4s (SoM AND plague sending).
U can't even be srs about that.

Ppl still run dual SoM even after the MoI nerf and they only stopped to use that elite when it was changed to 2 secs cast.