Curse

Corporeal Ghost · May 25, 2010, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

do you think mind wreck would have been used when it handt received the buff it did?

If the other buffs went through, yes, but it wouldn't be 30% of Guild Wars.

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

the damage effect kicks in once you have no energy left in low set, so each time you cast you have to swap to wand set and quickly back and thats 100+damage for you.
every.7.seconds.

I understand how Mind Wrack works in this sense. That's less DPS than a Lightning Orb. It's not just the damage. The damage gets pretty absurd when you couple it with Overload on recharge, however. This is the core of the problem. The ~95 damage on ending Wrack is non-trivial to be sure, but it's not back-breaking.

(in worst case scenario) or more if the recharge is halfed or if there's more than 1 mesmer up against you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

biggest prob isnt e denial. its the DAMAGE dealt for basicaly no actual effort or skill that punishes smart weapon swapping.

Think about what you're saying here. You actually take far less damage if you're weapon swapping correctly. There is no punishment involved. Consider the damage on Wrack ending a sunk cost, as if he was just Orbing you. You're preventing all of the little 23 damage procs when you swap down. Unless you think he's not going to drain your high set to 0 by the time Mind Wrack recharges, you are definitely rewarded for blowing it up yourself.

Or if you must look at it as punishment for swapping down, as it were, simply consider how much more punishment you will be in for if you don't end it yourself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirius bsns

Here's an idea for Mind Wrack: increase recharge to 12-15 seconds, lower the duration of the hex to 1...9...16 seconds, and lower the damage to half of what it is now.

That skill is unplayable. Mind Wrack is a fairly well-designed skill; there is no cause to remove it from the game entirely. I'm hoping the responses like this are just knee-jerk. Why would you need to nerf something to a state that's several times worse than before they buffed it out of "unplayability"?

It's definitely fine if you put it back where it was before the buff. It could probably even be a little stronger. Hex removal is far stronger than it was last time Wrack saw play. Monk bars are orders of magnitude more energy-efficient. The underlying problem, therefore, must be the Overload + Mind Wrack synergy.

I suspect a lot of the anti-Mind Wrack sentiment comes from the fact that people are not used to teams actually wiping because monks break. It hasn't happened in years, after all. This isn't a negative thing, people. Weren't we complaining about broken tiebreak conditions? Long, boring stalemate matches?

Krill · May 25, 2010, 02:49 AM // 02:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Just did some HA 15 minutes ago, we pretty much ragequit after 5 matches, what a shit metagame.

It's a law that whenever you think the HA metagame couldn't possibly get worse it will.

Since I've been playing it:

--> thumperways (the most OP build post-NF)
--> rspike (massive defense to counter)
--> teaseway (bot to prot), palm sins
--> iway (to counter heroes)
--> balanced (pd > iway)
--> hexes (beat most balanced)
--> R/A sway (pug fame)
--> hexes (hexes > sway)
--> balanced (balanced got better at beating hexes)
--> seeping stuff (ridiculously OP in HA)
--> bot mesmers

This has got to be the meta that nails the coffin shut on HA. I can't think of any reason to even form a group and enter now...

FoxBat · May 25, 2010, 04:48 AM // 04:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

I suspect a lot of the anti-Mind Wrack sentiment comes from the fact that people are not used to teams actually wiping because monks break. It hasn't happened in years, after all. This isn't a negative thing, people. Weren't we complaining about broken tiebreak conditions? Long, boring stalemate matches?

The problem (among others) is this is the only build that can do that, which is why everyone is running 2-3 mesmers. Are we going to now power creep everything else to match mind wrack? Even if you really wanted this result, nerfing backline is the sensible approach.

The "do X per mesmer skill" is just a flat-out elite worthy mechanic. Your entire bar warps to proc it as much as possible, balancing it down to a manageable level will simply make it unremarkable/unexciting. If we really want that kind of potential effect in PvP, they should rework power flux into it. This effect on mind wrack either has to be go or set with a limited number of procs (1 or 2)

urania · May 25, 2010, 08:09 AM // 08:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

I understand how Mind Wrack works in this sense. That's less DPS than a Lightning Orb. It's not just the damage. The damage gets pretty absurd when you couple it with Overload on recharge, however. This is the core of the problem. The ~95 damage on ending Wrack is non-trivial to be sure, but it's not back-breaking.

it is too much damage. and please, dont compare it with 15 e 2 s cast time lightning orb.
it is back-breaking after 1 or so minutes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

Think about what you're saying here. You actually take far less damage if you're weapon swapping correctly. There is no punishment involved. Consider the damage on Wrack ending a sunk cost, as if he was just Orbing you. You're preventing all of the little 23 damage procs when you swap down. Unless you think he's not going to drain your high set to 0 by the time Mind Wrack recharges, you are definitely rewarded for blowing it up yourself.

Or if you must look at it as punishment for swapping down, as it were, simply consider how much more punishment you will be in for if you don't end it yourself.

well, you blow up yourself a bit later then he'd blow you up if you hadnt swapped. i know that, but it doesnt change the fact that it punishes your weapon swapping, even if you negate part of the damage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

I suspect a lot of the anti-Mind Wrack sentiment comes from the fact that people are not used to teams actually wiping because monks break. It hasn't happened in years, after all. This isn't a negative thing, people. Weren't we complaining about broken tiebreak conditions? Long, boring stalemate matches?

its a badly thought out solution for making monks more killable again. how about...toning down patient and woh maybe instead of giving us more skills on steroids again?

diabiosx · May 25, 2010, 02:59 PM // 14:59

There is a reason why mesmers were never meant for direct damage, because other professions(ele,ranger,paragon) fulfill that role. I dont know why they decided to change that. Now mesmers can deal a shit ton of damage while energy denying monks to a point where they can't heal/prot anymore.

Mind wrack+overload+wastrel's demise+energy surge
is one of the deadliest skill combos in this game. It deals about 60 or more damage -1energy for overload at 4sec recharge, 60or more damage -1energy -3health degen for wastrel's demise.

It is almost impossible to use low energy weapon set now because mindwrack will deal 100damage whenever the target has 0energy. with a 7second recharge, it will be up continuously and impossible to interupt due to fast cast.

Anet, do I have to wait another 4months for you guys to finally decide that it is broken?

Animate · May 25, 2010, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Change all skill buffs to PvE only

or

Delete the mesmer class all together

Fix'd

Let's delete all classes altogether!

Why are people complaining about PI, lol.
Before the update it was so underpowered compared to PB and PD that no one ever took it but me. I often wished it would be more rewarding to interrupt something with it than a simple knockdown. It's nowhere near as overpowered as hammer warriors have been since years. They got like up to FOUR 3 second knock downs on their bar, which they use on you IN A ROW. Lol. And which do not need to interrupt something to work. And which also deal damage and deep wounds in the process (until recently, when Anet decided to also give them unblockable daze). And which recharge way faster with enraging charge. Compare it to Powerblock / Psych. Distraction and not even to mention the ever OPed hammer warriors, and stop bitching.

What's overpowered is also not the Edenial. It's the damage that comes with it. It's only another insane bar compression.. you get the edenial AND the required damage to make it dangerous all-in-one. But this powercreeping has been happening to all classes before.

The skills which are OPed are exactly:
-Mind Wrack
-Overload
-Keystone Signet (with the buffed signet interrupts)

Mind Wrack: Too high damage, too high duration. -1 Energy good idea, but added and increased damage and duration not.

Overload: Same issue, damage too high.

Keystone Signet: This is probably the saddest one. It makes it possible to play Mesmers as skill-less as rangers. Namely, you can spam all of your interrupts in a row at no cost and an insane recharge, while deactivating skills with them and doing damage. Just like rangers. Lol.
But then again, rangers have been OP since years and nothing's happened. It's just a disgrace to the mesmerhood to see them becoming as simple to play as rangers. It promotes a playstyle that goes as this "I spam an interrupt at random all the time on target, cause my ping is too high to hit it on reaction, and they cost nothing and recharge immediately, and I counter the random triggering of fast cast weapon sets by random interrupting.. oh and btw I also do damage and spread poison" -> very bad, first random dshot to hit on a keyskill in a crucial moment decides matches. Same goes for dchop and all those spammable interrupts. Now those signet mesmers too...? Yuck.

Overall it's sad to see interrupts getting buffed even more. Considering the increasing amount of bots, especially, but also in general. Interrupts reward low ping and close servers. A bot beats a human at them anytime easily, enuff said about the skill required. Fastcast weapon sets should be nerfed, but only if interrupts get considerably toned down at the same time. What do they do? They nerf fastcast, but not fastcast weapon sets and buff interrupts.. yea.. great.

Edenial is a very good thing. It should become more rewarding again and become a good alternative to interrupting. It just shouldn't compress the damage required to make it dangerous into the same bar as well. But the same goes for interrupts, in that matter, rangers and hammer warriors are even more overly powerful in a similar fashion (disruption + necessary damage + best defense and survivability in the ranger's case). It's just that no one's ever done anything about it, and people got used to them it seems, which is why we arrived at slash /W with stances everywhere.

People are complaining about the mesmers now, don't forget that as a midline caster, if you don't carry an anti-skill on your bar like a stance, you can often go afk when a hammer warrior decides to chain-park / lineback on you, which is not okay at all too, actually even worse (and here some complain about PI, lol ever got a hammer war parking on you? To hell with the stance, if they got wild throw you even need dolyak signet or whatnot).

Finally, it is important to consider that in all updates, the offense has been buffed without ever adjusting the defense. Monks are simply overwhelmed by the sheer offensive powercreep. Not only did they not adjust it; they nerfed it. Probably cause some attackers from the Test Krewe and in general were crying again from not having decent babysitters (if you blind one they stop playing and start crying cause they got dirt in their eye; dirty attackers don't play well => no babysitting mid/backline to change diapers = skills got to be nerfed).

That's about all, really.

Corporeal Ghost · May 25, 2010, 08:28 PM // 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

The problem (among others) is this is the only build that can do that, which is why everyone is running 2-3 mesmers. Are we going to now power creep everything else to match mind wrack? Even if you really wanted this result, nerfing backline is the sensible approach.

The "do X per mesmer skill" is just a flat-out elite worthy mechanic. Your entire bar warps to proc it as much as possible, balancing it down to a manageable level will simply make it unremarkable/unexciting. If we really want that kind of potential effect in PvP, they should rework power flux into it. This effect on mind wrack either has to be go or set with a limited number of procs (1 or 2)

I don't disagree on any particular point. I'm just saying that this metagame appears to me to be much closer to something desirable than anything since Eye of the North released if not longer. Just because it isn't the exact optimal metagame doesn't diminish that. The ESurge bars are not as overpowered as everyone would have us believe. They're not as one-dimensional as everyone would have us believe. They're just really, really good at crapping all over people stuck in last year's metagame, and they happen to perform that function best by just spamming on one monk.

But once again, I agree, Mind Wrack is a little over the top, especially when combined with Overload, and to a lesser extent, Wastrel's Worry. I think they could either take away the small damage packet entirely or increase the recharge to 10-12 seconds. I think taking the small damage packet away (but probably leaving the -1 ticks) is a much better solution.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

The "do X per mesmer skill" is just a flat-out elite worthy mechanic.

I'll do you one better. I don't think that mechanic should be in the game at all. Adding damage packets to anything has historically been problematic. Orders, Zealot's Fire, Conjures, Soul Barbs, Mirror of Ice were all overpowered and nerfed at one point or another, and I've probably missed a few.

I think it's good that skill combos and synergies exist. But what ANet really needs to be careful with is skills that essentially modify how other skills work. That is, Sever-->Gash is an obvious combo. Deep Wound-->Prot Strike has good synergy because of Deep Wound mechanics, but neither of these skills actually modify how the other works, as something like Oath Shot or Mirror of Ice does, and those skills are historically where most of the broken builds come from.

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

it doesnt change the fact that it punishes your weapon swapping

Yes it does. I'm not sure if we're having a language problem or what here. The only way I can think of to describe this is that you have to think of the damage as a sunk cost. Once Mind Wrack is on you, you've effectively already taken the damage (unless you plan to remove it, but this is almost never the case for me). The difference, then, is the damage he's going to do with you between the time you could have blown it yourself and the time he blows it up for you. You're ALWAYS going to take the 95. Your point of view sounds to me like "Warriors punish incorrect weapon swapping because you still take damage in a shield set." Yes, you still take the damage even though you swapped correctly, but you take LESS. Hence, you are not punished by any meaningful definition of the word.

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

dont compare it with 15 e 2 s cast time lightning orb

Seemed like a valid comparison. Would you prefer Immolate? I think the numbers are comparable there as well. The energy is irrelevant. Eles can't even almost run out of energy anymore unless they're playing self-made utility-heavy bars of the variety you won't see in RA. The cast time is also pretty irrelevant in a format with no spikes to telegraph and very few interrupts, especially given how low priority a random Lightning Orb should be.

The point, though, was that the damage alone isn't backbreaking. It's comparable to a Mind Blast, and probably a bit lower than a few other ele bars you could make that aren't as good. The difference is the bar has incredible utility at the same time. About 95% of people choose to use this utility directly on the opposing monk, always, regardless of whether it's the right play or not. And given the response of the community at large, this tactic seems pretty effective, at least until people remember how to play against it--and there is certainly more than swapping weapons involved. In RA, it's going to dominate for months if it's unnerfed, simply because your average RA monk has no idea what he's doing, but this is true of any powerful build that has a relatively high minimum effectiveness.

kedde · May 25, 2010, 10:30 PM // 22:30

I've played close to a dozen matches against this type of build ranging from 2-4 esurge mesmers, both on ladder and in AT's, and I've yet to find it anywhere near as problematic as people make it out to be.

Yes, of course it's a bit overpowered, that's a given but people forget that stuff is supposed to die.

Hell, I find the endless streams of diversion/shame to be more annoying and problematic personally since they'll eventually catch word/rc/ls whatever.

Krill · May 25, 2010, 10:32 PM // 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

I'll do you one better. I don't think that mechanic should be in the game at all. Adding damage packets to anything has historically been problematic. Orders, Zealot's Fire, Conjures, Soul Barbs, Mirror of Ice were all overpowered and nerfed at one point or another, and I've probably missed a few.

You're absolutely right that this is reminiscent of the old SBRI business, except mind wrack is a pressure skill. It's a terrible game mechanic. Then again we're talking about anet here, learning from past mistakes is absolutely not acceptable.

Desperado Doomtooth · May 25, 2010, 11:15 PM // 23:15

PnH seem to work fine also pre veiling works as well ran that in ra getting 15 win streak yes mesmer camped on me some of the mesmer so stupid didn't even re cast mind wrack on me and and overload spammed me with overload and wastrels demise with on there own do pathetic dmg. The real skill that this mind wrack combine even more well with is ether phantom and drain delusions thous 3 spells coupled with overload and wastrels demise degen make for fast energy denile build with deadly dmg lost at 16 rounds when the hammer war decided to camp me along with one of thees mes that ended mind wrack and recasting it over effectively eliminating all my energy.

If you know what your doing and keep your cool veiling and using PnH u should be able to hold your own a good while in ra sense most of the mesmer tend to just use the build as if they were a assassin

Kaon · May 25, 2010, 11:59 PM // 23:59

Here's a little hint to help everyone: Mesmers die. Quickly.

Just bring on some warriors and crack their skulls. It's fun, cool, and efficient.

Lord Henter · May 26, 2010, 05:26 AM // 05:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Animate

Let's delete all classes altogether!

Why are people complaining about PI, lol.
Before the update it was so underpowered compared to PB and PD that no one ever took it but me. I often wished it would be more rewarding to interrupt something with it than a simple knockdown. It's nowhere near as overpowered as hammer warriors have been since years. They got like up to FOUR 3 second knock downs on their bar, which they use on you IN A ROW. Lol. And which do not need to interrupt something to work. And which also deal damage and deep wounds in the process (until recently, when Anet decided to also give them unblockable daze). And which recharge way faster with enraging charge. Compare it to Powerblock / Psych. Distraction and not even to mention the ever OPed hammer warriors, and stop bitching.

What's overpowered is also not the Edenial. It's the damage that comes with it. It's only another insane bar compression.. you get the edenial AND the required damage to make it dangerous all-in-one. But this powercreeping has been happening to all classes before.

The skills which are OPed are exactly:
-Mind Wrack
-Overload
-Keystone Signet (with the buffed signet interrupts)

Mind Wrack: Too high damage, too high duration. -1 Energy good idea, but added and increased damage and duration not.

Overload: Same issue, damage too high.

Keystone Signet: This is probably the saddest one. It makes it possible to play Mesmers as skill-less as rangers. Namely, you can spam all of your interrupts in a row at no cost and an insane recharge, while deactivating skills with them and doing damage. Just like rangers. Lol.
But then again, rangers have been OP since years and nothing's happened. It's just a disgrace to the mesmerhood to see them becoming as simple to play as rangers. It promotes a playstyle that goes as this "I spam an interrupt at random all the time on target, cause my ping is too high to hit it on reaction, and they cost nothing and recharge immediately, and I counter the random triggering of fast cast weapon sets by random interrupting.. oh and btw I also do damage and spread poison" -> very bad, first random dshot to hit on a keyskill in a crucial moment decides matches. Same goes for dchop and all those spammable interrupts. Now those signet mesmers too...? Yuck.

Overall it's sad to see interrupts getting buffed even more. Considering the increasing amount of bots, especially, but also in general. Interrupts reward low ping and close servers. A bot beats a human at them anytime easily, enuff said about the skill required. Fastcast weapon sets should be nerfed, but only if interrupts get considerably toned down at the same time. What do they do? They nerf fastcast, but not fastcast weapon sets and buff interrupts.. yea.. great.

Edenial is a very good thing. It should become more rewarding again and become a good alternative to interrupting. It just shouldn't compress the damage required to make it dangerous into the same bar as well. But the same goes for interrupts, in that matter, rangers and hammer warriors are even more overly powerful in a similar fashion (disruption + necessary damage + best defense and survivability in the ranger's case). It's just that no one's ever done anything about it, and people got used to them it seems, which is why we arrived at slash /W with stances everywhere.

People are complaining about the mesmers now, don't forget that as a midline caster, if you don't carry an anti-skill on your bar like a stance, you can often go afk when a hammer warrior decides to chain-park / lineback on you, which is not okay at all too, actually even worse (and here some complain about PI, lol ever got a hammer war parking on you? To hell with the stance, if they got wild throw you even need dolyak signet or whatnot).

Finally, it is important to consider that in all updates, the offense has been buffed without ever adjusting the defense. Monks are simply overwhelmed by the sheer offensive powercreep. Not only did they not adjust it; they nerfed it. Probably cause some attackers from the Test Krewe and in general were crying again from not having decent babysitters (if you blind one they stop playing and start crying cause they got dirt in their eye; dirty attackers don't play well => no babysitting mid/backline to change diapers = skills got to be nerfed).

That's about all, really.

I have to agree with your overpowered list. A majority of the complaints seem to be about Mindwrack yet people complain that the whole update drastically increased the damage a mesmer can put out. Change mindwrack, remove either the energy drain per skill or the damage and leave it be and voila the overpowered spammer builds are dead. On the whole I applaud the test krewe, the changes to Psychic Instability, Crippling Anguish, and many other skills are fair in both PVE and PVP. Don't let one skill ruin your whole perception of the update. Sure, there will be bot abuse with several skills but when isn't there? If a skill is overpowered in the hands of a bot does that mean it ought to be nerfed even though its balanced in the hands of players?

urania · May 26, 2010, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

Yes it does. I'm not sure if we're having a language problem or what here. The only way I can think of to describe this is that you have to think of the damage as a sunk cost. Once Mind Wrack is on you, you've effectively already taken the damage (unless you plan to remove it, but this is almost never the case for me). The difference, then, is the damage he's going to do with you between the time you could have blown it yourself and the time he blows it up for you. You're ALWAYS going to take the 95. Your point of view sounds to me like "Warriors punish incorrect weapon swapping because you still take damage in a shield set." Yes, you still take the damage even though you swapped correctly, but you take LESS. Hence, you are not punished by any meaningful definition of the word.

no there is no language problem here.
i know what you mean, but that doesnt change the fact you can die to mere mind wreck and overload spam if you're consistently weapon swapping to low set. true, you'd suffer even more damage if you hadnt been weapon swapping, but given the absurd damage caused by mw alltogether can honestly kill you if there's also some meele with decent damage and deep wound bashing on you and thats just wrong.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

Seemed like a valid comparison. Would you prefer Immolate? I think the numbers are comparable there as well. The energy is irrelevant. Eles can't even almost run out of energy anymore unless they're playing self-made utility-heavy bars of the variety you won't see in RA. The cast time is also pretty irrelevant in a format with no spikes to telegraph and very few interrupts, especially given how low priority a random Lightning Orb should be.

comparing it to wastrels worry would be more valid. energy is relevant and so is cast time - there ARE quite a few players who play rupt classes and i wont even start with all the bots.
if mind wreck was 2 s cast time or would have 10 energy cost or 10-15 recharge itd already be far less broken.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

The point, though, was that the damage alone isn't backbreaking. It's comparable to a Mind Blast, and probably a bit lower than a few other ele bars you could make that aren't as good. The difference is the bar has incredible utility at the same time. About 95% of people choose to use this utility directly on the opposing monk, always, regardless of whether it's the right play or not. And given the response of the community at large, this tactic seems pretty effective, at least until people remember how to play against it--and there is certainly more than swapping weapons involved. In RA, it's going to dominate for months if it's unnerfed, simply because your average RA monk has no idea what he's doing, but this is true of any powerful build that has a relatively high minimum effectiveness.

first off, its armor ignoring damage so comparing it to any elemental or physical damage is a rather weak argument.
second off, you really, honestly and truly die to mere wind wreck spam coupled with something else, usually its overload and something else bashing on you - the skill input required is not far from 0 to achieve a fairly good effect. but i suppose its pointless to argue about the skill level of the game atm anyway. at least itll make nabs feel good about themselves, if nothing else.

Terrible Surgeon · May 26, 2010, 09:42 AM // 09:42

Mesmers are masters of illusion and control, subverting the enemy’s Energy for their own use, and that of their allies. Combined with any other profession, their skills provide excellent support, turning enemies’ powers against them and changing the very fabric of reality to hinder foes and help allies. Mesmers have the ability to cast spells quickly, which can make all the difference in the heat of battle. Their powers of domination allow them to take control of enemy skills and Energy. Their unique illusionary talents can slow or even halt enemy movement and skill casting, or cause imaginary illnesses that drain Health and Energy from foes while healing and energizing allies. While Mesmers are not known for brute strength, their ability to confuse, distract, and drain the enemy’s resources more than compensates.

— The Guild Wars Manuscripts

Ok, so mesmers should be for support in a teams design according to this description given by guild wars. What is currently in the game is not support.

This MindWrack-esurge-overload build being used is the biggest ROLL FACE ON KEYBOARD build ever conceived. It is worse than any sin bar ever and they are the ones that usually set the bar for a roll face on keyboard build......

nuff said?

Corporeal Ghost · May 27, 2010, 01:54 AM // 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrible Surgeon

This MindWrack-esurge-overload build being used is the biggest ROLL FACE ON KEYBOARD build ever conceived. It is worse than any sin bar ever and they are the ones that usually set the bar for a roll face on keyboard build......

nuff said?

After screwing around with Mind Wrack for a few hours as well as playing monk against random baddies running it, I can safely tell you that the bar's efficiency increases dramatically when someone who knows what they're doing runs it. This is actually a desirable state. The problem, then, is that the minimum efficiency is too high, which is usually a numbers, rather than mechanical, problem.

Karla, we've either got a much larger communication issue than I first suspected, or you're just willfully ignoring my point.

muhahaha · May 27, 2010, 04:02 AM // 04:02

Let me go on my shield set for +60 health.

Owait...

Extremely frustrating that mind wrack is promoting the 1234567 roll on keyboard style. I've seen mesmers who can passive hexspam all game no problem, and completely fail to interrupt me efficiently when they play power block or whatever.

edit: forgot to mention, this mes has NOTHING on the original SP sin. That was the true roll face on keyboard build... just that it is worse than anything for the past couple of years.

urania · May 27, 2010, 08:34 AM // 08:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

After screwing around with Mind Wrack for a few hours as well as playing monk against random baddies running it, I can safely tell you that the bar's efficiency increases dramatically when someone who knows what they're doing runs it. This is actually a desirable state. The problem, then, is that the minimum efficiency is too high, which is usually a numbers, rather than mechanical, problem.

Karla, we've either got a much larger communication issue than I first suspected, or you're just willfully ignoring my point.

the part i emphasyzed is my point, pretty much. seems the issue is just on your part.

superraptors · May 27, 2010, 08:36 AM // 08:36

e denial is over the top + damage needs a tone down, not even negative set will save u in this case, the 2 x esurge is an instant 160 dmg aoe follow up with spiritual pain + overload + 1 deep wound ur gone

Killed u man · May 27, 2010, 10:44 AM // 10:44

I think the spike capabilities are fine. I mean, they're not completely balanced, but it's not like they completely outclass other options. (Paragons will still do faster spikes with about equal dmg, they just dont have the utility)

The problem is the bar compression Mind Wrack gives. That skill alone makes the mesmer dish out well over 2000-3000 dmg a minute (if played right). That's ignoring the fact it also denials energy, and next to non-interruptable.

But I wouldn't smiter's boon it, nor nerf it out of the meta.

I would reduce the damage on Mind Wrack (PvP) when target foe reaches 0 energy to 5...40 and give the skill a 7 second recharge.

That would be a good start, and we can go from there.

kedde · May 27, 2010, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Borat, Mindwrack already is at 7 sec recharge.