Curse

Shuuda · May 24, 2008, 08:11 AM // 08:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by tehshadowninjar

I got about three e-denial mesmers myself.

[ether lord][ether phantom][drain delusions][feedback][ether feast][energy drain][arcane echo][resurrection signet]
This is better than the second one, because it's better e-denial, but the other one has better healing and is just more fun to play with, since any casters get no energy regen (bonders have -4 degen XD) and anything else will have -1 energy degen or less

Basically, to use this, Arcane Echo => Ether Feast. This gives you 300 healing every 8 seconds. Also adds better e-denial. That's 6 energy, take Ether Phantom => Drain Delusions, which is about 8 energy gone. Wait until Energy Drain is charged, then Ether Lord => Energy Drain. This usually puts any caster at half energy, considering he's used no spells. Then he's at 1/4

On average. Another way for good energy return and good denial is Arcane Echo => Ether Lord then Ether Lord someone else. If you don't get Ether Lord removed too fast, you get 30+ energy in 10 seconds, along with having 18 more energy from Energy Drain

[signet of illusions][ether phantom][ether lord][ether signet][malaise][hexer's vigor][conjure phantasm][resurrection signet]
I just felt like making a SoL build.

Anyways, this gives 0 energy regen to all casters and anything below that is funny.

SoL on Malaise and hexer's vigor is a MUST. I know HV and SoL isn't a good combo, but eh.

So use Ether Phantom, Malaise, Conjure Phantasm, Ether Lord, then IMMEDIATELTY Ether Signet. Since the lower your Inspiration Magic, the low the time you have to gain 20 energy back. (20 energy because of affect and the regen)

You do realise that a Mesmer with just Power Leak and Shame on their bar could do a far more efficent and effect energy denial than the whole of them bars. In other words, your wasting an entire bar doing someting one or two skills could do far better. SET SAIL FOR FAIL.

ChillOutDude · May 24, 2008, 12:40 PM // 12:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by icedwhitemocha

my fav builds to run in ra

SO STRONG
[build prof=W/? str=9 ham=9 swo=12][Magehunter's Smash][Crushing Blow][Steelfang Slash][Sun and Moon Slash]["For Great Justice!"][Resurrection Signet][Enraging Charge][Frenzy][/build]

Frenzy on hammer bar is bad .

yum · May 24, 2008, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mourne

A good hex necro can seriously ruin your teams chances at ever winning a game. You definitely need both of the hex removals.

A good WoD necro= you lose. (assuming that both teams have monks and decent pressure )

tehshadowninjar · May 24, 2008, 10:29 PM // 22:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuuda

You do realise that a Mesmer with just Power Leak and Shame on their bar could do a far more efficent and effect energy denial than the whole of them bars. In other words, your wasting an entire bar doing someting one or two skills could do far better. SET SAIL FOR FAIL.

Part of it is for creativity, not a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing gimmick like every other mesmer runs. Kaythanks. And most mesmers don't have as much survivability as this one.

Also, it excels at e-denialing ANYTHING, whereas PL and Shame would only denial casters. I can denial wars, paras (especially the motivational ones), sins, anything. >_> And what happens if you want to denial a mesmer that has too much FC for you to interrupt? Taking down energy manually rather than falling back on chance is much better. You were only thinking of support, not offensive.

randomperson · May 24, 2008, 10:34 PM // 22:34

How is Pleak + shame gimmicky? Let alone more gimmicky than a whole bar devoted to edenial.

Riotgear · May 24, 2008, 10:50 PM // 22:50

If you really want to e-deny everybody, just bring the typical surge-n-burn bar. At least then you get 5 skill slots to use against people that are resistant to your single way of attempting to accomplish anything.

urania · May 26, 2008, 05:58 AM // 05:58

Actually, when it comes to pure e denial, insipration line can usually do a far better job than domination line, not only because of the amount of energy some of the swkills from there can remove, but also because they (at least the ones that arent useless) are normally only 1 sec cast making them harder to interrupt.

C2K · May 26, 2008, 04:21 PM // 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

Actually, when it comes to pure e denial, insipration line can usually do a far better job than domination line, not only because of the amount of energy some of the swkills from there can remove, but also because they (at least the ones that arent useless) are normally only 1 sec cast making them harder to interrupt.

I agree

[skill]Mantra of Recovery[/skill] + [skill]Ether Phantom[/skill] + [skill]Drain Delusions[/skill]

And if you really hate energy, you can use [skill]Ether Lord[/skill], the only hex in the game that gives -3 energy degen.

JR · May 26, 2008, 07:39 PM // 19:39

The problem with inspiration based edenial is that it does absolutely 0 damage. You are pushing you character into a nishe role where it does nothing but make blue bars go down. A dom mesmer brings edenial, damage and harder shutdown.

urania · May 27, 2008, 09:26 AM // 09:26

That is why I said that in terms of PURE E DENIAL - ie no doomage, but quickly draining the monk down when they dont expect it - insp magic is the best.

Moverover, its far harder to interrupt a 1 sec fastcasted insp magic spell as a 2 sec fastcasted domi e denial (and omg doomage!) spell. In terms of pure shutdown a dom mesmer will obviously always be better. And for that one doesnt even need e denial spells.

@CK2, e drain (when it drains 9 energy) and ether phantom+drain delusions is far better.

GourangaPizza · May 27, 2008, 09:54 AM // 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

If you really want to e-deny everybody, just bring the typical surge-n-burn bar. At least then you get 5 skill slots to use against people that are resistant to your single way of attempting to accomplish anything.

Why not Panic? Half of the times I RA'ed, I always go against dervishes and assassins who like to gank on the monk at the beginning of the match. 15s of 2 pip energy regeneration = them spamming their skills at 2 cycles the most.

Heck you could even slot in ether phantom or ether lord for energy stalemacy.

Riotgear · May 27, 2008, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by GourangaPizza

Why not Panic? Half of the times I RA'ed, I always go against dervishes and assassins who like to gank on the monk at the beginning of the match. 15s of 2 pip energy regeneration = them spamming their skills at 2 cycles the most.

Heck you could even slot in ether phantom or ether lord for energy stalemacy.

Mainly because of:

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR

The problem with inspiration based edenial is that it does absolutely 0 damage. You are pushing you character into a nishe role where it does nothing but make blue bars go down. A dom mesmer brings edenial, damage and harder shutdown.

Also because in RA, weapon swaps are pretty rare, so you're usually not getting the advantages of keeping someone at 2 pips with negative energy. Surge/Burn are flexible enough as energy denial and hurting things, combined with the other strengths of running a mixed Dom bar.

tehshadowninjar · May 30, 2008, 01:06 AM // 01:06

Riotgear, that's where you're wrong. My bar does a MUCH better job than 18 energy loss every 20 seconds, and that's if you don't get the half recharge off with your 40/40 set or the passive effect of 20% of any spell with a staff. And I'm not intent on hurting anyone.......if you would SEE that. If I can make a sin or a dervish not be able to do anything but auto-attack, it wins the battle. Which is exactly my point. I can also e-denial a monk better than most can. I've managed 90% of the time to combine Ether Phantom and Drain Delusions (that pre-chant with Holy Veil) to get that 5 energy off of them, then throwing on Ether Lord.

Riotgear · May 30, 2008, 02:12 AM // 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by tehshadowninjar

If I can make a sin or a dervish not be able to do anything but auto-attack, it wins the battle.

If you really believe this then why not just bring [skill]Spirit Shackles[/skill]?

Quote:

Which is exactly my point. I can also e-denial a monk better than most can.

Except you can still shit all over a monk with Surge/Burn/Diversion/Shatter/P-Leak while being able to deal with other types of threats without having to bottom their energy out. It's a lot more effective to be able to redirect your shutdown than being forced to latch on to one target for the entire game, especially if you have the option of doing that anyway.

DarkNecrid · May 30, 2008, 03:25 AM // 03:25

I know this is a lost cause since you're the same guy who thinks making Shadowsteps require line of sight and having 60 second recharges would completely kill PvP, but please note that you're contributing absolutely nada to the actual team besides blue bar downage. I actually have fought him (or maybe someone else) running the first bar he posted, and while it owned our monk for all of 10 seconds, we quickly took out the other 3 guys and then you're kind of boned. You can't do anything cept rez. There's nothing to even possibly kill someone if it's a close game, it's just....useless.

erk · May 30, 2008, 04:20 AM // 04:20

In RA's 4v4 there is not much room for midline, you either have to do damage or heal to put it very very simplistically, it's not GvG with it's 3-4 midline players where you can afford to have characters dedicated to interrupt, e-denial, whatever. You can't rely on the other 3 randomly chosen team mates filling in for you, just because you felt like running an exotic e-denial build. Being random, it will fall into place every now and then, but statistically you will be behind the curve and loose more often than other builds do.

Akaraxle · May 30, 2008, 07:09 AM // 07:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChillOutDude

Frenzy on hammer bar is bad .

Or it just means you've got a lot of guts!

GourangaPizza · May 30, 2008, 08:19 AM // 08:19

My point is Panic does a better job in e-denial; you affect not only the target but also its allies, hence buy your team some time to go either full offense or defense. But truly like everybody said earlier, interrupting and e-denial contributes little in RA or TA since each team could only consist of 4 people, which brings about very little creativity in strategy to win.

DutchSmurf · May 30, 2008, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by tehshadowninjar

And I'm not intent on hurting anyone.......if you would SEE that. If I can make a sin or a dervish not be able to do anything but auto-attack, it wins the battle. Which is exactly my point.

So basically your point is that you can turn a 4vs4 match into a 3vs3.5 match (the 0.5 because autoattacks still do something, while you don't). If you actually hurt someone while taking them out of the game, it would be useful. But since all you do is limiting them to autoattacks, it is completely useless.

TheHaxor · May 30, 2008, 12:40 PM // 12:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by DutchSmurf

So basically your point is that you can turn a 4vs4 match into a 3vs3.5 match (the 0.5 because autoattacks still do something, while you don't). If you actually hurt someone while taking them out of the game, it would be useful. But since all you do is limiting them to autoattacks, it is completely useless.

If we assume for a moment that what you said is correct (which it is not), then it all depends on whether your 3 can out damage their 3.5. It is more than possible.