Curse

whufc89 · Mar 23, 2008, 11:10 PM // 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

your N/Rt has 3 straight heals and WoR. thats a huge waste of your skillbar.

I wouldnt trust the bomber with PS, but i guess thats your call.

Weaker armor is totally useless.

and I would put SOLS back on those bars. the heroes are crazy with it.

and you just remade sabway. i thought the point of this thread was to make a different hero team with some synergy.

No, the point of this thread was to get a decent hero lineup for me to use and at first I wasn't that knowledgeable about Sabway & seeing as everyone and their mother was using it I decided against it, but now I am more knowledgeable about it, so I decided to use a revised version of it. I mean what was I supposed to do, people just bring up Sabway this & Sabway that every few minutes I figured it must be a decent thing to use. It's not like I'm gonna go out & come back after 3 days with a whole new revolutionary hero synergyzing team lineup that beats sabway. All the ideas I would have had have probably been tried to death. I didn't like the original version so I changed it to suit my taste. It's taken me 3 days of solid reading on stuff to come up with these builds. I mean this thread is 5 pages long and I have other threads with different questions in relating to numerous things I had on my mind.

I've explained over & over WHY I took out SOLS. To me SOLS seems like a waste of a skill slot, because if you've got 10 minions running around exploding every few seconds plus enemies dying, you'll be getting sh*t loads of energy from SR, so what's the need for SOLS?

Also, why is weaken armor totally useless? It reduces the enemies armor by 20 therefore making it easier for the team to kill them, surely that's better than Rip Enchantment which is only against a single target. What's wrong with PS on the bomber aswell? Do you mean I should just not use it period or I should give it to a different hero?

whufc89 · Mar 23, 2008, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squishy ftw

She will use it exactly when you can use the relief of pressure on your party.

So she'll just use it & drop it again quick to give the whole team a heal?

Squishy ftw · Mar 23, 2008, 11:14 PM // 23:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by whufc89

So she'll just use it & drop it again quick to give the whole team a heal?

She'll drop it to heal the party and use it again to be ready for the next time the party needs a heal.

whufc89 · Mar 23, 2008, 11:25 PM // 23:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squishy ftw

She'll drop it to heal the party and use it again to be ready for the next time the party needs a heal.

So would you take out [skill]spirit transfer[/skill] or [skill]weapon of warding[/skill] for PWK?

Both of the above skills serve a great purpose so I'm not sure which to take out. ST gives a massive heal & the only condition is that it takes health from a spirit which is going to die soon anyway (Life). WOW gives +4 health regeneration & a 50% chance to block.

Antithesis · Mar 23, 2008, 11:27 PM // 23:27

Your approach is much more sound and you're dead on - understanding why Sab's works is more important than using the builds verbatim. I usually rework the bars a bit myself, but the underlying framework is really solid and it is just a modified Sabway

I wouldn't drop PWK, it works properly on a hero (they use it better than i do) - the wiki is a less reliable resource than the folk around these parts. Drop WoW on the N/Rt for PWK. Heal-over-time is meh and you've got Aegis on the MM for blocks. You could (probably should) swap Rez Sig for Guardian for the on-demand 50% block.

I don't think the Curses Nec has the energy to spam Channels and the bar is inferior to Sab's (synergy between RH and SS), but whatever floats your boat.

I'd leave SoLS in because it can be the difference between keeping on top of your energy and losing a tough fight. Sh*t isn't always blowing up.

whufc89 · Mar 23, 2008, 11:35 PM // 23:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

Your approach is much more sound and you're dead on - understanding why Sab's works is more important than using the builds verbatim. I usually rework the bars a bit myself, but the underlying framework is really solid.

I wouldn't drop PWK, it works properly on a hero (they use it better than i do) - the wiki is a less reliable resource than the folk around these parts. Drop WoW on the N/Rt for PWK. You've got Aegis on the MM and you could swap Rez Sig for Guardian for the on-demand 50% block.

I don't think the Curses Nec has the energy to spam Channels, but whatever floats your boat.

I'd leave SoLS in because it can be the difference between keeping on top of your energy and losing a tough fight. Sh*t isn't always blowing up.

There's always somebody that points out things to me that I should have thought about in the first place (the Aegis instead of WOW comment), thanks

I'm glad you see where I'm coming from aswell.

Antithesis · Mar 23, 2008, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by whufc89

I'm glad you see where I'm coming from aswell.

I was in your shoes myself a few months ago, it's only when i understood the how's and why's of using certain skills and conditions in HM that i realised my Hero builds sucked bigtime

Coloneh · Mar 24, 2008, 12:44 AM // 00:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by whufc89

I've explained over & over WHY I took out SOLS. To me SOLS seems like a waste of a skill slot, because if you've got 10 minions running around exploding every few seconds plus enemies dying, you'll be getting sh*t loads of energy from SR, so what's the need for SOLS?

Also, why is weaken armor totally useless? It reduces the enemies armor by 20 therefore making it easier for the team to kill them, surely that's better than Rip Enchantment which is only against a single target. What's wrong with PS on the bomber aswell? Do you mean I should just not use it period or I should give it to a different hero?

shit isnt always blowing up. you wont always have 10 minions running around. energy management and healing is good.

weaken armor is useless because cracked armor is useless. lowering things towords 60 armor when most things already have 60 armor or close to it sucks. almost any other skill would be more helpful.

I wouldnt put PS on a hero because they are stupid. they put PS on anything that takes damage. they are so stupid that someone designed a build around the heroes putting PS on bone minions and using SV on creatures trying to kill them. (like a bunch of little 55s) and it worked well.

whufc89 · Mar 24, 2008, 12:51 AM // 00:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

shit isnt always blowing up. you wont always have 10 minions running around. energy management and healing is good

I see what you're saying now, I just took my party into HM Arborstone & the number 1 reason we kept dying was because the Necros were running out of energy extremely fast. I took your advice and put in SOLS & we managed to clear most of the area without a single death so far. Sorry for not listening in the first place

Quote:

weaken armor is useless because cracked armor is useless. lowering things towords 60 armor when most things already have 60 armor or close to it sucks. almost any other skill would be more helpful.

Oh, I never knew that. I always thought higher level enemies had higher armor, such as over 100 or something. Anyway, I took out Weaken Armor & replaced it with SOLS.

Quote:

I wouldnt put PS on a hero because they are stupid. they put PS on anything that takes damage. they are so stupid that someone designed a build around the heroes putting PS on bone minions and using SV on creatures trying to kill them. (like a bunch of little 55s) and it worked well.

haha wow. I replaced PS with SOLS now anyway

As I said, I should have listened to you in the first place.

DarkSpirit · Mar 24, 2008, 05:43 AM // 05:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

weaken armor is useless because cracked armor is useless. lowering things towords 60 armor when most things already have 60 armor or close to it sucks. almost any other skill would be more helpful.

Cracked armor is useless? Where do you get the info that most PvE monsters only have 60 armor?

Coloneh · Mar 24, 2008, 06:22 AM // 06:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by whufc89

Sorry for not listening in the first place

I like you
=]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Cracked armor is useless? Where do you get the info that most PvE monsters only have 60 armor?

maybe not most, but enough.

blue.rellik · Mar 24, 2008, 06:56 AM // 06:56

What? Most enemies in PvE that might even cause any problems are the lvl 24+ enemies and they certainly have more armour than their profession would state. Weaken Armour becomes much much better in HM where nearly everything you fight has the armour of a paragon or warrior or something

DarkSpirit · Mar 24, 2008, 07:33 AM // 07:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue.rellik

What? Most enemies in PvE that might even cause any problems are the lvl 24+ enemies and they certainly have more armour than their profession would state. Weaken Armour becomes much much better in HM where nearly everything you fight has the armour of a paragon or warrior or something

QFT

Cracked armor makes a huge difference in the time it takes to kill monsters in late game areas. Especially if you have a nuker, that difference IS significant.

Coloneh, which monsters do you know, have only 60 armor?

Sab · Mar 24, 2008, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

I wouldnt put PS on a hero because they are stupid. they put PS on anything that takes damage. they are so stupid that someone designed a build around the heroes putting PS on bone minions and using SV on creatures trying to kill them. (like a bunch of little 55s) and it worked well.

I'm pretty sure the AI prioritizes party members above allies when they use heals or prots - they only cast on minions if all party members are at full health.

While heroes aren't particularly good with prots, Necros usually have enough energy to spam Prot Spirit on recharge. I don't really care as long as I get to micro PS, which is pretty useful in HM.

Super Igor · Mar 29, 2008, 12:15 PM // 12:15

Healing minions ftw, I like it, and heroes never prioritise, pffft, allyes over teammates and also, yesturday Ive made a 4 win streak agianst uber 1337 teams (Koreans, Paraspike, rainbowspike, last resort) as a Sway and we had a Healer Hench all that time! Now u dont tell me hero AI sucks. :P

~Super Igor

~