Curse

Carboplatin · Nov 23, 2009, 02:30 PM // 14:30

Nice to see people putting together "balanced" again.

I think 1 perma in a party is acceptable to make the trip faster. Lets hope this picks up steam and become the new "meta"

edit

earthbind makes everything KD-able

Improvavel · Nov 23, 2009, 03:24 PM // 15:24

Actually if you use ER healers, a physical team and some spirits can do it pretty easily without a SF tank.

GDW + Earthbind = stay on ur ass Dhuum.

So warriors aren't out.

Shayne Hawke · Nov 23, 2009, 03:36 PM // 15:36

Huh, I don't know why I didn't notice GDW in there. Maybe I mistook it for BUH!.

IronSheik · Nov 23, 2009, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Here's my way.

Been clearing NM with ease with PuGs.
HM with ease with friends.

Threw it together really fast, not exact.

If bringing all scythes, can drop orders and have all of them bring AoHM, then you have an optional slot, most likely RoJ/SoH

chullster · Nov 23, 2009, 04:14 PM // 16:14

Just thought I'd post the only picture I have of us last night, it was a good team, lots of damage, defence and excellent monks.

BTW Necro Ecro, did you get the monk builds direct from the players? or did you sort of fill in the blanks, like you did with mine?

Just curious, because I never saw the skeles get the party below 75% of health all game.

CoonerTheRed · Nov 23, 2009, 04:31 PM // 16:31

how are these balanced groups with no tank splitting to do horsemen? I've always seen it with at least one perma/terra tank to deal with one side while the team deals with the other.

jonnieboi05 · Nov 23, 2009, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Look interesting. I'd agree with this though.

Nerf Me Haha · Nov 23, 2009, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Looks very nice, but I think you could change the HB for something else,maybe with some defensive abilitys(PD mes?) along with offense (Splinter Weapon? not sure if GDW is needed on all non-caster dmg dealers outside of Dhuum's room) and maybe a different hard res (1 copy of Pact is a must imo),and change the UA bar to heal/prot hybrid .

Coolpb · Nov 23, 2009, 05:39 PM // 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoonerTheRed

how are these balanced groups with no tank splitting to do horsemen? I've always seen it with at least one perma/terra tank to deal with one side while the team deals with the other.

This is pretty much why a perma is needed for now. Until some hard testing(And by hard I mean wasting some cons so people can actually get out there) of a multitude of different team setups, 4H is one of the spots that's it's nearly required to bring a Perma, if not a Perma Sliver at least.

As in my earlier post, we'll be bringing one, and only one, with us to drastically speed up the entire line of quests. He's super smart and know's UW, and all recent changes to UW, like the back of his hand.

The actual team set up is variable IMO. Healers, Dmg, a Spirit Rit that can bring Earthbind. The whole idea we have is to include anybody that can go. ER Healing eles/Monks. Barrage Rangers. W/e.

It's balanced-way not Sinway, Mobway, or META-way. I for one am glad.

EDIT: It WILL be necessary to figure out a team build that can handle 4H. With the announcement that something is happening to SF we cannot rely on it forever.

Another Felldspar · Nov 23, 2009, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Thanks much for the maps especially -- we can work out a balanced guild group to go, but having the maps and the guide is very helpful. You could also help out the official wiki quite a bit by putting your Pits map up. The one that was there was wrong and someone has taken it down.

ElnoreVarda · Nov 23, 2009, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Regarding the 4hmen, for the lasting facking time:

A SoS rit can solo one side in NM, and buy the other team around enough time to clear all/most of the foes on the other side before running to help him. With ER eles you can hold by reaper, just heal and prot him.

I bet alot of builds can hold one side during 4hmen, and since you can fight dhuum in spirit form, its no problem to bring a dedicated build for just holding a side during 4hmen.

regarding the ERs: drop mindbender, its not necessary. Add LA on one ER. If you use an essence you dont need glyph. Bring PS in case of stripping.

Coolpb · Nov 23, 2009, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElnoreVarda

Regarding the 4hmen, for the lasting facking time:

A SoS rit can solo one side in NM, and buy the other team around enough time to clear all/most of the foes on the other side before running to help him.

I just don't see how a single SoS Rit can hold an entire side long enough for the other team to finish their side. Terrors are nukers, spirits don't have brains to move out of AoE. I don't see this happening w/o a party wipe.

Arrogant Bastard · Nov 23, 2009, 07:16 PM // 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coolpb

I just don't see how a single SoS Rit can hold an entire side long enough for the other team to finish their side. Terrors are nukers, spirits don't have brains to move out of AoE. I don't see this happening w/o a party wipe.

2 hr run w/o permas in HM.

Rit can tank for 30-60 secs allowing the other side to kill a good amount. Then everyone goes back to reaper and kills both sides whilst ER eles heal/proto the reaper.

Using ER eles, the only real way to fail at 4H is if infuse/er are diverted/interrupted.

Mobway is much easier though.

Pre Ranger Mg · Nov 23, 2009, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Agreed with Coopb on this one, the fact that the first wave of terrors alone will kill the spirits and then gank the rit followed by the reaper, there is no way he can hold it long enough for the main team to kill the other side.

And as the perma for Coolpb's group i was done with Wastes popped and clearing enemies for quest, Plains popped skeles killed on either side, and aggro made for pools side of 4h which i solo'ed, mnts popped (woulda done quest but didn't want the main team waiting for me if it took longer then expected), and pools popped and quest done at 41mins. So UNTIL Shadow form gets nerfed, perma sliver tank with knowledge of the underworld is extremely necessary of speeding up the run by at least 45mins to 1hour.

thedukesd · Nov 23, 2009, 07:39 PM // 19:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronSheik

Here's my way.

Been clearing NM with ease with PuGs.
HM with ease with friends.

Threw it together really fast, not exact.

If bringing all scythes, can drop orders and have all of them bring AoHM, then you have an optional slot, most likely RoJ/SoH

How about replacing the A/D with A/Mo:

Xenomortis · Nov 23, 2009, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pre Ranger Mg

Agreed with Coopb on this one, the fact that the first wave of terrors alone will kill the spirits and then gank the rit followed by the reaper, there is no way he can hold it long enough for the main team to kill the other side.

I would love to know then, how our Rit managed to do it. Clearly it's impossible!

The 7 others need to be quick and ready to collapse back onto the Reaper, but seriously, all the rit needs to do is delay one side long enough for the remaining players to crush the other.

The rit needs to fall back steadily and use Summon Spirits.
They need to be fairly good at their job though, but it's possible, trust me.

You shouldn't actually need to kill them all either. If you manage to kill one of the horsemen and a few dryders that should be enough to make falling back and holding at the reaper possible, but it's more tense and I wouldn't recommend it.
With ER Eles only the Horsemen pose a threat, the dryders are trivial and you can heal off the skele's damage.

Coolpb · Nov 23, 2009, 07:47 PM // 19:47

I'm not sure why the Assassin wouldn't go /W and Bring another SY. And since the Ranger is already /Rit why not bring Splinter? Seems fairly obvious...

Xenomortis · Nov 23, 2009, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coolpb

I'm not sure why the Assassin wouldn't go /W and Bring another SY. And since the Ranger is already /Rit why not bring Splinter? Seems fairly obvious...

GDW + Barrage > Splinter + Barrage.
But the Derv and Sin don't have AoHM. AoHM boosts damage more than Orders.

I still suggest AP-MoP though, especially if you run dagger sins. Dagger sins work great under GDW and Earthbind too - especially against Dhuum.

Coolpb · Nov 23, 2009, 08:00 PM // 20:00

Personally I'd rather see another Ele With Unsteady, Eruption, Chruning earth and wards rather than a MoP. Extra KD + Blind + Wards > MoP

Xenomortis · Nov 23, 2009, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coolpb

Personally I'd rather see another Ele With Unsteady, Eruption, Chruning earth and wards rather than a MoP. Extra KD + Blind + Wards > MoP

Things are already being knocked down left, right and centre due to GDW on Barrage and the scythes. You have 2 ER Eles with Prot Bond... you really don't need any more protection than that.
The physicals are the least threatening things in the UW, so Blind isn't too useful and the Wards won't add anything else.
The damage MoP churns out makes killing stuff on the splits much faster and easier.