Curse

Vann Borakul · Aug 18, 2008, 02:06 AM // 02:06

I've always liked that Assassin's Promise Nuker build. Very good build. Well today when I went to vanquish some zones, I decided to try and modify the build. I brought Finish Him and Intensity. Now while using the build, I realized the extremely awesome combo of Assassin's Promise + Finish Him. You can literally go back and forth between the 2 skills and destroy a ton of enemies in a short time. And the energy gain cancels out the cost so it's like you're not casting anything. Except when you use extra damage skills so you can use Finish Him.

It still retains the Meteor Shower concept, just not as much as the normal build would use it. It serves the function of getting a number of enemies health down. Depending on the situation, you can use the quick-kill for more MS or to start your death chain. It's almost like you're 'deleting' the enemy because they just... die suddenly. The build can both spike and do massive damage so you are allowed to 'freelance', making decisions based on the situation. I find it to be very fun because you're not following dim guidelines for skill usage. I actually can't wait to start another vanquish using it. By Ural's Hammer strengthens up the 2 fire skills and the 2 shouts as well, making the shouts both do 100 armor-ignoring damage.

There is probably some room for improvement. I can't decide on which energy management system to use, so it has 2 versions. Maybe it will be down to preference or maybe, with further testing, one will be deemed more effective. Give the build a serious try, and tell me what you think. You will need to get the hang of it, especially if you never used the normal AP Nuker build. I think I found the build I'll be using to finish vanquishing most zones.

Edit: This is the updated build I use now. Glowing Gaze is annoying to use and BUH isn't worth it. Fire Attunement is better for dropping Meteors. EVAS is always useful and it helps alot with spiking. GoLE lets you spam EVAS to your heart's content without killing your energy.

[build=OgdToYG6VKm0mEZAXAYQZYBaXEA]

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(note that the description for "By Ural's Hammer!" is outdated)
[build=OgdToYG6VKm0mEXopBYQZYBKVEA]

[build=OgdToYG6VKm0mcsiBEYQZYBKVEA]

daze · Aug 20, 2008, 12:24 AM // 00:24

very nice, i will have to give it a try. I enjoy using AP nuke. but [[deaths charge] is one of the main things i like about it, but on the other hand this one is not point blank so it may be better for my squishy ass

hoyce · Aug 20, 2008, 12:20 PM // 12:20

Sounds good, but wont Meteor Shower exhaust you too much after a while? If I remember correctly exhaustion prevents you from gaining energy that has been exhausted...still good nontheless.

Vann Borakul · Aug 20, 2008, 06:04 PM // 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoyce

Sounds good, but wont Meteor Shower exhaust you too much after a while? If I remember correctly exhaustion prevents you from gaining energy that has been exhausted...still good nontheless.

I've already vanquished 6 zones with it and I never became too exhausted. I haven't really used it any more than 3 times in one battle. Oftentimes only once. You're pretty much playing 2 bars in one bar.

I think I favor GoI and GG over FA and LF.

Bobby2 · Aug 20, 2008, 11:29 PM // 23:29

[[Assassin's Promise] + [[Finish Him!] is pure leetsauce. Though I've never been wild about BUH!, I won't argue with any Shouts in your bar. Since you can't pack [[Save Yourselves!], [[Shadow Sanctuary] would suit you well as an alternative PvE skill.

But srsly, [[Maelstrom] pwns [[Meteor Shower] in HM, and for melee baddies you can have [[Ward against melee] and /laugh. Fire damage sucks in relation to what melees can dish out - so leave it to them. Trust me, your H/H's are way better at getting foes down to [[Finish Him]-range.

I know it's a big switch, but elemental damage not being AL-ignoring screws nukers over in HM big-time.

Sacratus Ignis · Aug 21, 2008, 12:55 AM // 00:55

haha yes, this is an amazing build... i've been using it for high end pve since EoTN came out.

I'd suggest throwing ebon vanguard sin in there - especially for dungeons and harder vanqs, you can have 3-4 sins at once soaking up damage while f'ing up casters. And to be honest, don't need energy management beyond AP, which returns 15e each foe you kill. Throw BR on a hero if you want.

I usually go fire attune, glyph sac +MS (at start of fight, more if uber hard group), YMLAD, Finish, Vanguard sin, AP, and then one skill which i sub depending on situation. IUsually a cheap AoE likre breath of fire works wonders.

Vann Borakul · Aug 25, 2008, 09:58 PM // 21:58

I was thinking about the Vanguard Assassin for a bit, but figured it wouldn't be worth it. I tried it a bit and I guess it works out. I've only vanquished one area with it, so I'll play with it a little more. This is what I'm currently using.

[build=OgdToYG6VKm0mEZAXAYQZYBaXEA]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

Since you can't pack [[Save Yourselves!], [[Shadow Sanctuary] would suit you well as an alternative PvE skill.

But srsly, [[Maelstrom] pwns [[Meteor Shower] in HM, and for melee baddies you can have [[Ward against melee] and /laugh.

Fire damage sucks in relation to what melees can dish out - so leave it to them.

I know it's a big switch, but elemental damage not being AL-ignoring screws nukers over in HM big-time.

All 4 of those make no sense at all.

MisterT69 · Aug 25, 2008, 11:18 PM // 23:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoyce

Sounds good, but wont Meteor Shower exhaust you too much after a while? If I remember correctly exhaustion prevents you from gaining energy that has been exhausted...still good nontheless.

You'd assume it'd be a big problem but no. One time I was vanquishing or doing a dungeon (can't remember which) and I unloaded 5 MS's on a grp and it brought my energy down to like 30 cuz of the exhaustion. They were stone summit so of course they kept coming back ><. Fun to do tho if you want to put yourself out of the game for a few secs lol.

Dru Stratas · Aug 26, 2008, 01:14 AM // 01:14

Yup, it's good, however I would suggest taking another PvE skill instead of "By Urals Hammer!". Sniper Support is cool. I've been running something similar to this, with some more utility to it, for general PvE.
Also, I'd agree with the point of over-exhaustion with MS, I'd drop fire completely for some earth or water (burred vision/steam).
But yeah, it's a good build

Ditto · Aug 26, 2008, 01:23 AM // 01:23

No offense but AP + Finish Him isn't exactly news :/ this build in general has a lot of variants.

Vann Borakul · Sep 03, 2008, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dru Stratas

Also, I'd agree with the point of over-exhaustion with MS, I'd drop fire completely for some earth or water (burred vision/steam).
But yeah, it's a good build

If you're getting overexhausted with this build, you don't know how to play the game correctly, and you're not playing the build correctly. Earth/water would be a terrible idea save for a very select few skills like Maelstrom, which is the only one I can think of.

Bobby2 · Sep 03, 2008, 11:44 PM // 23:44

So, you just said [Ward against melee], [blurred vision], and by extension also [Deep freeze] are bad.

Yet:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vann Borakul

If you're getting overexhausted with this build, you don't know how to play the game correctly, and you're not playing the build correctly.

lolol

Vann Borakul · Sep 03, 2008, 11:56 PM // 23:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

So, you just said [Ward against melee], [blurred vision], and by extension also [Deep freeze] are bad.

I never said that.

Bobby2 · Sep 04, 2008, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vann Borakul

I never said that.

I'll just use the complete quote then, and highlight for your convenience

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vann Borakul

If you're getting overexhausted with this build, you don't know how to play the game correctly, and you're not playing the build correctly. Earth/water would be a terrible idea save for a very select few skills like Maelstrom, which is the only one I can think of.

The only terrible idea in this thread is the thought of using Fire Magic in HM.

Don't post builds if you can't deal with feedback.

Dru Stratas · Sep 04, 2008, 12:39 AM // 00:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vann Borakul

If you're getting overexhausted with this build, you don't know how to play the game correctly, and you're not playing the build correctly. Earth/water would be a terrible idea save for a very select few skills like Maelstrom, which is the only one I can think of.

Ok sorry, you obviously know alot more

--fire sucks in hardmode; meteor storm takes forever to cast, and deals very little damage. The only good thing about it is the knockdowns, which take the casting time + three seconds to affect the target IF they haven't moved away.
As bobby said, there is absolutely nothing wrong with blurred vision/ Ward against melee, and by extension, any ward except weariness, as it isn't a very effective way of spreading weakness condition, unless you happen to be standing on the mob. If you don't know this "you don't know how to play the game correctly, and you're not playing your ele correctly."
Again, Bobby hit the nail on the head: ele damage is no go in HM.

Vann Borakul · Sep 04, 2008, 02:29 AM // 02:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

I'll just use the complete quote then, and highlight for your convenience

save for a very select few
save for a very select few
save for a very select few
save for a very select few
save for a very select few

You must have missed it again, so I repeated it for your convenience. We're talking about using Earth/water in the build this topic is about, not in general (if you're getting the wrong idea). But none of that utility is necessary. 2 hero monks have been enough to get legendary guardian and 50 vanquishes thus far. I don't see why a ward or a random blind on an enemy who will die in seconds anyways matters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

The only terrible idea in this thread is the thought of using Fire Magic in HM.

No matter how much I disagree, that Shadow Sanctuary idea still boggles my mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dru Stratas

Ok sorry, you obviously know alot more

--fire sucks in hardmode; meteor storm takes forever to cast, and deals very little damage. The only good thing about it is the knockdowns, which take the casting time + three seconds to affect the target IF they haven't moved away.

That's why you never use MS without GoS or Mindbender. If you can pick your targets right, you don't need to worry about them running away beforehand. There's odd occasions of course.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dru Stratas

Again, Bobby hit the nail on the head: ele damage is no go in HM.

I really don't see why you think that. Doing several hundred damage to several targets in a few seconds with repeated knockdown sounds like a go to me.

Bobby2 · Sep 04, 2008, 02:44 AM // 02:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vann Borakul

No matter how much I disagree, that Shadow Sanctuary idea still boggles my mind.

I took you for inexperienced and thought you could use the regen and +armor to make up for bad play.

Still think you'd benefit from it.

ALF71BE · Sep 04, 2008, 02:59 AM // 02:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vann Borakul

That's why you never use MS without GoS or Mindbender. If you can pick your targets right, you don't need to worry about them running away beforehand.

Using GoS takes an additional second, so you're still taking 4 seconds to do a measy 80 damage. Add in there AP, Fire Attunement and three aftercasts and you're taking more than 8 seconds to do those 119 damage, which anyways is way less since you're in HM and bad guys have more than 60 armor, always.

Quote:

I really don't see why you think that. Doing several hundred damage to several targets in a few seconds with repeated knockdown sounds like a go to me.

The thing with Maelstrom, for example, is that it will prevent a group of clumped casters to heal themselves, heal others and, generally speaking, do damage through spells, while lasting a second longer for the interrupts, freeing a skill slot and taking less time to do it's job, which is good because the foes will release their initial spike of damage right away starting the aggro.

Oh and Ward Against Melee is very sexy because it's like Aegis but lasts longer.

Rhamia Darigaz · Sep 04, 2008, 03:23 AM // 03:23

might i suggest an alternative to meteor shower for domage to get things below 50% health for ["finish him!"]? you'll find a link to the wiki page for the skill i have in mind here.

Bobby2 · Sep 04, 2008, 07:13 AM // 07:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALF71BE

Truth

Maybe he'll listen to you Alf