Curse

Gosu · Aug 04, 2006, 10:29 AM // 10:29

ok i don't know if this build has been done before, chances are it probably has but anyway here it is.

Assassin/Warrior

Daggers Zealous
15^50
Hp+30 mod

Daggers Zealous
Energy +5
Hp+30 mod

skillset

Speed siphon
Iron pam
Falling spider
Flourish {E}
Horns of the ox
twisting fangs
shadow refuge
Ressurection signet

I can't remeber the attributes at the moment but will put them on later, just try to look at the concept and make comments on it and also on anything that can be improved.

Basically the build works on the basis that you keep your build in one place as much as possible why you lay in your degen and damage to kill them. This build give's you the opportunity of two kd's as well as applying status ailments on a more regualr basis that you usually would. You use flourish to gain a bit of energy once you have unloaded your spike as well as reloading and gaining the advantage of all your attack skills being reloaded.

The build has the capabilites to solo many characters, but the main aim of this build is to primarily support and aid the main damage dealer which should be a warrior.

This is how the build works, You use speed siphon to slow down target as well as speeding you up. You then use Iron palm which will do a decent amount of damage as well knocking down your oppoent, you then use falling spider, once you have done this horns of the ox should become active but don't use it just yet. Activate flourish and this should reload falling spider once this has been done use horns of the ox to kd them once again falling spider for extra damage and to reapply posion if he has been removed and then finally top off the spike with twisting fangs.

Or you could go for a more direct spike by using speed siphon, iron palm, falling spider then finally twisting fangs.

I prefer the former as you do more damage and make use of the two kd's as well as gaining the advantage of restacking any status ailments that have been removed.

i like this build because i believe it is quite good at slowing down oppoents and doing a sizable amount of damage to them. One on one the build is quite effective due to the amount knockdowns, damage and degen in the build. Though the build's very good in the support aspect especially in cooperation with a warrior

The builds is a bit complex and opens up a few combinations of spikes that you could use depending on the status of your oppoent.

try it you might like it.

Munanko Roha · Aug 04, 2006, 12:57 PM // 12:57

It's 4 attributes you're using, don't you leave your points too thin?

This build does not seem to have any spike ability and has the problem that HotO knocks down only alone foes, far too conditional.

Wyvern X · Aug 05, 2006, 01:41 PM // 13:41

I think the build needs a bit more spiking power, but i like the concept of using flourish. Not sure how it would work compared to moebius strike, but I think i'll try making a build for it

Leonof · Aug 05, 2006, 01:50 PM // 13:50

actually the energy gain with flourish is 1 for each recharged attack skill, which is totally not worth it since your stuck with no strength

Ive seen this build before in gvg once but can't remember from whom (I think EvIL used this). Here's how it goes:
Siphon Speed
Black Lotus Strike
Twisting Fangs
Flourish

The sin mostly used this pretty much, he just spams siphon speed on everyone, spots a target and uses black lotus twisting, flourish then rinse and repeat. That's all I remember, but been meaning to try this out.

Gosu · Aug 06, 2006, 10:49 PM // 22:49

@ Munanko Roha

I have read over your comments and i must say that i will post up the attributes in a little while i haven't had time to get round to it. though you may have a point about the points being spread quite thin.

Also you are talking about horns of the ox dude that skill used to be taken by loads of sins and is still quite popular today. Yes horns of the ox only knock downs when allies aren't around but it still doesn't make it any less effective otherwise it wouldn't have been popular in the first place. It's a good skill as it forces you to be more selective about who you target.

Most of the time assassins will pick off isolated or stray party members like warriors who rush in headlong, that’s why I say this build is purely support.

@ Wyvern

The funny thing dude is that my guild member who I made this with uses mobius strike with his spike the only reason why I don't use it as you don't have complete full control over when your skills are recharged, I like flourish due to the fact that you can activate the skill and your attack skills will return no matter what. I don't like moebius strike because you have to hit with it to get your skills back if something goes wrong. For example if your interrupted or blinded or your target brings up some evasion skill then you’re screwed.

I know maybe flourish could be used for a longer assassin spike though.

@Leonf

I don't know whether EVIL used the same build or not but flourish is just used to make sure that my attack skills return when I want them to. The energy you get from critical strikes attribute coupled with the zealous mod is more than enough to cover this build. The energy you get from flourish is incidental

The only problem I have is that the spike actually goes on for quite a bit and has two parts to it most notably the two KD's you get from the spike.

The only thing though I am bothered about is the recharge time of iron palm it is too slow. If I could supplement this skill with another that could kd hexed opponents as well or if Anet could do a skill update making the recharge time shorter for this skill then I can spike more frequently and more consistently.

Leonof · Aug 07, 2006, 09:41 AM // 09:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gosu

@ Munanko Roha
The only thing though I am bothered about is the recharge time of iron palm it is too slow. If I could supplement this skill with another that could kd hexed opponents as well or if Anet could do a skill update making the recharge time shorter for this skill then I can spike more frequently and more consistently.

Well I doubt Anet will fix iron palm so you can spike more, fine as it is. Your build is too reliant on iron palm. It is 20sec recharge and if it doesn't hit, youre screwed for another 20seconds, which isn't too good as a support. I'd say your not making too much use of your elite as well, your pretty much using it just to recharge falling spider which also relies on iron palm.

Siren · Aug 07, 2006, 04:08 PM // 16:08

The build is actually pretty solid. The attributes won't be spread too thin at all. Since Siphon Speed is the only Deadly Arts skill in there and has recently been buffed very nicely, you can run 11-12-6 with the single left-over point dropped into Deadly Arts. It should give Siphon Speed a duration of about 5 seconds, which is more than enough to get into your chain.

In terms of specific attri point levels...

Critical Strikes: 13 (11+2, hat+minor)
Dagger Mastery: 15 (12+3, superior)
Shadow Arts: 7 (6+1)
Deadly Arts: 2 (1+1)

Instead of Iron Palm, bring Black Lotus Strike. With Siphon Speed there, it'll give you a Lead Bypass, plus some extra energy.

The chain itself looks more efficient like so:

Siphon Speed-->BLS-->Horns-->Falling Spider-->Twisting Fangs

After the entire chain, you use Flourish. The criticisms regarding Flourish being Strength-based are asinine, because for a 5E skill, you're getting 4E back...so...for a net cost of 1E every 10 seconds, you're grabbing a recharge of your entire skill bar, pretty much. Siphon Speed and Shadow Refuge have fast recharges to begin with so they're good to go immediately.

All in all, we've seen the build before in various permutations, but yours is solid nonetheless. Though I think it would be wise to consider my suggestions. I think I saw someone else mention BLS, as well.

Gosu · Aug 08, 2006, 10:55 PM // 22:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonof

Well I doubt Anet will fix iron palm so you can spike more, fine as it is. Your build is too reliant on iron palm. It is 20sec recharge and if it doesn't hit, youre screwed for another 20seconds, which isn't too good as a support. I'd say your not making too much use of your elite as well, your pretty much using it just to recharge falling spider which also relies on iron palm.

I agree and yet disagree with your comments, I agree on one hand the build is far too reliant on iron palm. But i disagree with what you said from your comments you have obviously never used the iron palm skill, this is one attack you can't dodge, block or evade as it is a touch skill. It runs on the same concept as touch rangers you can't block, evade or dodge their attacks, so iron palm is the one part of the spike that will always hit guranteed.

On the other hand lies the problem of the other melee skills they can be blocked, dodged and evaded.

@ siren

now here is a post to chew through, I actually haven't got my attribute setup like that, but yes with deadly arts at 2 it should give me a 5 second window to which should be adquate to strike. Also it does concide nicely as speed siphon is a 5 sec recharge.

hmm yes with my critical strikes at 13 i think i get the +3 energy per critical strike, also i would do a bit more damage as well.

I looked at black lotus strike it's nice as you get energy back, but what do you think of this i was looking at black mantis strike you cripple hexed oppoents imagine laying speed siphon down then adding more snare with cripple. I then thought of taking jungle strike as you do +31 damage to crippled oppoents then maybe finishing off with twisting fangs bleeding and deep wound. You could then recharge and go straight again.

But yes I will look at your spike and try it out most definetely, maybe it can give the spike a quicker rate of kill. I have used my spike in TA and RA it works on most players as the two kd's really upsets there rhythm of doing things. Also if you co-ordinate your spike with a secondary attacker such as an air spiker or fire ele, you can kd, do spike damage and apply degeneration, while your fire ele or air spiker hits them while there down as well.

I was warriors get a set of bracers that increase their kd time i think they are called the stonefist gauntlets, why don't assassins get something like that as well.

Gosu · Aug 12, 2006, 07:08 PM // 19:08

k Siren i have test your build and i must say one thing, it's actually pretty solid much mroe soild than my original, Iron palm build this build has such an abundance of energy, what with Critical strikes being at attribute 13 as well as black lotus giving back you a substantial amount of eneryg in return you don't actually need to take full energy armor or the +5 energy dagegrs. The spikes works and can kill, Also you can spike more consistently and frequently because of flourish, so if you miss or mess up you can simply reload your skills and go again more or less straight away.

I tested out the armor and i took full energy armor except i took the upper torso armor which reduces blindness by 20% and took the daggers hp^50 with +30 mod as the energy is so abundant.

Also you made a little msitake on the deadly arts front you can actually get

Critical-13(11+2, hat+minor)
Dagger mastery-15(12+3, superior)
shadow arts-7(6+1,minor)
Deadly arts-3(2+1,minor)

This should give siphon speed 7 seconds instead of 5 seconds.But yes it works very very nicely.