Curse

enumaelish1 · Jul 17, 2009, 10:38 AM // 10:38

Hiya guys, this might not be in the right section(possibly heroes?) but I have a friend using critscythe, well he will run anything I damn well tell him to.... but he dies every other mob we encounter. I am running Imbagon, and even keeping SY up, but he always manages to die anyway >.>
-Running in HM, and hes a friends kid, so I promised to take care of him >.<

Right now, I'm running Racway/Sabway depending on the area, do you have any suggestions to help me keep him alive?

So far, I subbed [Critical defenses] into the PvX wiki version of critscythe in an attempt to keep him up:
OwpiMypMBA0cxcFm9WKDuIWDC
I believe we took out mystic sweep for it.

-Note, I can keep him alive on my monk, but I've been looking to do some vanqs/mish on my paragon.

Any suggestions to build types to keep him alive would be great

I did consider making him a crit barrager btw, since it would keep him on the backline...
Opinions appreciated

Oh yes, and he is only 13, so for some reason he can't comprehend waiting for prots. A full conset does keep him alive tho... but its getting expensive to do every area with him using a conset.(An armor of salvation doesn't keep him alive somehow, but he dies much less with it)
Oh, and he lacks the skill the keep up shadow form with any other skills on the bar, the reason why eludes me -.0 Perhaps his concentration span is lacking.

M @ T · Jul 17, 2009, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Does he have many superior runes and/or non max armor?

Tell him to use Critical Agility too.

Is he further away then ear shout? Cause if so, he doesn't get the benefits of SY.

Critical Defences helps vs melees and that's it.

Dunno what else to suggest except not using a sin and roll a war

Silverblad3 · Jul 17, 2009, 11:05 AM // 11:05

Make sure he is fully runed, it makes a huge difference in HM. Get him to use other skills (PvE) to boost his armor like IAU. My Sin does great in HM including tough areas like Sacnoth Valley.

Silver

Malician · Jul 17, 2009, 11:07 AM // 11:07

He's probably like me and is infuriated by having to wait. (I'm 20 but I would be tearing my hair out over slow teams if I didn't watch movies or talk on AIM while playing).

Maybe put a speed boost on your monk/team (use fall back to catch up with him)? It sounds like he's dying because the full spiking power of the mob hits him before anyone else shows up. Is he using Superior runes (that could wreck his health)?

Is he using Critical Agility before combat? That said, if you're running in first not even 90ish armor is going to save your ass from HM nukes.

You could always try sticking this on a hero monk and manually casting it on him each area.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Life_Bond

Edit: How fast is he dying? Right away or during the middle of the fight after everyone else has already shown up?

Billy The Scourge · Jul 17, 2009, 11:08 AM // 11:08

I personally find that only very skilled assassins survive, even in normal mode I find that very few sins can stay alive and I personally never take them. Obviously you have the problem that you have to take him, possibly try running discord instead of sabway, I find it more powerful both in damage and healing and therefore it may be more powerful in keeping him alive. Make sure you don't take Death Pact Signet with him though, sounds like a bad idea!

furanshisuko · Jul 17, 2009, 11:53 AM // 11:53

best thing to do is micro manage...

which is what i do when i play critscythe keeping spells like protective spirit and [pirit bond on me makes me an awsome tank

subarucar · Jul 17, 2009, 12:20 PM // 12:20

Other than what people have already said, you could always throw in some extra support skills, find a skill that doesnt have much of an effect/use and add in a couple of extra prot spells, I usually run 2 full healers with support skills on at least 2 others. By the fact you have posted here, im assuming you manage fine with an extra henchmen, hence the above does not apply.

Check his health and armour, also watch his placement within combat, he may be extending far beyond the reaches of your teams monks, putting himself in a position where he is less likely to be healed, and more likely to agro more mobs. Also check that he is not moving on to the next group while your teams healers are low on energy from the previous fight.

Hamosch · Jul 17, 2009, 12:30 PM // 12:30

My Main is a Sin and while ive been doing Vanquishes on Mount Quinkai (excuse the spelling) ive been noticing i need some moore healing becouse of Rot Wallows and their life stealing when you aggro 3 groups XD. But anyways what keeps me alive without any problems are these three heros:

Olias: Some protection skills like: -Zealous Benedict / Divert Hexes, Spiritbond, Protective Spirit, Guardian / Aegis, Convert Hexes, Foul Feast, SoLS, Ress (or whatever) [12 Prot; 14 SR]

This should keep all armor nonignoring dmg off him (maby not needed if your imbagon but idk if your maby out of his range with SY!)

Livia: Some Healing: WoH / Healers Boon, Dwaynas kiss, Heal Other, Infuse Health, Dwaynas Sorrow (becouse of Minions), SoLS, Healing Seed, Ress (or whatever) [12 Healing; 14 SR]

This one can with full survivors and vitae and major vigor infuse for ove 600HP (might have to be microd at time) wich should keep his health up.

Xandra: http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Rt/M...ling_Ritualist

and this one should make u for the dmg you lost from not having sab.

I would suggest you go with this and Discord on your heros though. And take give him a build like: WS, Mystic, Eremits, Asuran Scan, AoHM, WotM, Crit Eye, Crit Agility. This should be more then enough dmg and survivability and if think you dont need the protector just swap him out for smth else :P

Chieftain Heavyhand · Jul 17, 2009, 12:30 PM // 12:30

Well a leroying sin is the main problem.

Critical agility + SY will only give +25 armor (if I'm wrong then if some one could tell me if armor bonuses stack or do you get the highest rated one?)

Since he is running a scythe build Flashing blades is out, I run that when I'm in areas where enchant striping is rampant.

Make sure he is only use minor runes, at least a major vig rune hopefully a sup vig rune, tell him to put +defense insig on chest and legs.

Try to tell him when he see he is getting beaten up too badly to break and run to let the monks heal then return to the fight.

Stress not to over argo or get to far ahead of the rest of the group.

If he can not grasp that he needs to stick with the team then crit barrage.

_Nihilist_ · Jul 17, 2009, 01:01 PM // 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chieftain Heavyhand

Critical agility + SY will only give +25 armor (if I'm wrong then if some one could tell me if armor bonuses stack or do you get the highest rated one?)

He should get the highest single bonus - +100AL from "SY!", iirc.

Abedeus · Jul 17, 2009, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrael_Eveningsong

He should get the highest single bonus - +100AL from "SY!", iirc.

Actually, you are both right.

It's the highest value + up to 25 from other skills.

Perfected Shadow · Jul 17, 2009, 01:57 PM // 13:57

You already know what he's doing badly so be brave and tell him.

If he doesn't listen or like most peeps just want an awesome 'way', try vengeanceway:

You: Vengeance + 7 spear skills
N/Mo: Vengeance, Death Nova, Animate Bone Minions, Dwayna's Sorrow, hex and cond removal so you can spear mobs gud
E/Mo: Vengeance + Ether Renewal prot stuff (make sure to disable prots and use them only on yourself)
Me/Mo: Echo, Arcane Echo, Arcane Mimicry, Vengeance

TheodenKing · Jul 17, 2009, 02:47 PM // 14:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by enumaelish1

Oh yes, and he is only 13, so for some reason he can't comprehend waiting for prots.

You answered your own question. You need to instruct him to wait until either prot spirit or SY is active before jumping in. Imbagons typically need a few seconds before they have the adrenaline to get it up when a fight starts.

Also... 13 is plenty old enough to learn how to play correctly. The kid could probably wipe the floor with most people in a first-person-shooter. Just explain to him that this is not Halo, and he'll have to slow down a bit at the start if he wants to dominate the enemies.

Too many assassins think that they should be the first ones in to a fight and stay until the enemy is dead. However, the best sins I've played with (and against) have learned that being the second or third in and the first out is the most effective way to play. (I'm not talking about Shadow Form here... the strategy for that is different).

Pip Squeak · Jul 17, 2009, 03:11 PM // 15:11

Well, I happen to be 13, however on my sin I wait until the enemies are occupied on minions or a warrior before going in.
On-topic: Assassins should never be the first person to aggro; warriors, rangers or paragons should do it. Grab a longbow and tell him to stay back and wait until the enemies have been pulled. Then instruct him to wait until your shouts/chants are up before going in. After battle make sure he waits for everyone to gain energy before aggroing the next group

smilingscar · Jul 17, 2009, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheodenKing

You need to instruct him to wait until either prot spirit or SY is active before jumping in.

This. Teaching him how to play defensively (i.e. smartly) will go a long way towards making him a better player overall.

Other than that, maybe run a flashing blades build (works pretty well for me in HM), or you could just spec him in prot prayers and slap protective spirit into a daggers build. Not ideal, but he's a sin so he should be able to maintain it without energy problems.

Jaigoda · Jul 17, 2009, 04:27 PM // 16:27

I'd say rather than trying to change the build, try and teach him how to play well in PvE. You could easily beat the game with Hamstorm if you played it really well. Make sure he has max armor with no -hp runes first. Then, watch him and make sure he's using Critical Agility, and that he doesn't get out of earshot range so he stays in SY's range.

But most importantly, you need to show him good tactics for PvE, such as pulling, kiting, micro'ing heroes, not leeroy'ing, and such in order to make him understand the way the game's played. Also make sure to stress that this is a team game, and abandoning your group is only going to get people killed, and quickly.

Bobby2 · Jul 17, 2009, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaigoda

Also make sure to stress that this is a team game, and abandoning your group is only going to get people killed, and quickly.

qft, 12chars

Axel Zinfandel · Jul 17, 2009, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Without going into actual skills and builds, if you are running Imbagon and ANYONE on you're team is dying:

1. You messed up
2. You're going against high armor-ignoring damage
3. You over-aggroed a SHITLOAD
4. He is going our of your range

But at the very most, if you want him to go defensive, Critical Agility + Critical Defenses is THE best bet without compromising a lot of your bar. To keep CD up reliably, throw Malicious strike in there while using Wounding Strike.

Not taking any outside skills into play, Assassins are fragile, but how well you survive depends on how well you know and run your class (and build).

I once had a Sin running a normal dagger build in Boreas Seabed mission who leroy'd ahead, aggroing 1 or 2 monsters ahead of us and doing a very good job at surviving alone.

enumaelish1 · Jul 18, 2009, 11:19 AM // 11:19

His armor is definitely max (its his dad's old account) but I checked his runes today and no vigor rune ><

He is running out of my shout range though, and I slotted incoming on my paragon hero so maybe I can catch up to him.

The suggestion of crit agility is tempting as well ^^. Although I also feel like forcing him to learn to play is best option. I think he plays the sin because his dad has some decent titles on it like sweets and mapping.

First on the list is his heroes, I gave him the runes and told him where to put them but then he starts putting the wrong stuff on them >.>
-Best example of this is me putting command runes, shield and build for his morgahn then him putting the motivation build I pinged him there instead.

Thanks for all the replies guys, I'm gona go start working on him

Axel Zinfandel · Jul 18, 2009, 11:39 PM // 23:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by enumaelish1

He is running out of my shout range though, and I slotted incoming on my paragon hero so maybe I can catch up to him.

That's your problem then. instead of you catching up to him, tell him to stop leroying. You shouldn't be the one editing your play stile to catch up with him.

Quote:

The suggestion of crit agility is tempting as well ^^. Although I also feel like forcing him to learn to play is best option. I think he plays the sin because his dad has some decent titles on it like sweets and mapping.

Critical agility should pretty much be stapled on PvE sin's bar. I gives Sins two things that single-handedly make them viable in PvE: Armor and IAS.