Curse

Kashrlyyk · Jun 25, 2005, 09:53 AM // 09:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jelloblimp

..You go out & earn xp to get more refund points (which has already been said), not whine at customer support to do what YOU are suppose to do (=play the game).[Edit: GM:s or devs can look into the database, not customer support because thats not their job]
You can however whine at customer support when you do have a valid complaint.

But why isn´t it like the skillsystem? In town you can change attributepoints as you wish, and as soon as you leave, they are set, till you enter a town again!!

Kashrlyyk · Jun 25, 2005, 09:57 AM // 09:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge Martinez

Also, taking 2 minutes to help someone if A-Net screws up is fine. But to take 2 minutes to help someone who messes up on their own is silly with a game like this. Thousands of people would screw up each day, some more than twice, and game development would get nowhere.

Help him and change the UI to pop up a window, and never help anyone again! That would be fine for me!

Kashrlyyk · Jun 25, 2005, 10:07 AM // 10:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diplo

Why can we only read the EULA once we have bought and opened the game, meaning we can't return it to the shop even if we disagree with the EULA? (This is a general point that applies to nearly all games but is an example of how customers often get screwed).

You should check the laws of your country! In my country EULA´s are only a binding contract, if they are shown to me before I purchase the game!

Dirkiess · Jun 25, 2005, 10:17 AM // 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zerian Black

Okay, that's the answer i was looking for, I've never heard of Fissure or Underworld but aparently you can only access these places while your country has favor of the gods, i have no idea whats there but now it makes sense, thanks for the help

.....while this wasn't an answer i was looking for, i had questions, you sir are just an asshole.

It was the fact you couldn't be bothered to read the whole thread to find the answer which has been there all the time. So no, I wasn't being an asshole, you just couldn't be bothered to read, and repeating oneself isn't something we should have to keep doing.

Mercury Angel · Jun 25, 2005, 11:19 AM // 11:19

The whole semi-hostile bit was most likely keyed to:

Quote:

I have a major problem and and Guild Wars will NOT help me.

Quote:

Well like I said... Guild Wars will not help me which I think is pretty lame.

Quote:

Now maybe I should have read the information better but again I never got a pop-up (or something like that) which stated it would be the final change.

You accept responsibility for your actions, but simulataneously try to shirk it off, and then blame others for not helping you with a mess you got into yourself.

There're no buts, this is a pretty straightforward case of not following instructions.

There's a test some teachers give for fun which has a long list of numbered instructions on it. Number 1 says, "Read all of the statements below before doing anything", and the finaly one says, "Disregard everything except Number 2" [Number 2 is to put your name at the top of the paper].

Anyway, what you ideally should have done was posted in Sardelac Sanitarium your suggestions to help prevent this from happening to more people if you wanted it to be taken seriously like that, and told your story as an example of why.

However, the way you come across is totally different. The tone of your post sounds like you do indeed blame ANET for not the problem, but for not helping you solve a problem of your own creation.

As for the person playing the 'lack of human empathy' card, don't start. It's not as if I haven't screwed up and clicked one too many times and sold a rare focus (Non-PvP with max possible energy mods) to an NPC. I get it, and I can sympathize.
But I won't blame someone else because I screwed up, and I certainly won't approve of someone else doing something similar.

The notice was highly visible, easily read, and the rules are set.
The only thing you can do is petition for change. Considering the way the game works with refund points, I favor a recharging server change system that restores over time slowly. Hardly abusable if the time is somewhere along the lines of a month +/-.

As it's been said, there's still the international districts. I'm almost always there. Faster load ups, less lag, less spam. When I go to my home districts, I turn off Talk, Trade, and Emotes, do what business I need to, and promptly leave. Usually only there for a few rare missions, or to gain access to the Traders, which don't exist in the international.
You're just going to give up because of your own accident when it's really not all that bad. If I can live in the international district, and talk with my friends and guildmates still, why can't you? What stops you from doing missions and quests with your friends? Grab your friends, some hench, and you're set.

Instead, you're posting here about how you're quitting because you made a mistake and don't want to deal with it.

You can't really complain about people with a negative attitude when, let's face it, you came on here and posted with one. Get a booster shot of optimisim and realize that even if you're stuck, it doesn't have to be the end of your playing. The only things you won't ever be able to do with your friends are the special dungeons and the Tombs. Might be a tad difficult to PvP together, as the arenas are pretty empty in the international districts. Your best bet in that instance is to get enough people beforehand and go there.

I don't really see a point to this thread. I think ignoring the hostility, even if it is subtle, is foolish, and I hope it gets locked. Your alternatives are available and have been said, and suggestions are for Sardelac Sanitarium. I hope you can enjoy your game, but if you can not, then that is the way it will be, and is a decision on your own part.

Sk23Von · Jul 17, 2005, 01:10 AM // 01:10

I didn't read, its their fault. just because you didnt read it doesnt mean they didnt warn you. It was there, VERY bold like, telling you it was limited. Why is there no pop up? Why should there be one, its very clearly stated that there is a limit, and how close you are to that limit. So it turns out ignorance is not bliss for you. Im so sorry for your loss.

its limited to keep you from switching to whichever country has Favor etc, not to mention it cant be easy on the servers to switch, and if they were unlimited, youd switch all the time.

Sk23Von · Jul 17, 2005, 01:11 AM // 01:11

"I didn't read, its their fault". just because you didnt read it doesnt mean they didnt warn you. It was there, VERY bold like, telling you it was limited. Why is there no pop up? Why should there be one, its very clearly stated that there is a limit, and how close you are to that limit. So it turns out ignorance is not bliss for you. Im so sorry for your loss.

its limited to keep you from switching to whichever country has Favor etc, not to mention it cant be easy on the servers to switch, and if they were unlimited, youd switch all the time.

Zakarr · Jul 18, 2005, 07:15 AM // 07:15

Why this feature is limited anyway? Maybe adding a delay like couple days or a week and make changing unlimited?

TheGreatBoo · Jul 18, 2005, 07:21 AM // 07:21

It's limited because of the change in favor. America can only switch the Europe and same with Europe to America. If it was unlimited, you could switch to Europe whenever they had favor. At least with a limited number you have a restriction on the number of times you can take advantage of Europe or Americas hard work.

JAckO · Jul 18, 2005, 09:21 AM // 09:21

I can see the reason for limiting it, but its a bit harsh not being able to change bk to your own territory, GW could have maybe put the change limit to an even number so tht the last change would always be back into your own territoy. AND btw i have ALSO got stuck in american territory, neva read the clearly stated limit ^^ because was always in a rush to meet guild in american temple of ages... of course it my fault but there should be something u can do to go bk to ur own territory.

Edit - I sent them an E-Mail requesting them to change the territory change limit to an even number, and they replyied saying they are going to change it to (4) changes. AND if I would like one final change I should send them my access key and requested territory that i want. Which i have of course ^^

SO i suggest u do the same

Zakarr · Jul 19, 2005, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGreatBoo

It's limited because of the change in favor. America can only switch the Europe and same with Europe to America. If it was unlimited, you could switch to Europe whenever they had favor. At least with a limited number you have a restriction on the number of times you can take advantage of Europe or Americas hard work.

How about if world switcher can't enter to UW or Fissure even there is favor when using unlimited switching? Only in original world they can which they could choose five times.

gabby2600 · Jul 19, 2005, 04:16 PM // 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syuveil

Why do they have the maximum times you can change anyway? Sounds like a ploy to get more cash to me... "I wanna go back to my home territory, but I don't have any more changes left..." Anet- "We can't do anything, but you could go buy another copy."

<_<

The Traders, are the reason, Prices in each region are calcualted accordingly. Allow mutiple changes you allwy an avenue of Exploit. At least now youahve to buy 2 copies of the game if you wnat to use this exploit to make cash.

gabby2600 · Jul 19, 2005, 04:46 PM // 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diplo

Why can't we play in whatever region we want? How does this benefit me as a paying customer?

Their is nothing stopping you form doing this; however you cannot region hop, pick a region you want to play and their you go.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diplo

Why is the number of times we can change region set to seemingly arbitrary five? Why is this an odd number when logic would dictate an even number would be less risky?

This is simple it seems to have come in with DVD region coding; you can change a DVD region 5 times. This was done on purpose, and for financial reasons, with an odd number your more than likely to get stuck in a region that is not your own. So you have to buy a New DVD drive or pay to have it reset. So they adopt a similar system 5 changes so you can get stuck in a region that is not your own, giving clear warnings (which they do) means that if you get stuck in a region that is not your own then it's only your fault. Don't moan about it.

At least you get 5 chances to read the warning, when driving to wards a cliff you only get one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diplo

Why isn't there a final confirm dialogue when you attempt make the last change? Would it be a good idea to implement one?

Fair enough this is a good idea. However if you fail to read the text that is right in front of you want makes you think people will read a pop-up dialogue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diplo

Why don't Arena Net support have the ability to change the region in exceptional circumstances? Why is it so difficult to change one field in a database?

Because the Account database is run by NCsoft on a secure backbone. The only people that can access it are cleared NCsoft personnel. Like any other secure system to stop corruption you only allow a few people to access accounts. I know NC soft control this database, because it's NCsoft that game me my press account, Arena.net have no control over that side of things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diplo

Why can we only read the EULA once we have bought and opened the game, meaning we can't return it to the shop even if we disagree with the EULA? (This is a general point that applies to nearly all games but is an example of how customers often get screwed).

Erm.. it took me 5 seconds to find eh EULA. I opened google and typed 'guildwars EULA' and strangely enough http://www.guildwars.com/legal/user-agreement.html is what I got. Actually you will find legally as long as you don't rub of the silver or open the secure packet with the licence key in, you can return the game. Once you have viewed that key then it is a compromised product. This is quite obvious to me.

Also ignorance is not an excuse in the eyes of the law. The EULA is there online for you to read before you buy the game. Putting it in the box only wastes paper, and as you need a net connection to play the game there is nothing stopping you looking on their site.

Also hardly any computer game offers you an EULA before you open the packet and install it. Also how many people have paid for software they want and then taken it back because they don't agree with the EULA. I work in the computer industry and in all my years I have never known anyone or any company return software because they disagree with the EULA.

In fact they only time you could sensibly disagree is if you wanted to hack the software, copy it illegally. Or do something to compromise the quality of the product for other users.

So this posit is rather pointless.

Also 45 euros is nothing some games you have to pay 70 euros for then pay 15-20 euros per month. So moaning about having to spend a bit more cash again is stupid, or would you like to see a monthly fee.

So here are some solutions.

1) Buy another copy of the game it's not that much and you don't pay monthly for it. And you get the best of the US and Europe region. So you can use the fissure more than most people.

2) Play in the international districts with your friends.

3) Trade your account with someone in the US who is stuck in Europe.

4) Waste more hours of your life moaning about something you cannot change, instead of just accepting it.

InFeStEd · Jul 19, 2005, 04:49 PM // 16:49

I've never seen these warnings,,, then again i've never switched countries.... However, from reading all of these posts, there needs to be a better system implemented. Obviously, if people are getting stuck in different countries, whether or not they didn't notice, something isn't working right. Secondly, I expect that when I purchase a game, the support staff will and should bend over backwards for me. I don't care if i spent 2$ or 200$ on it, whether or not it has a monthly fee, or how many free hookers come with it. When I purchase your product, I am now the customer and from what I have witnessed elsewhere, the customer is always right. If I am unhappy with something, whether it be caused by me or them, I expect that I will be catered to and if not, I shall take my business elsewhere. SERVICE DOES NOT END AFTER I SHELL OUT MY MONIES. The fact that ANET cannot access the databass is complete shit, and if they truely can't we better be questioning the future of GW (think crashes and rollbacks). Yes, he shoulda read it closer, yes its his fault, and yes he's probably going to reoffend somewhere else down the line... But he paid his 45 bucks and as far as I'm concerned, ANET should be asking him if he would another drink.

Nexx · Jul 19, 2005, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Principa Discordia

So you're saying that this notice is not clear or obvious enough? I'm sorry, but if someone doesn't think that it's an obvious warning then I'm surprised they know how to use a computer in the first place.

Pwned? J/k!

Either way, I'm sure the original poster had a legitimate reason to be traversing between the two locations. A friend of mine can't get into UW/FOW to collect a few items because Europe rarely gets the favor, so he switches between the two. We know it sucks and we understand the basic logic of locking server switching. For now, he has given up on it and sticking to the Euro server. I think he has 1~2 times left to switch.

gabby2600 · Jul 19, 2005, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by InFeStEd

I've never seen these warnings,,, then again i've never switched countries.... However, from reading all of these posts, there needs to be a better system implemented. Obviously, if people are getting stuck in different countries, whether or not they didn't notice, something isn't working right. Secondly, I expect that when I purchase a game, the support staff will and should bend over backwards for me. I don't care if i spent 2$ or 200$ on it, whether or not it has a monthly fee, or how many free hookers come with it. When I purchase your product, I am now the customer and from what I have witnessed elsewhere, the customer is always right. If I am unhappy with something, whether it be caused by me or them, I expect that I will be catered to and if not, I shall take my business elsewhere. SERVICE DOES NOT END AFTER I SHELL OUT MY MONIES. The fact that ANET cannot access the databass is complete shit, and if they truely can't we better be questioning the future of GW (think crashes and rollbacks). Yes, he shoulda read it closer, yes its his fault, and yes he's probably going to reoffend somewhere else down the line... But he paid his 45 bucks and as far as I'm concerned, ANET should be asking him if he would another drink.

Ah so you speak to NC soft staff then on a regualr basis?

I said NCsoft controlls he accounts database. Arena.net has access to it but cannto change it. Arena.net has full access to the character database, so rollback are possible.

The acounts database holds your personal information, your access keys, and region details. By law in most countries this data has to be secures an only accessed by registered personel.

Do you really want every tom, dick and harry looking at your personall account details, having access to the key's you have paid for.

This secure accoutn system protect you the user from people selling your information. I would imagine on this system they only thing A.net can access is What region your in, and what you have access to. The key information is kept secret, as are your personal details.

This way those that control the accounts database are not the people your pissing of by moaning.

As for the customer is always right. That has never been the case, it's a consumer dream. According to the law of most countries a.net have done everythign they can. They gave him 5 warning, the EULA is online to look at, if that user refuses to read what is put in front of him then it's the users fault.

So if you fail to read the 'Bridge Out' sign and drive your car off a cliff into a river. then it's not your fault? Thiir is no magic in car pop-up saying stop their is a massive hole ahead. But their are signs and if you read them then you can avoid disaster, if you don't then it's your own fault and don't go crying to other people about it.

noblepaladin · Jul 19, 2005, 05:35 PM // 17:35

I don't think A.Net needed to make popups. The LARGE warning should be obvious enough and the people who happen to ignore those warnings are the same ones who would have clicked yes without reading the small text on the popup. Developers try to making things fool proof, but it's not their job to make things idiot proof. They can't have popups after everything because the normal user would find the application extremely annoying.

And I don't think A.Net needs to make it a even number of times either. The more changes there are, the more beneficial it is to you. If you want an even number, pretend there are only 4 uses and never use the last one. If you cannot be bothered to read or control yourself from changing, it's your fault.

However, one valid point brought up by someone earlier is that people from non-American and non-European countries do not have a native realm to play on. Someone in Australia or China may want to try out both to test for best ping, etc, and their real life friends in the same country may be located in different realms. I think the best solution is that you have 5 changes in the first month (so you can explore and find the realm you like) and after the first month you are down to 1 change per month or something.

InFeStEd · Jul 19, 2005, 05:40 PM // 17:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by gabby2600

Ah so you speak to NC soft staff then on a regualr basis?

I said NCsoft controlls he accounts database. Arena.net has access to it but cannto change it. Arena.net has full access to the character database, so rollback are possible.

The acounts database holds your personal information, your access keys, and region details. By law in most countries this data has to be secures an only accessed by registered personel.

Do you really want every tom, dick and harry looking at your personall account details, having access to the key's you have paid for.

This secure accoutn system protect you the user from people selling your information. I would imagine on this system they only thing A.net can access is What region your in, and what you have access to. The key information is kept secret, as are your personal details.

This way those that control the accounts database are not the people your pissing of by moaning.

As for the customer is always right. That has never been the case, it's a consumer dream. According to the law of most countries a.net have done everythign they can. They gave him 5 warning, the EULA is online to look at, if that user refuses to read what is put in front of him then it's the users fault.

So if you fail to read the 'Bridge Out' sign and drive your car off a cliff into a river. then it's not your fault? Thiir is no magic in car pop-up saying stop their is a massive hole ahead. But their are signs and if you read them then you can avoid disaster, if you don't then it's your own fault and don't go crying to other people about it.

hmm, ok so regional changes are stored on a server not accessable by ANET. Well, maybe they should recruit a team that has access to it for issues like this one. Obviously it's happening and their system is not even close to 100%. Secondly, I don't know what country you are from or what video games you play, but for STEAM (CS and CS:Source), Ragnarok Online, WoW, and even D2, I have never had any problem requesting help with a blunder I have made. I recieved curt and prompt help in each case and was asked not to repeat my mistake and inform others to not as well. As in real life, about 80% of the time, whenever I buy something and have a problem with it, my whims are taken care of. I purchase a hamburger with cheese and it doesn't come with cheese.... "Sorry sir, here's a coupon for a free hamburger next time and here's your burger with cheese." Or, I order a hamburger and forget to ask for cheese. "Oh sorry sir, we can get that for you, just a moment." (mmmm hamburgers, it's lunch time.) Lastly, your bridge analogy. You better bet that if that bridge isn't a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing beacon of warnings(you have 3 chances left to switch countries), and that there isn't something physically stopping me from driving off that bridge(are you sure you want to switch countries? This is your last time!), I am getting a FAT settlement if I go over. (1)assuming I live :P 2)Yes this is rediculous, but according to settlements and from what I understand, if it is not well labelled, I would have grounds to sue.)

All said and done, I went and checked the warnings that come up and it is understandable that someone could miss them. I know all of us has experiance the gamers glazed eyes phenominom (SP) and I would even admit that at times, I could even miss it. Especially if I were multitasking, (game, phone, food) Now yes, i bet ANET doesn't have the time to help every tom, dick, sally, and sue but rather than just let these problems slide by, fix the core of the problem. I mean, a simple box that appears the last time or even every time, warning you of what you are doing would be a simple yet effective remedy.

InFeStEd · Jul 19, 2005, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by noblepaladin

I don't think A.Net needed to make popups. The LARGE warning should be obvious enough and the people who happen to ignore those warnings are the same ones who would have clicked yes without reading the small text on the popup. Developers try to making things fool proof, but it's not their job to make things idiot proof. They can't have popups after everything because the normal user would find the application extremely annoying.

And I don't think A.Net needs to make it a even number of times either. The more changes there are, the more beneficial it is to you. If you want an even number, pretend there are only 4 uses and never use the last one. If you cannot be bothered to read or control yourself from changing, it's your fault.

However, one valid point brought up by someone earlier is that people from non-American and non-European countries do not have a native realm to play on. Someone in Australia or China may want to try out both to test for best ping, etc, and their real life friends in the same country may be located in different realms. I think the best solution is that you have 5 changes in the first month (so you can explore and find the realm you like) and after the first month you are down to 1 change per month or something.

how bothersome would a popup box asking you to confirm be if it only happend 5 times? Thats just plain laziness.

Angelus Angel · Aug 25, 2005, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Lol if it makes you feel better i done the same but guess what i read about the 5 changes and still went..
The fun bit is as i went to the usa servers for the final time im now lagging like a bitch..
didnt have this problem before but hey what the hell time to go and buy a fresh copy and start again ... Least i will get both worlds ..